Model Engine Maker

Supporting => Vehicles & Models => Topic started by: scc on January 06, 2016, 09:53:30 PM

Title: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 06, 2016, 09:53:30 PM
Several years ago I purchased a set of secondhand wheel rims, some laser cut spokes and a set of front and rear hub castings. Then a set of drawings from Live Steam Models. With limited time and resources I pottered on slowly. I took few photos, never having heard of build threads. Having recently joined this excellent forum , member "Jadge" enquired about seeing some pics. I had put them onto www.picasaweb.google.com/terrybullard.  It seems that the site no longer works as it did. Instead I will try and get them in some sort of sequence and put them on here a few at a time. Anyone interested will have to be patient as my pc skills are limited. :Doh:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 06, 2016, 10:14:43 PM
 :whoohoo:

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 09, 2016, 08:42:11 PM
As mentioned previously, I started with a set of hub castings and wheel rims.  The hubs have to be slotted to locate the spoke ends. At the time I did not own a dividing head. As you can see in the photo the solution was simple....fix the hub to an old gearwheel with suitable teeth, spigot the lot to the mill table and use a bolt as a register. It worked anyway!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 09, 2016, 08:55:38 PM
I soon bought a front axle casting and modified it to suit the prototype I was following. This entailed removing the steering chain bosses and shortening, plus replacing the cast wheel collars with removable ones. I also made the hubcaps.  I had made a start on what was to be a much longer project than I first thought.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 10, 2016, 06:04:11 PM
The next step was to build the front wheels, all straightforward stuff and probably of no great interest to most MEMers.  The pics explain themselves.    Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 10, 2016, 07:16:23 PM
Thanks for the pictures - definitely of interest to me, even if no-one else! The welding looks a darn sight better than mine. And that's one heck of a faceplate.  :o

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jasonb on January 10, 2016, 07:37:55 PM
There are a few others who like traction engines who are quietly following along.

It's good to have something solid to rivit on you don't want to waste all that energy from the hammer into a bouncy bench.

Thanks, J
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 10, 2016, 08:55:50 PM
Thanks Lads..... I realise I did not post a picture of the finished wheels, so here they are.......
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: joe d on January 10, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Those wheels are looking good.  Keep on posting, I'll keep on following along.

Cheers, Joe
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on January 10, 2016, 10:23:51 PM
Hi Terry,
I'm also following along.  Those are great looking wheels!  They're BIG wheels!  You're traction engine is huge compared to the dinky little thing I'm working on. Its very interesting to see this big guy being built. Thanks for sharing!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: burnit0017 on January 10, 2016, 10:27:59 PM
Greetings, how are the rims centered to the hub when drilling the stoke bolt holes? Great project, thanks for posting.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on January 10, 2016, 11:57:55 PM
Hi Terry,  very interesting build ill be definitely be following along.
Mal.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Steamer5 on January 11, 2016, 03:20:39 AM
Hi Terry,
Got the  :popcorn: &   :DrinkPint: to hand !

4" traction engine on a Raglan mill, way to go! I'll have to show & give dad a  :stickpoke: to show what he could be doing on his!

