* Come and see ModelEngineMaker.com at the Midlands Model Engineering Exhibition 2026!

Author Topic: A possible solution for AGE owners.  (Read 445 times)

Offline Alyn Foundry

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1811
  • North Wales, Great Britain.
A possible solution for AGE owners.
« on: August 08, 2026, 07:42:05 pm »
Just to break the monotony of this forums obsession with steam engines I present a short video of a recent breakthrough I have had with my little BEECo ( affectionately known as Leek’s ) non compression, flame ignition gas engine.

I acquired this engine some 40 years ago and despite 100’s of hours tinkering trying various fuels I was never successful in seeing it running on anything but Hydrogen, or by replacing the open flame with a spark pug and high tension spark. As most are aware this particular gas is both expensive and not readily available here in the UK.

The BEECo version was made available in a variety of sizes and sold as casting sets from around the turn of the late 1900’s and into the 20’s. Mine being one of the last batches sold (  C 1920 ) They were very similar to the toys sold by various European manufacturers like Schoner and Ernst Planck.

So…. Back to the present.  The AGE as sold here in the UK  is a very close copy of the Schoner, right down to the eight spoke flywheels! I also know that they are just as reluctant to run on our cheaply available fuels. Here’s the solution, and the reason for my post. As many of you model engineers know Alyn foundry has produced quite a few scale models of engines that employ hot tube ignition. One of the key ingredients for their success is the ignition tube and its alloy combination. A high Nickel content, such as 316 stainless works the best. Several weeks ago I had the idea that this might actually work by using it for the flame port or as I like to term it, the touch hole. My engine had a hole threaded to 1/8” BSP and I tried many different materials for the insert, over many years. A few examples still retain their originally drilled port, But that’s a different story.

It worked a treat with sustained running for several minutes. I then tried different diameters with 1 mm being the smallest before failing to ignite, 1.5 mm seems to be the optimal diameter to get the most force against the piston.
The AGE differs from both the BEECo and Schoner by trying to use the auxiliary air valve to perform two different functions. My engine has a face cam that operates an exhaust valve mounted in the centre of the cylinder head. The air valve mounted in the end of the cylinder floats in a slightly open position but is blown shut the instant the engine fires. The sudden expansion of gasses acts against the piston forming the very short power stroke. I also wonder if this modification might enable the owners of Bisschop patent models that were produced a few decades ago?

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARZ-_W8DbvY" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARZ-_W8DbvY</a>


 :cheers:  Graham.

Online Jasonb

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11462
  • Surrey, UK
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2026, 07:51:39 pm »
Now all we need is for you or one of the boys to take a full set of measurements so you can add one to the Alyn range, maybe just a new cylinder and head attached to a Nattie frame and flywheels would be a good basis for a small model.

Offline Sanjay F

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2641
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2026, 07:52:05 pm »
Looks  very cool, I like the set up with the little gas torch. It seems very happy chugging away and makes a great sound!  :popcorn: :ThumbsUp:
Best regards

Sanjay

Offline Sanjay F

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2641
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2026, 07:53:26 pm »
Now all we need is for you or one of the boys to take a full set of measurements so you can add one to the Alyn range, maybe just a new cylinder and head attached to a Nattie frame and flywheels would be a good basis for a small model.

Sold! I'll take one  ;D
Best regards

Sanjay

Offline Alyn Foundry

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1811
  • North Wales, Great Britain.
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2026, 03:58:17 pm »
Now all we need is for you or one of the boys to take a full set of measurements so you can add one to the Alyn range, maybe just a new cylinder and head attached to a Nattie frame and flywheels would be a good basis for a small model.

Effectively that’s already been done Jason.  The original design for the R.LE. came from the Leek engine in 1986. The only difference being the cylinder mounting method. Back then I only had a wee Tyzak lathe and a battered Walker-Turner pillar drill. All flat faces were produced manually using a quality flat file. A milling machine was considered a luxury. So instead of the arched cylinder mounting I chose a flange style.

Back to the present the economy is so crippled that there’s little spare cash available to spend on what would be considered a luxury. The photo is of R.L.E. number 103 before being converted to the water hopper cooling that everyone is now familiar with.

 :cheers:  Graham.


Offline Alyn Foundry

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1811
  • North Wales, Great Britain.
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2026, 04:00:06 pm »
Looks  very cool, I like the set up with the little gas torch. It seems very happy chugging away and makes a great sound!  :popcorn: :ThumbsUp:

The gas torch fixture, if you can call it that 😂 was used to steady the flame at the correct position. Mr Hand was just a little too unsteady for the job. I have ordered a couple more torches from eBay so that a custom made bracket can be fitted, similar to the original design.

Watch this space for future developments.

Seen in the Netherlands a couple of years ago. A beautifully preserved, and original condition BEECo

Addendum…. The photo is in fact the largest Schoner engine the 154/2
GRC

 :cheers:  Graham.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2026, 07:31:56 pm by Alyn Foundry »

Offline Dave Otto

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5339
  • Boise, Idaho USA
    • Photo Bucket
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2026, 05:31:20 pm »
Chugging away nicely Graham.
So the flame is pulled into the cylinder through the hole? If so, why do you think that the material choice would have any effect on the running?

<<Just to break the monotony of this forums obsession with steam engines>>  :lolb: Just don't be posting any hot air engines here, there really doesn't seem to be much interest in them either. ;D

Dave

Offline Alyn Foundry

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1811
  • North Wales, Great Britain.
Re: A possible solution for AGE owners.
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2026, 06:57:39 pm »
Chugging away nicely Graham.
So the flame is pulled into the cylinder through the hole? If so, why do you think that the material choice would have any effect on the running?

<<Just to break the monotony of this forums obsession with steam engines>>  :lolb: Just don't be posting any hot air engines here, there really doesn't seem to be much interest in them either. ;D

Dave

That’s the thousand dollar question Dave! But after trying many different materials, and I’m not exaggerating, this is the first time she’s run like this on propane. I took the engine to the Anson engine museum many years ago and used their supply of Hydrogen that they use for the carrier flame engines, she went like a rocket! Period advertisements suggest a running speed of 500+ RPM. 
Currently the RPM seen in the attached video is about the maximum she will do, I’m assuming it’s the much slower propagation speed of the gas used against the original fuel?

HOT AIR ENGINES, ICE’s ? God forbid….  :lolb: :lolb:


 :cheers:  Graham.

 

SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal