Author Topic: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines  (Read 28036 times)

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2020, 12:02:18 AM »
If you turn the graduated dial on the handwheel (loosens/tightens with the thin knob on the end) so that you can see the setscrew underneath

This is going nowhere.

I can't turn the graduated dial relative to the handwheel at all (lathe cross slide only but I find all the other handwheels to be hard to turn relative to the graduated dial).
As it turns out, it's located such that I can see where a set screw would be. But no allen key fits. I'm suspecting there is no set screw.
I've tried imperial and metric (although I suspect all the set screws, bolts, etc) are imperial. No?
For that matter, I don't see a setscrew on any graduated dial/handwheel.

As for that thin knob - I can turn it on all handwheels except the lathe cross slide. I'm suspecting that's the problem. Pliers?


I'm tempted to take pliers to the thing but to what end?
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
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Offline Dave Otto

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #31 on: February 11, 2020, 12:48:59 AM »
Zee,

Yes the thin black knob is what releases the graduated dial, I suppose that it could be so tight that you can't move it by hand. If that is the case you don't have much choice but to use a tool on it.
I would attempt to pad it with a cloth or something it may not take much to break it loose. Align the hole in the graduated dial with the hole in the hand wheel then use a 3/32 Allen wrench to loosen the hand wheel.

Dave

Offline Flyboy Jim

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #32 on: February 11, 2020, 01:00:38 AM »
If you turn the graduated dial on the handwheel (loosens/tightens with the thin knob on the end) so that you can see the setscrew underneath

This is going nowhere.

I can't turn the graduated dial relative to the handwheel at all (lathe cross slide only but I find all the other handwheels to be hard to turn relative to the graduated dial).
As it turns out, it's located such that I can see where a set screw would be. But no allen key fits. I'm suspecting there is no set screw.
I've tried imperial and metric (although I suspect all the set screws, bolts, etc) are imperial. No?
For that matter, I don't see a setscrew on any graduated dial/handwheel.

As for that thin knob - I can turn it on all handwheels except the lathe cross slide. I'm suspecting that's the problem. Pliers?


I'm tempted to take pliers to the thing but to what end?

Zee,

The Allen wrench that fits my dials is a 3/32. I think it came with my equipment.

The thin black knob on the hand wheel on my cross slide only turns about 1/4 turn from lock to unlock. It might be worth trying to gently turn it counter clockwise with some pliers.

I'm sorry to hear you're having to deal with these issues. Both my lathe and mill worked great right out of the box. It looks like Sherline may be falling down on their set up procedure.

Jim


Sherline 4400 Lathe
Sherline 5400 Mill
"You can do small things on big machines, but you can do small things on small machines".

Online crueby

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #33 on: February 11, 2020, 01:25:31 AM »
Yup, the setscrews are all imperial. If that knob wont turn on a brand new machine, I would call sherline and see what they say. Between that and the backlash star wheel, sounds like someone there drank lunch that day. Sure that they will stand behind it.

Offline Mike R

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #34 on: February 11, 2020, 03:00:45 AM »
:help:

Check me...

The choice would be between series and parallel.
In series there is more inductance and less current per phase.
In parallel there is less inductance and more current per phase (motors get hotter but higher speed is possible).
It's not clear to me which provides more torque at low or high speed. I'm thinking parallel.

I'm leaning towards serial. The current per phase is half that in parallel. What do you think?


You'll want to use the parallel wiring if your drivers are capable.  The lower inductance and higher current are both beneficial, the current helps with more torque and the lower inductance will achieve greater speeds (or more torque at equivalent speeds compared to series).
The trade off is higher current uses more power - but this is not the concern here, especially as when a motor is "idle" on a cnc it may not be actively moving but might very well be actively holding position..

Mike

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #35 on: February 11, 2020, 12:50:48 PM »
Thanks Dave, Jim, and Chris. I took pliers to the thin knob and managed to loosen it. Finally found the set screw. It turned out my 3/32 didn't quite fit which fooled me but I found another and managed to loosen it. Attached picture shows the ring with the zero mark. The small bolt holding the ring to the cross slide is completely loose.

I'm thinking that ring should be tight up against the cross slide and that would take care of the issue.