Cheers Kerrin
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 11, 2016, 03:21:26 PM
Hi Kerrin,        Don't get too carried away,  I have had to farm out the cylinder.......the casting won't fit in the throat, let alone any tooling!   I can cope with most other stuff though.               Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 11, 2016, 03:48:35 PM
Hi Burnit0017,    I machined a spigot to fit the centre of that big faceplate and the hub casting. The rim can then be centrallised to the hub with trammels, string or whatever. rim/hub is then packed up/down to obtain the correct dish or offset. The whole lot is then clamped. I predrilled the spoke ends but only with a tapping size on the hub end. The spokes next needed bending. I am sure that most engineers would make a jig for this. I have a VERY heavy  machine vice which lives on the floor in a corner, I simply put one spoke end in this  vice with the spoke vertical.....a sharp blow with a heavy hide hammer puts in the correct bend :facepalm: turn the spoke end for end and do the same. Once one spoke is set it can be used as a template for the others. On my Burrell all the spokes sit on the inside of the tee ring therefore the wheel has to be started upside down with all the inner ones fitted first. Once all is clamped in position the tapping holes in the hubs can be spotted through the spoke ends. Spokes then removed, hubs tapped spoke holes drilled to clearance size and countersunk. The whole lot re assembled with tempory bolts at the rivet end. Everything is then unclamped, turned over, and ditto for the other side. Obviously before final riveting a check should be made to ensure that the wheel spins true. I had to spread the riveting out so as not to annoy the neighbours! I apologise for not taking any pics of the process.                        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 11, 2016, 04:12:51 PM
Just to be different I've re-designed my front wheels to have the spokes on alternate sides of the T-ring as per the SCC engine in the Burrell museum. If nothing else it means all the spokes have the same bend angles and bend lines.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 11, 2016, 05:01:16 PM
Hi Andrew,      You know me by now.........bog standard, just following the drawings. (within reason)   besides, we have a full size scc Devonshire at work plus a Gold Medal, both have their spokes on the insides,   Vive le difference!     Best Wishes     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: loggerhogger on January 11, 2016, 05:45:13 PM
Very nice work. Keep us posted on your progress.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 11, 2016, 08:33:23 PM
Hi Andrew,      You know me by now.........bog standard, just following the drawings. (within reason)   besides, we have a full size scc Devonshire at work plus a Gold Medal, both have their spokes on the insides,

May be it's the engine at the Burrell museum that is the odd one out.

Of course I'd be further ahead if I was working more closely to the drawings.  :ThumbsUp: But I'd be producing even more scrap than normal, as there seem to be a considerable number of errors and omissions. Ultimately it's the engineering and the design theory behind it that interests me and not the engines per se. As an example that is why I spent ages designing and making hollow cast iron pistons rather than just use solid aluminium.  :facepalm:

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 13, 2016, 04:48:44 PM
Hi Andrew,     I'm wrong again :embarassed: walking past our Gold Medal tractor today I noticed the front wheel spoke palms are on BOTH sides of the tee ring!!!    more apologies.....Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 14, 2016, 11:05:11 AM
Terry: I'm being a bit slow here - an obvious question is where do you work that you have a couple of full size traction engines lying about?

I've attached a 3D PDF of my front wheel assembly. Note that the hub cap is shown as gunmetal colour. I've been b*****ked on another forum for that, as being non-prototypical.  :'( So I'm going to bin the original castings and have bought some cast iron bar to make new ones instead.

Andrew

Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 15, 2016, 11:35:31 AM
Hi Andrew,   Our scc has cast iron hubcaps.  The gold medals are brass, but incorrectly retained by brass slotted screws.  Your wheel assy loooks spot on.


I will email you...........Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 17, 2016, 09:46:13 PM
Been making the big end tonight.    Usual procedure.... cut the block in half, mill faces and soft solder together. then square up to size. My next move will be to bore the hole for the crank pin. No DRO, etc  just an old fashioned mark out then "split the pops"



Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 25, 2016, 08:46:22 PM
Hello again,  I'm afraid that this thread is going to be almost in two parallel parts......current progress alongside the older pics taken over the years that I have now sorted :ShakeHead: Soon after I started with the front axle and wheels I moved onto the smokebox and perch bracket. All basic stuff again as you can see in the photos. The old Colchester handled this ok. This was followed by the smokebox door and name rings, etc. I have since added a  baffle to the inside of the door, mainly to protect the paint as on full size.     Terry

Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 25, 2016, 09:07:35 PM
To continue........next was mark out, cut and drill the hornplates.  These were bought guilitined to size then all cut-outs chain drilled and jigsawed then filed to size. I have included a photo of my Colchester, I was told that it was WW1 vintage. I drove it by flat belt from a 2hp 1ph motor slung underneath on a piece of scaffold tube! It was aquired from a scrapyard. Very worn I did not keep it long, not having the skill, funds or sense to restore it. :shrug:    The shop was very cluttered in those days.             Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on January 25, 2016, 09:43:26 PM
Hi Terry
 Very nice work there, how far along is the engine to date Terry.

