Model Engine Maker
Engines => From Kits/Castings => Topic started by: samc88 on December 06, 2021, 11:13:39 PM
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New project incoming, recently acquired a Stuart s50 kit from a friend, and since I'm in the process of upgrading my small mill with a DRO this seems a nice thing to make to get used to it. As a side note this is the Stuart engine I've always wanted to make but lack of a mill before meant I went for the 10V instead. This obviously means my loco project is on hold for a little while but its not abandoned. This should keep certain stationary engine casting fans happy too
I have a plan to make it more scale looking by removing the cast in bolts with real ones and instead of using bolts for the engine fasteners I'll use studs with one size smaller BA nuts (since I have a packet of them already and they look really good). If it goes well Id also like to have a go at some rope grooves too in the flywheel (I've got a spare flywheel if it doesn't go to plan).
Got some steel coming to finish the DRO on Thursday and a couple of bits for this engine coming this week so hopefully be able to make a start over the weekend.
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Very nice, look forward to seeing that progress. Do you have any posts on your DRO install? I remember you mentioning you were going to add that feature - it's a game changer, love the DRO on my mill. I always enjoy seeing peoples solutions to those kinds of installs - I am going to put one on my lathe soon.
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Very nice, look forward to seeing that progress. Do you have any posts on your DRO install? I always enjoy seeing peoples solutions to those kinds of installs - I am going to put one on my lathe soon.
I'll take a few pictures once I'm done, I've managed to do it without tapping anything on the machine which I'm happy with, taken a bit of head scratching as everything came with no instructions being a bit of an ebay special all the way from China. Looks good value for money though
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I built the S-50 many years ago I also milled off the cast in bolt heads and replaced them with the correct size bolts , the model looks much better with this modification .
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As promised, I made a start this weekend.
The base was first tidied up with a selection of files before pressing the granite chopping board/ surface plate into action with some wet and dry to flatten the bottom. Only took about an hour to take the rock out and get full contact all the way around. When done the relevant heights were all marked out with the height gauge.
After watching Ades workshop on youtube build his S50 I bought a piece of aluminium to act as a build plate for my engine, this was mounted on the mill and clamped down after being clocked in true. Once this was done the engine base was clamped to the plate, truing it up using a DTI on the crosshead rails to get an average being a casting.
Machining wise, the first thing to be done was to drill and tap for the mounting screws which was done to 4BA. Once that was done, I spot faced each mount one at a time and bolted the base down.
Next up was machining the cylinder bolting face, the quill DRO was excellent for this, touched the 8mm milling cutter onto the aluminium and set the DRO to 0, then machined it down until it read 1.5". Came out bang on when checked with my depth gauge so its reassuring my cheap DRO works properly. Similarly the crosshead rails were then machined to the correct height before machining the sides slightly to give me a reference surface if i have to clock it in again for some reason.
Finally i took off the false bolt heads in preparation for drilling and tapping for real studs and nuts which should look much nicer
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:ThumbsUp: :popcorn: Terry
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Had my first go at coordinate drilling using the new DRO today, it makes life a lot easier. Also used ny wiggler/ edge finder for the first time too, its really effective.
Firstly I found my datum point using the small wiggler (crankshaft centreline and the crosshead centre line).
Next I drilled the cylinder mounting holes 7BA clearance and then drilled and tapped the crosshead rails 7BA. The drawing doesnt quite match the casting but Ive left the hole positions as drawn as I've seen a few others built and it doesnt seem to cause an issue down the line when fitting the cylinder, plus you cant see them so not really a visual issue either when finished.
Next operation is to mill things to the correct width and drill and tap for the decorative bolts, Im trying to do as much as possible before disturbing the set up to drill and ream the crankshaft bore.
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Very good, neat work. We didn't have 'wigglers' when I learnt my stuff, relying on feeler gauges and cigarette papers instead! I wouldn't be without my gadget now, especially when using the 'Centre Find' facility on the Easson DRO! I use the 0.10 disc mainly.
John
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Very good, neat work. We didn't have 'wigglers' when I learnt my stuff, relying on feeler gauges and cigarette papers instead! I wouldn't be without my gadget now, especially when using the 'Centre Find' facility on the Easson DRO! I use the 0.10 disc mainly.