Thanks Mike. I'm still not sure.
In serial, the current per phase is 2.1A with an inductance of 8.8mH.
In parallel, the current per phase is 4.2A with an inductance of 2.2mH.
The Gecko provides 3.5A. The power supply is rated 48V, 12.5A.
Now, I believe those currents are a bit bogus. The RMS values are about 70% of that. (1.47 for serial, 2.94 for parallel).
With 4 motors running, it looks like either way the 12.5A power supply will do.
A bit more concerning is the inductance. Gecko documentation shows the equation 32 * sqrt(inductance) = power supply voltage.
2.2mH gives 47.5V (which is within the power supply).
8.8mh gives 94.9V (which is twice the power supply).
It's been many many years since I've played in this arena so I'm not sure about anything.

Whether serial or parallel, the same 4 motor leads are used with the only difference being how the other 4 motor leads are connected and they can be connected at the motor.
So I can try both ways easily enough. I just don't want to blow the driver.

BTW the colors of the motor leads mean nothing. Need to go by where the wires are connected to the motor.
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
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Online crueby

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #36 on: February 11, 2020, 02:09:50 PM »
That ring should be tight, definitely.

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #37 on: February 11, 2020, 02:43:35 PM »
Getting to and tightening up the ring with the zero mark seems to have done the trick.
Backlash appears to be 4-5 thou so I'll leave that alone for now.
Thanks for all the help!

As for the mill's Y axis lock, it doesn't seem to do anything. Not sure why but I can't get it turned in enough to slow/stop the axis.
I'll try making that alternative stop Jim and Chris mentioned early in the thread.
That knob didn't come with the machine. It was replaced with a longer one that came with the axis cover.

I had used a promo code when I ordered the Sherline stuff with the expectation it applied 20% off my entire order.
Checking showed I got something just over 16%.
Called Sherline yesterday and they said it applied to the machines only. But they had (mistakenly) applied it also to the CNC retro-fit kits.
But I have an email from the salesperson confirming it was to be applied to the entire order.
Sent an email (with copy of previous email) to the salesperson to check on that.
The difference in cost is over $100 so I'm interested in getting that back.
The person yesterday said the discount was applied automatically by their system so maybe there's a problem in their software or the salesperson was wrong.

Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
"To work. To work."
Zee-Another Thread Trasher.

Online crueby

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #38 on: February 11, 2020, 03:52:58 PM »
Glad you got the backlash sorted!  The ad with the code does say the discount is on machine packages, not everything, still would be a great deal.


Looking forward to seeing some swarf!

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #39 on: February 11, 2020, 04:15:39 PM »
Glad you got the backlash sorted!  The ad with the code does say the discount is on machine packages, not everything, still would be a great deal.

Could be although that's not what the salesperson's email says. But, she may have boo-booed.
I won't hold her to it if that's the case. I didn't find out about the discount until later so it's kind of a bonus anyway.

Looking forward to seeing some swarf!

What? Got none of your own?  ;D
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
"To work. To work."
Zee-Another Thread Trasher.

Online crueby

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #40 on: February 11, 2020, 05:00:07 PM »
...

Looking forward to seeing some swarf!

What? Got none of your own?  ;D
How many buckets-full should I send down to decorate your workbench?   :LittleDevil:

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #41 on: February 11, 2020, 05:39:46 PM »
...

Looking forward to seeing some swarf!

What? Got none of your own?  ;D
How many buckets-full should I send down to decorate your workbench?   :LittleDevil:

None! One (or more) of your elves may be hiding in it and I've already kicked out enough of them.  ;D

I got the full discount from Sherline. I think the salesperson made a mistake in saying the promo code applied to the entire order but she honored it anyway.
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
"To work. To work."
Zee-Another Thread Trasher.

Offline Flyboy Jim

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #42 on: February 11, 2020, 07:12:36 PM »

I got the full discount from Sherline. I think the salesperson made a mistake in saying the promo code applied to the entire order but she honored it anyway.

 :ThumbsUp:  :whoohoo:

Did you talk to Kat? I've ordered so much stuff from them that we're on a first name basis.  :naughty:

I was going to send them a "nastygram" telling them they need to set their machines up better before shipping, but now I won't.  :) At least not until you get your refund.  :thinking:

Jim
Sherline 4400 Lathe
Sherline 5400 Mill
"You can do small things on big machines, but you can do small things on small machines".

Offline kvom

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #43 on: February 11, 2020, 07:49:33 PM »
I used to know slightly a woman named Pam who worked for Sherline and went to the shows from time to time.  She's a great machinist; I wonder if she's still there.

Online crueby

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Re: From Manual to CNC - Sherlines
« Reply #44 on: February 11, 2020, 07:50:34 PM »
I used to know slightly a woman named Pam who worked for Sherline and went to the shows from time to time.  She's a great machinist; I wonder if she's still there.
I've talked with a number of the folks there over the years, always very helpful with questions.