Help finding the original dimensions for the Fowler BB1

[longtangerine]

Hey everyone. Basically what the title reads. I tried to find them on my own and there wasn´t any info to be found, besides from the dimensions for scale model engines. Not what I was looking for at all... if there's any source that y'all might have at hand then i'd very much appreciate them, a lot really And maybe if this isn´t too much then I could also use some help with finding blueprints for this engine too. I already did manage to find a couple of ones way back from 1966 by the good ol' John Haining with the help of someone that I really give my gratitude to, and if there's more out there that could aid me further then that'd be amazing.

Thanks in advance,

longtangerine

[Jo]

There are a lot of Measurements on a BB1. You need to be more specific.

The Steam Plough club in the UK did a book with a good set of measurements and can probably confirm if it is still the University of Reading that the hold the original drawings.

Jo

[Jasonb]

MERL (Museum of English Rural Life) holds the Fowler archive and that has a number of BB1 drawings as well as many of the generic items that were used on more than one typ eof engine.

You should be able to contact them for a list and then order copies.

https://merl.reading.ac.uk/collections/john-fowler-co-leeds-ltd/

The Haining design is what the model aircraft people call "stand off scale" in as mauch a sit looks like a BB1 from a distance but up close there is a lot of simplification. This applies to most of his engines.

[mikemill]

There are members who deride John Haining’s designs, whist they are entitled to their opinions they have not built a Fowler Plough.

I bought a set of castings from John some 40 years ago and successfully built a plough to his design, and it works very well.

Mike

[mikemill]

There is a very usefull book. Fowler Steam Cultivating machinery 1900-1930. By G.F.A.Gilbert.  ISBN 0 9508480 2 6

It has drawings of a BB1 and lots of usefull referance pictures.

Mike

[Jasonb]

I mentioned the shortcomings of the Haining Darwings as the OP said he specifically wanted original sizes and should therefore be wary of the Haining drawings he says he has.

Compared to the A7 Fowler that I built which is very true to the original Hainings engines are a long way off . I do have a set of Superba castings aging and having started to look at the front end and redrawing it as I not finding a single part that did not need alteration lost some interest.

I suppose it depends what the individual wants, myself I like a bit of correct detal where possible. These days with most of us having far better equipped workshops and research just a click away you don't have to settle for building to a 60yr old desing.

[crueby]

You may also want to check out the Traction Talk Forum website, lots of people there with a mix of real and model traction engines and information.

[Jo]

The OP seems to have gone quiet. I suspect because there is no such thing as a free set of drawings available on the Web to 3D print a Ploughing engine.

I would start with a basic Farmer's traction engine rather than the complexities of a steam Plough. Try accessing "Scale model traction engine building, featuring "Minnie" available from the internet archive: https://archive.org/details/scalemodeltracti0000maso/page/n235/mode/2up

Jo

[longtangerine]

The OP seems to have gone quiet. I suspect because there is no such thing as a free set of drawings available on the Web to 3D print a Ploughing engine.

I would start with a basic Farmer's traction engine rather than the complexities of a steam Plough. Try accessing "Scale model traction engine building, featuring "Minnie" available from the internet archive: https://archive.org/details/scalemodeltracti0000maso/page/n235/mode/2up

Jo

Nope, i'm still here. I was just sleeping lol. Timezones. I don't really plan to 3D print the BB1 anytime soon actually, because what I had in mind was just modelling it in detail and leaving it as that. Yet another reason of why I chose the BB1 was because I wanted a real challenge despite it being the first of my models. I'm gonna go and check out the sources that y'all listed that i´m very grateful for, and I should also say that thanks for offering me an alternative, even if it wasn´t what I was trying to do.

Edit: Also, is there perhaps any chance you could tell me more about that book you mentioned? And maybe the drawings too, please. I need to be sure of what i'm saying when I go contact the folks over at that club, so i'd be really grateful for a bit of guidance from yours.

Thanks,

longtangerine

[Jasonb]

The book Jo links to would really only be of use if you wanted to build a model traction engine, being a small model it has to have some compromises so is not a scale representation of full size but does build into a nice small model. A better book these days on making model engine is "Model Traction Engine Design & Construction" by Edward Georege but again won't give what you want.

There are two (and a bit) books that will have more information. The First is "The Story of The Steam Plough Works" by Michael  R Lane. this covers the history and production of the Fowler factory from the very early ploughing engines until internal combustion replaced the steam engine. Lots of photos and data but few drawings so again of limited use.

The other book is "Traction engine Design and Construction" and the acompaning illustrarted Supplement by G F A Gilbert but again neither have much about the BB1. There are a couple of part of the boiler and some detail of the winding drum in the suppliment but not a lot. bThe main book does have a general arrangement side view but at a very reduced size so it is hard to read whet dimensions are on the drawing.

These books are out of print so fetch a premium price. There was a reprint done but I think that is sold out too.

If you wanted to CAD model a "model" BB1 then either buying a set of scaled down drawings for teh BB1 or tracking down back issues of Model Engineer Magazine would give you the drawings for that but as I said it is not a totally true representation of full size.

Which leaves the Fowler archive at MERL that I mentioned earlier. The two drawings at the bottom would be of most use. One is the same general arrangement but will be at a much larger size so you can read what is there and will have to take other sizes off the drawing which is not ideal but about as good as you will get unless you can measure an actual engine. The other drawings listed will give good detail of specific parts but not of all the engine. so a lot of web searches for images and do what you can

https://merl.reading.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2017/04/BB1.pdf

As an idea of what these general arrangements look like this is one of the larger "Superba" ploughing engine and that is an original Fowler works drawing.

[Chipswitheverything]

Just to say, I'm much admiring Mike's impressive and purposeful Fowler ploughing engine model, and also the beautiful A7 engine shown by Jason.  Lovely examples of model engineering. Dave