John
Thank you, its a long way off your beam engine though! Ive had this wiggler for ages, I think my brother bought it for me one christmas but I felt it too much of a faff to use when you just have to count the handwheels so did as you did with feeler gauges. Really enjoying myself getting used to the DRO, definitely a worthwhile upgrade
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This evenings job was to drill and tap the 7ba holes for the decorative studs that will be going in place of the kits cast bolt heads.
I discovered that a 4BA screw head was the same size as the round pads so I turned the dome flat in the lathe and used it as a pointer, once in the correct position I drilled and tapped 7BA. A gauge pin would be more solid but i would have to keep changing chucks which would get tiring after a while.
The bolts for the crankshaft pedestals were done by eye, placing an 8BA nut on top and positioning the drill until the position of the nut looked right (8BA as Im going for one size smaller nuts). Quite pleased with how this came out.
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Finishing the base.
First the sides were machined to the required width in the drawing using an 11mm ball nose cutter. It doesnt have to go down this far but thought i would to better match the casting.
Next up was the crankshaft bore. I dont have an angle plate but do have my old vertical slide. The base plate was clamped to this and then indicated to ensure it was lined up correctly.
Once that was done I used the wiggler to find the centre of the crankshaft, i first found one of the 7ba holes in the crosshead rail and worked back from that, similarly i set a datum point from the aluminium plate to give me the correct height if 1 15/16".
I noticed the kit doesnt have any provision for bearings which is a shame so Im going to make some out of bronze since i have some in stock. Therefore rather than making the holes 1/4" I enlarged them to 5/16' (as i have a reamer that size)
Next operation will be to make the crank bearings
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I like your crank bearing idea.
I’ve been thinking of retro-fitting my PM#3 with crank mains bearings.
Probably wont’ as it runs great as is, & i’m In the middle of a PM#5 build now & it’s proving to be a wee bit harder (for me) than the #3 was.
I’m enjoying your build!
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I like your crank bearing idea.
I’ve been thinking of retro-fitting my PM#3 with crank mains bearings.
Probably wont’ as it runs great as is, & i’m In the middle of a PM#5 build now & it’s proving to be a wee bit harder (for me) than the #3 was.
I’m enjoying your build!
Thanks Ted, got to say Im enjoying this one more than the 10V I did a few years ago, i think having a proper set up helps a lot, i only had a vertical slide when i did that
Sent from my SM-A127F using Tapatalk
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Crankshaft bushes.
The drawings would have you just put a hole straight in the cast iron but since i have some bronze to hand i decided to make some bushes. First the holes in the casting were measured with my small hole gauges, before the bronze was then turned to the right OD (.5 a thou over) and then parted off.
I didnt want to hammer the bushes in and its an awkward shape to hold in the vice with risk of damage so made a puller from an M6 bolt and a couple of nuts which worked really well, pulled the bushes in nicely. Once pressed in I passed the reamer through.
The supplied crankshaft steel is 3 thou undersize when measured so rattled a bit in the bushes. I did remember that I had some 1/4" silver steel which is bang on size which Ill be using instead for the crankshaft.
All thats left on this now is to drill the oil holes
I'm having to use attachments from now on as I've reached my upload limit on tapatalk without paying for it, they're all resized though
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Crankshaft and crankweb.
Crankshaft is pretty simple, just needs one end threaded 2BA and then cut to length. I did add a small mark with a centre drill though like full size ones have when they got made.
Crankweb starts off as 1.5" steel which I faced using a round nose tool to give me the radius on the centre boss. This was then drilled and tapped 2BA before parting off/ cutting off with a hacksaw.
This was then mounted on the shaft allowing me to turn to final thickness. Once done it was time for some marking out using my v block and height gauge, letting me mark the corner points of the angle for milling down. At the same time i marked the hole for the crankpin.
This was then milled down to size, mounted on the crankshaft with loctite and given a polish. I think ill carry on working down the crank assembly and make the eccentric sheave next
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You are really on a roll here - are you fortunate enough to have a lot of Shop time on your hands right now ?
:popcorn: :cheers:
Per
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You are really on a roll here - are you fortunate enough to have a lot of Shop time on your hands right now ?
