Author Topic: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine  (Read 44591 times)

Offline Craig DeShong

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #495 on: October 18, 2021, 02:43:29 PM »
Nice job Kirk.  I know you've worked had to get there.  :ThumbsUp:
Craig
The destination motivates us toward excellence, the journey entertains us, and along the way we meet so many interesting people.

Online kvom

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #496 on: October 19, 2021, 07:05:10 AM »
After some disassembly to replace temporary fasteners the engine again became balky.  I've been in Italy traveling the entire month of October but will  be home for more struggles in a week.

Offline fumopuc

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #497 on: October 19, 2021, 08:34:42 AM »
Kirk, I am sure you will find and solve the problem of the balky engine.


What was seen at the video already is impressive in my eyes.
It is running slow and smooth already.
A pleasure to watch.
Have fun in Italy, could be very nice there now , warm and not crowded anymore.
Kind Regards
Achim

Offline RichardHed

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #498 on: October 30, 2021, 02:36:13 AM »
I will be picking up a set of castings at NAMES for this engine.  The origins are from Historic Models and Reproductions from whom I got the castings for the Joy engine.  The plans and castings are now owned by Downriver Tools.  From their website:

Quote
- Improved Green Automatic Cut-Off Engine

This horizontal steam engine castings and drawings kit is based on the original automatic steam cut-off engine design by Nobel Green in 1838. The model has a 1 1/2 inch bore, 3 inch stroke and the flywheel is 11 ˝ inches diameter.

This engine, built by the Providence Steam Engine Company in Providence, Rhode Island, incorporated variable steam cut-off several years before George Corliss patented his famous variable cut-off Corliss valve gear.  Our model is based on a 150 HP, 17 inch bore and 36 inch stroke Improved Green Automatic cut-Off Engine that has been restored and preserved by the New England Wireless and Steam Museum in East Greenwhich, RI.

Green’s engine design used what has been known as a detachable valve-gear.  The detachable valve-gear varies the steam cut-off point by using the engine governor to raise or lower trip points that operate levers to open the steam inlet valves.  The higher the trip point, the longer the steam inlet valve stays open allowing more steam into the engine’s cylinder.   The detachable valve gear was designed by Frederick Sickels and patented in 1841.  Sickels was only interested in the marine applications of his valve gear and sold the rights to use his patent on land based engines to the Providence Steam Engine company.  Then, when George Corliss introduced his variable cut-off valve gear in the late 1840’s, the Providence Steam Engine Company sued Corliss for patent infringement.

The court battle between George Corliss and the Providence Steam Engine Company raged on for over 10 years and became a landmark court case over what can and cannot be patented.  In the course of the court battle, Corliss won an injunction preventing the Providence Steam Engine Company from building and selling the Green designed engine.  The court case was finally settled in Corliss’ favor and Corliss’ original patent was extended by the US patent office on the basis that the law suits had prevented Corliss from benefiting from his patent.

In 1869, the Corliss valve gear patents finally expired and the Providence Steam Engine Company began producing the Green engine again.  The Green Engine was given some minor upgrades and changes and then introduced as the “Improved” Green Automatic Cut-Off Engine even though it was basically the same engine Noble Green designed in 1838. 

Specifications:

Scale: 1 inch = 1 foot (1:12)
Cylinder: 1-1/2 inch bore x 3 inches stroke
Flywheel: 11-1/2 inches diameter
Overall size: 22-1/2 inches x 12 inches x 12 inches high

I suspect this will prove a good challenge.  The photo below is from their website and represents the only example I've seen running (twice at NAMES).  I don't know the builder's name, but he likes to surface grind as much of the parts as possible.  Mine will look a bit different color wise, and probably not as finely built.  I purchased the plans a year ago so I've had some time to get an idea where the problems will be.

I've been looking for plans for this improved Greene.  Do you know where they can be purchased?

Online kvom

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #499 on: October 30, 2021, 11:42:29 AM »
Historic Models and Reproductions is in business but I have some major health issues that have slowed me down a bit  and the foundry that I currently use is slow to fill my current orders .I do have a few engine casting sets in stock though .Jeff
my email jeffreylehn@comcast.net

Jeff likely has a set of plans for you.  I've supplied Dennis, the original draftsman, with some corrections during my build.  The plans are supplied as PDFs.  This engine would be quite difficult to build without castings, so plans minus castings are mainly useful for assessing the difficulty.  I was provided with a set of Solidworks models in advance of my purchasing the castings;  I've found these extremely useful.


Offline jeff l

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #500 on: October 30, 2021, 07:21:54 PM »
I would sell the prints for this engine printed on paper even tough it's something that I hate to do .
Also I would sell individual castings if the builder felt that he or she would fabricate some of the items instead of machining them from castings .As Kirk said the engine would be difficult to build without the castings .

Offline RichardHed

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #501 on: December 15, 2021, 07:03:41 PM »
Is it possible to get the plans by email instead of  by paper?

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #502 on: December 15, 2021, 07:22:57 PM »
Is it possible to get the plans by email instead of  by paper?

See post #499 just above "The plans are supplied as PDFs"

Best to just e-mail Jeff about availability and costings.

Online kvom

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Re: Greene Automatic Cutoff Steam Engine
« Reply #503 on: December 16, 2021, 10:27:24 PM »
I would sell the prints for this engine printed on paper even tough it's something that I hate to do .
Also I would sell individual castings if the builder felt that he or she would fabricate some of the items instead of machining them from castings .As Kirk said the engine would be difficult to build without the castings .

The "critical" castings are the cylinder block, flywheel, and frame.  The cylinder block has cores;  I found via using the Solidworks cross section tool that it could be built from two pieces of stock so that the core voids could be machined in each half that are later mated precisely.  The flywheel is 11" diameter, but it might be possible to find a similar casting or be built up.  The frame would be difficult in metal without 3D CNC, but might be possible via 3D printing of a sufficiently rigid material to which crosshead guides could be attached.  From casting it is the most difficult to machine for me at least.