Author Topic: Stuart Major Beam Engine  (Read 86989 times)

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #480 on: August 08, 2022, 09:01:44 PM »
Reassembly is taking much longer than expected and I'm becoming slightly excited just like Michael S  :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:.

Some folk aren't interested......

RKNG3158 by Andy, on Flickr

The con rod has been refitted and the engine spins rounds quite freely. This afternoon I spent a lot of time connecting a 1/8" diameter copper tube to the drain cock fitted below the valve chest. Way back in Reply 270 July 6th 2020 et seq, I covered how to fit the valve rod in the valve chest by boring and and threading a 7/16" hole in the bottom of the chest so that the valve rod can be passed through then sealed with a threaded plug. As I intend to run the engine on steam it seemed a drain cock would be useful beneath the steam chest.

My concern is that condensate could collect in the bottom of the valve chest and cause corrosion. Should the drain cock prove to be impractical it is easily removed.

  S Major 1655 by Andy, on Flickr

I used a Stuart Turner Union Cock because I haven't had much success with my home made plug cocks. However there wasn't much space to get the necessary bends in the copper tube. A hole could be drilled in the baseplate directly below the cock but I didn't want to have another pipe running through the base or take the engine apart again to drill the baseplate.

The tight bends from the drain cock are followed by a curve around the base of the cylinder.

 S Major 1660 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 1658 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 1659 by Andy, on Flickr

Have yet to decide where to route the tubes after leaving the bedplate, that can be done later.

 Andy

Online Kim

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #481 on: August 09, 2022, 12:17:25 AM »
Reassembly is taking much longer than expected and I'm becoming slightly excited just like Michael S  :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:.

Some folk aren't interested......

RKNG3158 by Andy, on Flickr

Well, I'd say that's WAY more important than reassembling your engine.  You can reassemble engines ANY time.  You have to take advantage of that kind of playtime when you can get it though!  That time is precious! :)

As for the drain cock in the steam chest, I can't tell you whether it's necessary or not, but I think it looks great!

Kim

Offline Michael S.

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #482 on: August 09, 2022, 04:36:52 AM »
good morning Andy,
I like your workshop. Every corner is well equipped!
When my nieces (5 and 9 years old) come to visit my workshop, I always hear: boring..........

At the great Stuart No. 5A is also a valve at the bottom of the steam box. The machine only runs with steam and the condensate water can be easily drained off when the machine is cold.

Michael

Offline Jo

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #483 on: August 09, 2022, 06:31:19 AM »
Looks like they were under strict instructions not to touch  :disappointed: My Nephew started life like that now he's 18 and his mother complains bitterly that he does not show interest in doing anything  :-X I recall taking him to the local show one year, there were old cars, stationary engines, traction engines and even a full sized tank someone was letting the kiddies go into - the only thing he was interested in was having a burger and even then his mother was telling him what he mustn't do   :facepalm2:

Showing us the cylinder drain cock made me think: Most model steam engine designers don't add drain cocks so clearly are not designing their models for running on steam  :thinking:

Jo
Enjoyment is more important than achievement.

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #484 on: August 09, 2022, 07:26:44 AM »
Plenty of full size that don't have drains on the valve chest, look at many single cylinder traction engines and they only have drains on the cylinder ends such as my Fowler. Maybe the steam carries the condensate through when the cylinder cocks are open rather than it sitting in the bottom of the chest? If you are designing a model to a specific prototype then most would try to match the original.

It's also possible to have a remote cock on the end of a pipe when space is a bit tight.

Offline Michael S.

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #485 on: August 09, 2022, 09:17:07 AM »
I think with steam tractors the steam box is directly on the boiler and therefore always hot during operation. As a result, little condensate occurs.

With an external supply of steam, a lot of condensate comes to the machine, which is also still cold. With the drain valve, the steam can be preheated in the cylinder and the steam box and drained at the same time.

Michael

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #486 on: August 09, 2022, 10:05:33 AM »
Applies to stationary engines just as much with plenty not having them, things like my Tidman organ engine, Cameron Pump and the Easton and Anderson Beam engine all had cylinder drains on the full size but none had chest drains so I just went for the best representation of the original when I designed mine and did not fit chest drains.


Offline john mills

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #487 on: August 09, 2022, 10:08:46 AM »
My stuart 5a has a drain on the valve chest and it helps with initial heating    on the full size stationary  that i  run  quite a few of them
have drains on the valve chests   the twin cylinder piston valve engines all have drains on the valve chamber  which Make warming up much better  .any  that don't have  drains on the valve chest take longer to get hot  if they did not have any drains at all they would not be very good to run on steam  even when the drain cocks are only small it is not easy to get condensation out to let steam heat the cylinder for turning over for starting.
john

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #488 on: August 09, 2022, 11:49:42 AM »
Hi Kim, yes indeed precious time, they are my grandchildren, and as you said Jo told not to touch things by my son.