:popcorn: :cheers:
Per
Just a couple of extra days hopefully. Im waiting for a PCR test to come back after testing positive for covid on a lateral flow test on Wednesday. Got no symptoms so making the most of having to take a couple of days off work.
Im also quite enthused by this now ive got my mill working properly with the DRO
Sent from my SM-A127F using Tapatalk
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Wow a whole lot of work going on in this thread. Some really nice work Sam….. :ThumbsUp:
:cheers:
Don
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Thank you Don, I'm really enjoying this one so far, hope to get some more done over the weekend
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Not much machining today although I did start on the eccentric sheave which ill finish off tomorrow. Decided to sort the decorative bits on the base out, mainly to protect it since its finished and will be to one side for a bit, you only have to turn your back 5 minutes before something rusts over here.
Painted with LMS maroon and Satin Black. Studs were made from 7BA stud bar and one size smaller nuts. Well worth the effort i think
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Not much to report as I forgot to take photos whilst machining but I got the eccentric sheave machined tonight. Quite a nice turning job in the 4 jaw.
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Ive made a fair bit if progress since the last update but typically Ive forgotten to update the thread
First up are the things i made but didnt have any progress shots, namely the eccentric strap (I got to use my new slitting saw for the first time which was fun!), the flywheel and the gland nuts.
Ive got a lot more photos of making the cylinder and a couple of other bits so Ill add a post for those later
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Cylinder basic machining
The first thing to do was to make up a mandrel to be a good fit for inside the cast cylinder bore, the other end was then turned to fit inside my jacobs chuck. This was done to get an easy alignment in my 4 jaw chuck.
Once set up the end was faced and then the cylinder bored to 5/8". With the bore done, i set the cylinder up in the mill and took it to the final overall length using the fly cutter.
Again using the fly cutter I took to port face down to size. Using a 5/16 bit of round stock in the bore allowed me to use the top of the vice as a datum for the bore centreline since the dimensions come from this point.
The ports were then opened up to the correct width and depth, something that Im quite happy with how they turned out.
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Cylinder other machining
Using the same 5/16" bar and a square i machined the bolting face to the required thickness. Then I did some co-ordinate drilling, I just love the DRO for this! When i did a test fit, it all bolted up perfectly on the first attempt which I was most pleased with!
With that done it was simple to machine the other bits flat and drill and tap them. I did do the passages but didnt have any photos of doing them, basically i milled the pocket in the top of the bore, aligned up the angle by eye and drilled through. Went a lot better than I thought it would.
My good fortune with the cylinder repaid itself with the steam chest, i machined it to size with a carbide end mill I got given but its completely chilled both sides, even a centre drill wouldnt go in. So abandoned that casting in favour of fabricating one from some 1/4" x 1/2" mild steel bar which Ill do later on.
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After the annoying chilled casting I decided to leave the valve gear for now and make the piston which is made out of brass, first it was turned to slightly under the bore diameter before grooving to fit a silicone oring. It was then tapped 5BA and parted off to size. With that done I made the piston rod which was easy, cut to length and thread both ends.
Lower cylinder cover was next, the register for the bore was turned to be a good fit and the hole for the piston rod was drilled too so they are both concentric to each other. OD was then turned to size before parting off. To hold it to machine the other side I bored a step into an old cast iron bushing I had in the spares box and loctited in place. This allowed me to finish off machining the other side. Pretty pleased with how its coming together now, i'll try and keep track of updating this thread as I go rather than one huge post after a while
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Now, you really have been busy since the last update :ThumbsUp:
I love the colour of the already painted bits :cheers:
Per
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Thanks Per :)
Its LMS Maroon and Satin black from Phoenix precision. Lovely stuff to work with
Sam
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Moving right along Sam - looking great. Fine parts, it will be a super engine, looking forward to that and following along with interest.
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Lower cylinder cover finished off this evening. First time trying out the pcd function on my mill too so did a trial run on aluminium piece of stock i had lying around. Then i broke out the coax indicator which just about fits in my mill to get the cover central before drilling the cover. Once that was done the cylinder was drilled and tapped 7ba.
