Author Topic: Which model steam locomotive ?  (Read 2716 times)

Offline RGS1000

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Which model steam locomotive ?
« on: February 08, 2021, 11:39:18 AM »
Having finished building a few Stuart stationary models I would now like to try my hand at building a steam locomotive, ideally a 31/2 gauge, so could do with a little help.

I am open to suggestions on which one to start with, fairly simple but still challenging and it needs to be one with accurate plans, reading the forums there seems to be a lot of mistakes in some of them.

I would also appreciate recommendations on books helping to build model steam locomotives and links to interesting build logs.

Any help and advice would be very much appreciated.

Joe

Offline jeff l

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2021, 02:55:39 PM »
Have you looked at what Friends models has to offer ?Jeff

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2021, 02:56:44 PM »
Hi Joe,

Pretty much universally accepted as the gold standard for first locomotive builds is the Pennsylvania A3 by Kozo. Village Press has the book (https://secure.villagepress.com/store/items/detail/item/844), and several members here have built them, and documented their builds very comprehensively. A current build-log is here: https://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,8552.0.html.

The A3 is a 3.5" gauge, 3/4" scale locomotive, and Kozo includes extra instructions and documentation should one decide to build it in 1.5" scale (7.5" gauge).

Cheers!

Offline crueby

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2021, 03:09:01 PM »
I would second the comment on one of Kozo's build books. He teaches a lot of great techniques and his diagrams are terrific. There were some issues with the earlier books and small errors, in the later ones he had a couple people build from them before they were published to work out any missed details. I built his New Shay and had no problems with the plans - it was a more complicated boiler shape than I probably should have started with, but it worked out fine in the end.
Chris

Offline Steve17

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2021, 04:47:12 PM »
Even if you do'nt go for a Kozo drawn engine, his books are I think second to none, and well worth the investment.

Steve.

Daggers

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2021, 05:06:06 PM »
I personally would not recommend a particular loco as all the locos i have built and restored have had problems, some small, some not.
But what i would say is make sure that you pick a loco that you really like and are enthusiastic about. A loco is a long term commitment and it is easy to run out of steam if its not exactly what you want. Sorry for the pun.
Whatever loco you chose there will be a help and advice on this site, just post a few pictures.
Wishing you full steam ahead.

Offline Bearcar1

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2021, 05:40:08 PM »
hi ya Joe. If I may suggest, why not try one of the very simple and less complex locos that would be a bit of a challenge but not be so out of reach as to doom/stall the project shortly after in was started. The Idris is one that I have found to be of visual interest and is well within the realm of the average builder in terms of complexity and size. What others say is true, but a Shay as a first time out seems to be a bit of a lifelong commitment to me.


BC1
Jim

Offline Firebird

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2021, 08:14:41 PM »
Hi

Its a difficult choice but like others have said you will be into it for a long time so just make sure its a loco you like the look of.

My build of Conway https://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,6756.0.html had its first posting here in December 2016. 4 years later its still not quite done

But its been fantastic fun along the way, thoroughly enjoyable

Cheers

Rich

Online Kim

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2021, 05:43:03 AM »
Here's another endorsement of Kozo's books.  They are very well done.  The drawings are excellent, the added documentation is incredibly helpful, and the step by step he provides has proven to make each piece of this large and seemingly complex build quite doable for a relative newbie like me. So even if you choose to make a different engine, Kozo's books are a treasure trove of great techniques and information. I would highly recommend them.

I'm one of the people currently doing the Pennsy A3 switcher build which was referred to earlier.  The reason I chose the Penssy is I wanted to make a locomotive with a traditional-looking mechanism as opposed to a geared engine.  The Shay's are very cool too, but I really wanted all the exposed pushrods and valve gear mechanism that say "Steam Engine."  That was my basis for deciding.  Ideally, it would have been a bigger engine, like a 4-6-4 or something, but I wanted something that I could finish in a finite amount of time and figured I could tackle that for my next engine, once I pick up more of the required skills.

There are many choices out there. And as everyone says, it will be a bit of a commitment, so you want to be sure its one you can commit to!

Best of luck deciding what engine to make! And make sure to post your build for us to follow.
Kim

Online mklotz

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2021, 02:45:12 PM »
Personally, I have little interest in miniature steam railroading.  That said, I've spent some time reading Kozo's books and can enthusiastically echo the advice to spend some time with them.  The man is a fabrication genius.

One of the major live steam railroad forums is Chaski...

https://www.chaski.org/homemachinist/index.php

Spend some time looking around over there but, by all means, keep in contact here.  This forum has much to offer - wherever your modeling leads you.
Regards, Marv
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Online Charles Lamont

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2021, 09:54:46 PM »
Probably the simplest 3-1/2" loco is a Tich, but it really is a bit small:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkO_5WxASAE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkO_5WxASAE</a>

Juliet is a bit bigger:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEw0WVyyDlg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEw0WVyyDlg</a>

Rob Roy is another popular beginner's engine:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8QIvJPG168" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8QIvJPG168</a>

other designs at eg:
https://www.ajreeves.com/3-12-locomotives.html
http://www.blackgates.co.uk/3_5__gauge_locos.html




Offline crueby

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2021, 10:30:17 PM »
Charles - those are classic engines, very good proportions. I assume plans/books are available for them?

