Author Topic: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"  (Read 13445 times)

Offline Alyn Foundry

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2024, 02:37:39 PM »
Cracking on now!!

I’m going to suggest tapping the boss for the hot tube to 1/4-32. This will allow the use of the readily available miniature spark plugs from China.

Although successfully running hot tube the scale leaves a lot to be desired. 😉

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PB08G1A2zI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PB08G1A2zI</a>


 :cheers:  Graham.



Online Jasonb

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #31 on: December 27, 2024, 04:21:31 PM »
With a couple of other projects completed it was time to get back to the ideal.

The cylinder head was turned to form the spigot that locates it in the cylinder, I also tool a light skim off the small boss on the outside to clean it up and that proved useful as a way to hold it for drilling the 7 air hole sone one smaller gas hole as well as the larger reamed hole for the valve. I also took a light cut off the face so the surface was totally true to the valve hole.



The gas entry boss was milled flat, a 1.5mm hole drilled to meet the smaller 0.7mm hole and then opened up and threaded M5x0.5 for a gas fitting.



Jumping back to the liner the flat to allow the cooling water to flow to the lower inlet was milled



Then with the liner resting on that flat the slots for the exhaust were milled



The four M3 holes to hold the head on were drilled and tapped and then the liner was bonded in place with Loctite 648 and set aside for a couple of days to dry right off.



Once dry the head end was milled to final length ensureing a completely step free joint.



I did not take a picture of the piston as it is no more than a cup turned from 25mm cast iron bar with an M4 tapped hole in the end. This hole takes the threaded gudgeon pin carrier which I made from aluminium. I have gone for a ringless piston just running in the lapped cast iron bore.





The original engine has a brass or bronze conrod so a suitable bit was reamed and roughed out



Then taper turned between ctr and boring head after which the big and little ends were milled to shape.



Some simple turning produced the crank pin, valve and gudgeon pin which gave me enough parts for a bit of a play. All seems to go round as it should and the inlet valve is making the right sort of noises.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlHQ2l4pSkM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlHQ2l4pSkM</a>

Offline Alyn Foundry

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #32 on: December 27, 2024, 07:20:50 PM »
Looking good Jason. :ThumbsUp:

 :cheers:  Graham.

Online Sanjay F

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #33 on: December 27, 2024, 10:37:22 PM »
Looking fantastic.......I love that sound  :)
Best regards

Sanjay

Offline Roger B

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #34 on: December 28, 2024, 08:58:59 AM »
Looking good  :praise2:

I liked the hot tube trial  :)  :ThumbsUp: What is the smallest size tube you have used successfully?
Best regards

Roger

Online Jasonb

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #35 on: December 28, 2024, 10:13:16 AM »
I expect Graham will be along to confirm the tube size but I think it was 4mm OD.

The real problem with getting the engine running on hot tube at this size is that the original had the tube and chimney vertically at the side. If it had been vertically out the top then it would run and more importantly look fine with the 4mm tube. The real problem is getting from vertical to the horizontal entry as you either need an incredably tight bend or a welded joint as the tube gets too hot for solder. Anyone want to tig weld 0.5mm wall 4mm OD stainless tube?

On mine I'm going to get it running on a spark plug first and will then see if a short stub tube will work that is horizontal right across the chimney. That can be made from solid stainless in one piece.

Note to Ray, if you are reading then don't drill the sparkplug hole until you get the revised position.

Offline Alyn Foundry

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #36 on: December 28, 2024, 11:33:10 AM »
Looking good  :praise2:

I liked the hot tube trial  :)  :ThumbsUp: What is the smallest size tube you have used successfully?

Hi Roger.

Seasons greetings.

After years of making engines with hot tube ignition it seems that 3 mm internal diameter suits most IC engines of up to 50 cc  capacity.  Preferably made from 316 stainless Steel. The compression ratio also plays a major part too. Once above 4:1 you start getting pre ignition issues making them so advanced that they just won’t start and run properly. For larger capacity models an internal diameter of around 6 mm becomes the norm.

Heating is the main issue. They really need to be stinking hot for best results. This is why you’ll see many models running without the chimney cap because the flame becomes stifled at scale sizes.

Hot tube remains my favourite however, despite the many problems it can present to the modeller.

On an historical note most early gas engines were fairly low in the compression ratio area but as the knowledge and engineering advanced  it was soon discovered that  hot tube ignition was unsuitable without some form of mechanical means of ignition timing. Manufacturers started to favour electrical ignition systems in both low and high tension form as they gave an almost perfect control of the engines running parameters.


 :cheers:  Graham.


Addendum.

Just realised that I missed an important dimension ie. Hole depth.

We mainly used imperial measurements for our ignition tubes. 1/8”-2” deep or approximately 3-50 mm deep. If an engine was reluctant to start with the normal settings we would usually go up by 1/64” to cure the problem.

Another important point is that we’re also trying to make these engines run on a gas that was unknown to our forbears. A gas that isn’t very flexible in its combustion ratio of fuel and air.  😉

« Last Edit: December 28, 2024, 12:48:50 PM by Alyn Foundry »

Online Jasonb

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #37 on: December 28, 2024, 04:40:01 PM »
When I designed the engine I allowed for a smaller tapped hole for the hot tube and sized the raised boss accordingly. As it seems likely the engine will mostly get run on a spark plug I milled the boss off and spot faced at 10mm diameter. The hole was drilled and tapped, as it comes close to the end in order to avoid breaking into the water space I clamped a piece of scrap against the end just to stop any risk of the cast iron fracturing.



It was also necessary to mill some clearance into the side of the cylinder head spigot so that it did not obstruct the end of the sparkplug hole.



The final couple of jobs on the main bed casting were to drill & tapped the mounting hole for the cylinder oil pot and mill the oil pocket for the main bearing.



Where the cylinder mounting surface had been milled vertical tghere was a bit of a step where the machined surface met the cast one due to the draft angle so I milled away the step and blended the last 0.1mm or so with a file.



Also made an adaptor for a gas pipe and made & fitted a gib head ket to retain the offside flywheel. The crank side is loctited to the shaft and just needs a pin added for extra security.

Online Jasonb

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #38 on: December 29, 2024, 03:41:52 PM »
Close but not quite close enough!

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKCNPqMakkE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKCNPqMakkE</a>

Online crueby

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #39 on: December 29, 2024, 03:58:02 PM »
It wants to go!

Offline Michael S.

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #40 on: December 29, 2024, 05:11:33 PM »
He knows where to go and you will show him the way.
Excellent work.

Michael

Offline Admiral_dk

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Re: Hardy & Padmore "Ideal"
« Reply #41 on: December 29, 2024, 06:08:57 PM »
Is the green wire working as the Points ?
If so - I will suggest that the Timing is fluctuating  ;)

Other than that - it is always nice to hear the first Pops > not long before sustained runs  :ThumbsUp:

Per     :cheers:

 

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