The bolts will be replaced by studs and one size smaller nuts which should look a bit finer
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Not a lot on the cards tonight but I have swapped out the 7BA bolts for studs and one size smaller nuts which look a bit nicer I think. Studs always make it look more steam enginey i think
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Much nicer looking. :popcorn:
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Excellent work :praise2: :praise2: Shame about the chilled casting :( but that seems to be a risk. Apparently they can sometimes be annealed :thinking: I do agree that studs are much more full size practice.
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Great work as usual. Amazing how much difference using studs makes - just looks a whole let better.
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Thanks for the comments :)
More done tonight, I finished off the front cylinder cover and drilled the steam chest 7BA holes for the studs. Very happy with how this has come out, engine has plenty of compression and piston moves nicely. Only annoyance is i seem to be missing a steam chest stud which Ill make if the original doesnt turn up
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Had a pleasant evening machining the crosshead from a piece of 1/2" square brass.
First thing was to machine the height down in the mill before putting in the 4 jaw chuck in the lathe to turn the spigot and tap it 5BA. Once that was done i returned the part to the mill and drilled the cross hole with a 3/32 drill for the crosshead pin.
Next I machined the step down either side before finally milling the slot in the centre to take the connecting rod. Pretty pleased with how this one turned out
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Nice work! Good to see this progressing along.
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Had an enjoyable day in the shed making the conrod. The bit of flat bar in the kit was a bit scabby so I made this from 1/2" steel bar.
First op was to mill the flats, I really need to invest in a collet block. I used 2 clamps as a stop to ensure the flats were all at the same spot and a square to line everything up which worked really well.
Once that was done the centre was taken down to 1/4" before the tailstock was offset to turn the taper down to 3/16". To set the tailstock square again I used a blade between the 2 centres.
After the turning was complete the holes were drilled before then filing the radius by hand.
Ive gone a little different from the as drawn engine by including a phosphor bronze bush which will require a slightly modified crankpin which will be the next job.
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Some progress has been made, not as much as I'd like due to needing a new headgasket on the land rover.
Crankpin has been made as has the crosshead pin, guide rails and supports. Happily its still turning over freely even with all the extra bits fitted
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That's excellent - very nice work on that con rod. That engine is looking really good, I think it will make a very nice running engine.
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That's excellent - very nice work on that con rod. That engine is looking really good, I think it will make a very nice running engine.
Thanks Stuart, I think I'll tackle the steam chest next, looking forward to doing some soldering practice. Really looking forward to hooking the compressor up to it, cant resist spinning it over by hand now bits are connected!
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Absolutely - I know that feeling. How does it feel when you turn it over by hand? Probably pretty smooth looking at the quality of the parts made.
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Absolutely - I know that feeling. How does it feel when you turn it over by hand? Probably pretty smooth looking at the quality of the parts made.
It spins over really nicely with one finger, theres also plenty of compression when i put my finger over the steam ports so fingers crossed it should run okay. Ill try and do a vid when im in there next to show it turning over, I always forget
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Brilliant, that's exciting, that is going to be a great engine.
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As requested Stuart heres a video I put on youtube earlier [youtube1]https://youtu.be/JGt6xE-56RM[/youtube1]
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Looking good!! :popcorn:
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Thanks Chris :)
Little bit done tonight, I got the sides milled ready for silver soldering the new valve chest together, the chilled one is shown next to it to show hownit will look. The round features Ill make on the lathe and solder them in afterwards
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Thanks for sharing that video! Very well done, the engine looks like everything moves very smoothly. Nice job! :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:
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Valve rod was made up along with the nut and the slide valve finished with a needle file so the nut was a loose fit in it.
Once that was done I went to plan C for the steam chest and decided to make it from solid, mainly because I found a piece of 1/2" steel and my time is cheaper than silver solder. Was hacksawed roughly into shape and then milled to size, was quite an enjoyable process. The slot was then marked out ready for cutting out, im going to chain drill, then mill the slot flat and then probably just touch up the corners to be square with a file.
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Got the centre of the steam chest cut out tonight. I chain drilled around the area to come out and then used some files to get it to size, will do the bolt holes tomorrow and also the holes for the gland and valve spindle guide, my plan is to make these items on the lathe to be a press fit inside the chest
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Nice progress! Coming along very well indeed. I think your approach on the steam chest is very smart. That’s much better off as a machined piece rather than soldered. I’d have gone the same route.