Online Charles Lamont

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2021, 08:49:23 AM »
Yes, and castings.

Offline Steve F

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2021, 11:46:39 AM »
Hello

The Tich, Juliet & Robroy castings are also available from "Kennions"https://www.kennions.co.uk/
To add to that list there is also the 5" Tich. Still relatively small but more power etc.

Do you like Narrow gauge ?

You could buy the Sweet Pea book that is full of text BUT build the smaller 3 1/2" Version Sweet Violet. Because it is narrow gauge it finishes the size of a small 5" gauge with drawings and castings from Jackie at Blackgates. Obviously the dimensions in the book will be wrong but the text and diagram shows you what's involved. Book here https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwie3J6Wnd_uAhWUi1wKHc2aCtwQFjAAegQIBBAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.teepublishing.co.uk%2Fbooks%2Fbuilding-model-steam-locomotives%2Fbuild-your-own-steam-locomotive-sweet-pea%2F&usg=AOvVaw0jHKgTu5LjMcq5SQYAJO5K

This question has been asked many times on the Model Engineering Clearing House Forum that is for loco builders here https://modeleng.proboards.com/board/12/general-chat. The is also a thread at the top of that page that lists errors in various loco designs.

For more errors look here via the Wayback machine https://web.archive.org/web/20080927042132/http://www.alanstepney.info/page6.html

regards

Steve

Offline Trevorc

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2021, 01:22:15 PM »
Many years ago at the start of my model engineering “ career” i had plans to build a 3 1/2 inch gauge Tich.
Older wiser club members told me that i would find the build too big of a challenge for a first time instead they recommended building a 71/4 inch gauge version saying its bigger size would make it easier to build and furthermore it would give a useful engine. I was told that the 3 1/2 inch gauge version would quickly become a mantle shelf show piece.  I followed that advice and was very pleased with the out come. It as quite a powerful loco.
I used the LBSC book and simply doubled the dimensions. If it looked too chunky i scaled back a little.
Small doesn't mean easier.
Best wishes
Trevorc

Daggers

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2021, 01:41:13 PM »
I must admit Sweet Pea is a interesting engine and has many positive attributes. A large number built, good manageable size, good runner, fairly simple and quick build for the novice and all castings, build book and laser parts readily available.
I have seen three of my friends build Sweet Pea, two of the as a first loco, and they are really pleased at the outcome.
I have driven and enjoyed all three.

Online Charles Lamont

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2021, 09:19:47 AM »
Small doesn't mean easier.
Totally agree, but mistakes are cheaper.

Offline RGS1000

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2021, 12:52:47 PM »
Well I finally decided on the Pennsylvania A3 switcher in 3.5 gauge, main reason being I do like the shape and design of it plus the book makes life so much easier.

This will be my first steam locomotive although I have built several stationary engines and have a fair bit of experience but always looking to expand my knowledge, I am going to build the engine first and at the moment I am putting together a list of materials I need for the build up to and including the Tee piece most of this being brass.

Now for the first of what will be many dumb questions, I would rather purchase the wheels rather than try to build them from stock and was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction of where to get some suitable ones in the UK, also is it better to use Bright Mild Steel / Cold Rolled or Hot Rolled Steel for the Main and Side rods, I am aware of the stress released when machining Cold Rolled but was wondering if there was any other pros and cons.

Thanks in advance for any help

Online Kim

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Re: Which model steam locomotive ?
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2021, 04:38:18 PM »
Hi Joe,

That sounds like a great choice!  (I'm not sure there would be a bad choice though! :))

I can't help you with sourcing things too much as I'm on the wrong side of the pond.

I can tell you that Friends sells castings for the A3 drivers as well as castings for the cylinders if you're interested in those.  They do ship overseas, though I don't know what it costs.  here's a link if you want to look: http://www.friendsmodels.com/productsforsale/kozowheelsdrivers.html

I chose to do most of my A3 using mainly steel rather than brass.  I did so for cost reasons, and because I was going to be paining everything anyway.  The one other difference between the cold-rolled steel and hot-rolled,  is that the cold is more accurate dimension-wise.  If you order 1/4"x1" CRS, the dimensions are 0.250 x 1.000" (+/- a thou maybe).  Also, I find the hot-roll harder to machine and it has an outer crust on it that has to be dealt with.  But that is just my experience, which is somewhat limited.

I prefer the CRS and doing some stress relief before use, rather than dealing with the issues of the hot-roled.

Hopefully, you'll get some other input on this from those with more experience than me.
Kim

 

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