I used to own a Merryweather Valiant Steam Pump that had a remote drain valve for the valve chest as Jason suggested, in this case remote because it was much safer away from the motion and hot boiler. The drain point is arrowed in the following picture.

Drain by Andy, on Flickr

Remote drain cock.

Flywheel by Andy, on Flickr

Me steaming the Merryweather at the annual Birmingham Science Museum Steam Rally in 1992 when the original museum was in Newhall Street. I think I saw Graham 'Alyn Foundry' with some of his engines at one of those rallies.

At Birmingham Science Museum Rally 1992 by Andy, on Flickr

The engine just before I sold it about ten years ago.

On it's trolley by Andy, on Flickr

The bronze water pump, it used two five inch diameter leather washers.

Pump by Andy, on Flickr

Merryweather in action at the Birmingham Society of Model Engineers. I was using the canvas hose for the first time but it was full of holes and John Walker got soaked :lolb: Fortunately the Fire Brigade rigged up one of their hoses.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oYLkqgjMrI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oYLkqgjMrI</a>

Excuse me for going 'off piste'.
I agree with Jo that many model engineers don't want to run their engines on steam, it is messy and in the case of a Stuart Major a fair sized boiler might be required which is why I built a 6" Vertical Boiler.

 https://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,5434.0.html

My plan is to pair the boiler with the Major it's just taken years longer than I imagined.

 Andy
 

Offline RReid

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #489 on: August 09, 2022, 03:22:54 PM »
Quote
Showing us the cylinder drain cock made me think: Most model steam engine designers don't add drain cocks so clearly are not designing their models for running on steam  :thinking:
Perhaps, but not necessarily. Small engines can be happy enough just blowing the condensate up the stack. The 1/32 scale live steamer in my avatar is one example of an engine that runs on steam without any drain cocks. But if it were bigger they would be easier to add and I would want them.
Regards,
Ron

Offline Alyn Foundry

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #490 on: August 09, 2022, 04:03:11 PM »
Andy, you said….

“ it’s just taken years longer than I imagined “

I’ve just realised that my Brayton Ready-Motor project has entered its 18th year….

I’m probably partially to blame for some of the time you lost but you did end up with three beautifully presented models!!
Oops, is it 5 ??

 :cheers: Graham

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #491 on: August 09, 2022, 06:10:44 PM »
Ah yes Graham, the Retlas, Robinson HA, Inverted Chuk and Allman were all started and completed while building the Major plodded along. I also have Robinson Chippy castings and another Chuk to start. My RLE and Gardner O Type were completed before I treated myself to the Major castings as a retirement present.

Did you exhibit at Birmingham Science Museum Stationary Engine rally about 30 years ago, we were in a yard at the back of the museum ? I’m sure someone was there with Alyn Foundry engines

Andy
« Last Edit: August 09, 2022, 10:15:03 PM by Chipmaster »

Offline Alyn Foundry

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #492 on: August 10, 2022, 10:55:50 AM »
You’ve forgotten about your beautiful Retlas dynamo Andy.  :)

No, not me, a little too far South. I’m guessing at Martin Lorenzo? He used to visit another venue, something to to with historic buildings??

 :cheers: Graham.

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #493 on: August 11, 2022, 12:07:43 PM »
Ok Graham perhaps it was Martin Lorenzo, he certainly exhibited at the Avoncroft Museum of Buildings around 15 years ago when our club (Wychavon Oil Engine & Preservation Society) used to put on a stationary engine rally there every year.
Andy

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #494 on: August 12, 2022, 09:55:40 PM »
Having fitted the cast iron piston rings for the first time I have been concerned by the added friction which was rather more than I expected. However, they are the rings supplied with the kit and I gapped them appropriately.
After the parallel motion was re-assembled I'd be able to judge whether the engine was too tight.

Assembling the parallel motion was a real pain. I made all the parts according to the drawings, perhaps I should have simplified things. I reckon two pairs of hands would have been so useful. The small bronze split bearings kept falling out from one side as I grappled with the other. It's remarkable how far these pesky little bits can travel after landing on the floor. Anyway I managed to fit it together without wrecking the paintwork but it took about three hours including searching for bits on the floor.

 S Major 1663 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 1666 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 1665 by Andy, on Flickr

Here's a YouTube video of the current state of play taken this evening, you can probably see the slowing of the movement as the piston travels up and down in the cylinder.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFSk9Patb4Y" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFSk9Patb4Y</a>

I'll have the engine running like that while I do other jobs in the garage over the weekend.

Andy


 

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