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Thanks Stuart, Im quite enjoying machining it from solid, its nice drilling into the material knowing its the same throughout with no hard spots.
The main body of the steam chest was finished tonight, with the 4 clearance holes drilled and the 2 centre holes drilled and tapped to 7BA.
The holes for the gland and valve spindle were then drilled and reamed to 3/16 in one operation to keep them aligned. Im going to make the gland and spindle guide to be a light press fit (probably over the weekend as Ive got more boring things like stripping woodchip wallpaper taking up my time for the rest of this week
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Whilst the mill was set up with the drill chuck I drilled and tapped the valve chest cover of the S50. Just got to take the thickness down now. I did it this way round after spending ages machining the chest only to find it was too hard for my drills. This drilled really nicely and is already to size against the chest
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Looking very good indeed - looks well on the way to becoming a runner!
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Finished off the steam chest the other night. First i used my small hole gauges to check the size of the reamed hole either end so I could make the spindle guide and gland to be a light press fit. This worked out really well, I think I'd definitely do a steam chest this way again in future.
Only got the valve fork to do next and I have to do that a different way to whats in the kit as my 4 jaw doesnt go small enough for the square bar (I do however have some brass round stock which i can use and mill square)
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Looking great, not long now!
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That was a great approach to the steam chest - nice solution. We'll soon be seeing that flywheel spin over.
:popcorn: :popcorn: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:
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We have a runner!
Had a good evening on this, made up an inlet fitting for some tubing to go over and then machined up the valve fork from some 1/4" brass round rod (i forgot to take pics when machining but was a fun little piece to make.
Once that was done i set the position of the slide valve and gave it a try and it runs! Still a bit to do before I call it fully finished, got a couple of air leaks to sort around the glands, paint touch ups and the cladding etc amd a fiddle with the timing. Overall im very happy with it! Please excuse the creaking chair in the video, the camera microphone seems to like it
[youtube1]https://youtu.be/jf_29lQiQW0[/youtube1]
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Looks and sounds like it runs very nicely indeed. Congratulations! :cheers:
(I spy a couple of interesting looking airplane models in the background as well.)
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Running nicely! Always those last few things to get done, well done!
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That's great Sam! Runs really well, nice job all round. :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:
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The S50 will be my next engine, so this build thread was especially interesting. Great job! I was contemplating replacing the cast-in nuts in the base and after seeing the positive effect on your S50 that's definitely happening.
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Excellent! Wonderful feeling when it runs for the first time! :cheers:
Kim
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Thanks everyone, well pleased with how its running. Ill hopefully get it properly finished off this week once i get the land rover back together.
Yes Ron, thats my other hobby, 1/32 gloster gladiator and an Airco DH9a in the background. Usually do plastic modelling when it gets too late to be making noise in the shed
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Usually do plastic modelling when it gets too late to be making noise in the shed
Nice. An occasional hobby of mine also. :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:
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A bit late - but congratulations Sam - you have a nice runner :ThumbsUp: :cheers:
Per
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Finished! Other than a base, I dont get on with woodwork so that may be a future project in itself! Did the last few bits tonight, gland packing, valve chest studs, oil cups and cladding. Also touched up the paintwork in places, once thats dry properly Ill do a proper running vid and more pics in the finished gallery. Thanks for following along, got a toolmaking project next (hemingway metal folder) and then its back on my Tich project
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Very nice - that's an excellent engine, you must be well happy with that.
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Congratulations on this successful Stuart S 50.
I really like the red-brown color.
It would have been the right color for my Wolf Lokomobile.
Unfortunately I didn't find anything suitable at the time.
The factory color was then referred to as ox blood red.
Michael
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Following on samc88.... and yes that Royal Plum is a superb colour for the period
Just be careful & don't commit any Crime as we have your fingerprints! :ROFL:
Derek
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Thanks all, Im very pleased with how its worked out, Michael, the paint I used was LMS Maroon from Phoenix precision paints, always liked that colour, my loco will probably go in a similar colour scheme eventually