Mal.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 25, 2016, 10:02:40 PM
Thanks Mal,    Lets just say it's progressing....you will have to be patient. I've got most of the old pics sorted and will post them soon.       I'm currently working on the con rod. I milled the angled slot for the cotter using the cotter to set the angle on the big end bearing. Then a drill and a small endmill to tickle out the slot in the strap and then filed to size. I was a bit concerned about drilling the rod end for the fitted bolts....you can see the cobbled up set up I finished up with :lolb:      fingers crossed!              Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: b.lindsey on January 26, 2016, 12:06:49 AM
Most impressive Terry not to mention HUGE as well. I have to ask, will you be building a cart to sit on and ride behind it when under steam?

Bill
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on January 26, 2016, 12:50:50 AM
No kidding!  This thing is huge!  What's the thickness of those horn plates?  is it 1/4"?  They look massive.  And heavy!  Mighty impressive, is all I can say...
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 26, 2016, 09:00:51 PM
Hi Bill, the usual set up on a big 4inch is to hang a seat on the back of the tender with footrest dropped from the towing bracket.  My  great grandson just fits on the footplate at present.

Yes Kim the hornplates are 1/4".  As I get older I find it harder to lift a lot of the bits.  As I've mentioned before I shouldn't really be building a 4" scale with my equipment.

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 27, 2016, 09:11:23 PM
More on the connecting rod.......the cobbled set up did not work (you all knew it wouldn't :ROFL:    When assembled the rod was not square to the crank. I arranged a more secure set-up and drilled for oversize fitted bolts.....made some new bolts and all is well again :ThumbsUp:     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on January 27, 2016, 09:19:26 PM
I have been remiss :slap:

All of our other traction engine builds are in the Vehicles and Models directory. (Like my BB1  :Love: one ) I feared this would get lost amongst the other engine types so I have moved it into its correct location so interested people can find it ;)

Jo
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 27, 2016, 09:33:52 PM
Cheers Jo.
Some more old photos......As the Colchester was on it's last legs I bought this little Clark for the numerous small pins, etc.  I made most of the gear blanks and that was as far as I got with my agricultural engine. I had bought the boiler and most of the castings when fate intervened ::)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 05, 2016, 09:51:52 PM
A much loved uncle passed away and kindly left me a little bit of money. Within a couple of days I saw an advert from someone selling a boiler, some castings, wheel components and a finished crank....I bought it :ShakeHead:  The boiler is a  1992 one made by Harry Holt and I decided to build this one first as a "road loco". The smokebox and perch bracket that I had already made were fitted along with slightly different hornplates. I machined another set of hubs and rivetted another set of wheels which were then sent away for rubbering.    The Colchester had gone, replaced by  the Atlas pictured in my garden workshop thread. This gave me a little more room. Not many pics were taken during this but I will put on a few.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on February 06, 2016, 08:48:06 AM
And I thought I was a silly fool for doing three Stuart Triples at the same time  ;D

Jo
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 06, 2016, 10:35:29 AM
Hi Jo,      "Jadge" on this forum is also  building TWO Burrells, but he is clever enough to make a pair concurrently.  I am hoping to make all my cock ups on the first one and hopefully do the second one properly. My two are different models, I'm not sure that I could cope with three all very similar. I watch your thread with interest.                        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on February 06, 2016, 12:02:04 PM
I did start on two 4" ploughing engines in my youth but I'm only building one 2" one this time around  ;) I have two 5" Gauge locomotive that I should get back to one day :paranoia:

Jo

P.S. I was about to give up on posting the triples as there didn't seem to be a lot of interest and it is just the same thing time, and time, and time again, that will take forever  :noidea:.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 06, 2016, 12:29:16 PM
It would be a shame to stop posting on the triples,  I'm sure that there will always somebody following and getting  inspired...I certainly am. It is good to see something being made that is completely different to one's own project and find ways of doing things that you can adapt/ apply.  :LickLips:  Please keep on with your nine cylinders!!                   Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on February 06, 2016, 02:11:28 PM
Please keep on with your nine cylinders!!

 :facepalm2: Nine cylinders, 9 double eccentrics (3 split  :(), 18 eccentric rods......... What have I done :paranoia:

Oh for a nice simple single cylinder engine  :Love:

Jo
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: AOG on February 06, 2016, 04:56:37 PM
Jo it sounds like your starting to get burned out on the triplets. Take a break and go do something else. When was the last time you did a nice little barstock engine?  Go do an Elmer's or one of the small Liney engines. With your tools and skills you should be able to bang one out in a weekend or 2. That will give you some "me time" away from your triple harem.

Tony
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 14, 2016, 09:15:34 PM
Back to the early part of my build.....before and after pics of one of the back wheels. I decided not to bother with strakes so rubber straight to the rims. Then the usual routine of making the crankshaft bearings.     I'm afraid I haven't worked out how to place text between photos yet :headscratch:             Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on February 14, 2016, 10:23:32 PM
Hm..thought I'd posted on your thread Terry.
Sorry about that.
I've been watching and enjoying. Nice work!

I don't think you can put text in between attachments. Only if you paste pictures/links in the reply.
If that's not true...then I'd like to know how too.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 21, 2016, 12:37:26 PM
Thank you Zee,      Belly tank testing today........two of my granddaughters on leak spotting duties.......very slight from just two rivets....success I reckon :whoohoo:          I could not believe how heavy it was when full.                Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 21, 2016, 04:30:31 PM
  I had a few spare moments today so I decided it was time to bring this rather chaotic thread up to date by posting most of the "old" photos.  They are all obvious / boring to all you precision people so I include minimum descriptions.  First up I made bits of gearchange, then went on to the eccentric bits.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 21, 2016, 04:38:57 PM
This was followed by making the upper gear guard / reversing lever quadrant and I then started on the tender.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 21, 2016, 04:55:59 PM
While the tender was being constructed (this was helped by a big heavy former coming with the second engine) my gear blanks returned complete with teeth  :cartwheel:  the two blanks for the main bevel gears just fitted on the Atlas. All the others (2 sets) were on the Colchester and the big lathe at work. With the tender bolted on and some paint applied it was beginning to look ok.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on February 21, 2016, 07:11:31 PM
Terry,
This thing is huge.  Just simply amazing.  I love seeing the work you're doing on this.  And it looks like a LOT of work. Thank you for taking the time to post these pictures. Again, I'll just say this thing is a beast!
Kim

PS How will you move it when its done?  The thing must weigh a ton!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 21, 2016, 08:11:36 PM
Thank you for your encouraging comments Kim.  You may have seen in one of the photos that it is sat on a blue bench. This is fitted with 4 swivel castors. The plan :help: is to wheel it into the doorway having already taken the engine crane outside. The legs nearest the camera are removed once the bench end is hung on the crane :ShakeHead: This end is then lowered onto some blocks about 12ins high and some ramps added. The front of the engine is attached to a winch  fixed to the bench.  Simply lower down the slope on the handle :lolb:      Anyway that's the plan.            Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on February 21, 2016, 09:03:19 PM
Thanks Terry, its nice to know you have a plan.  Now I can stop worrying about it for you :)
Do you have an estimate of how much it will weigh when finished?  Its got go be pretty substantial!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on February 22, 2016, 12:24:36 AM
I was wondering the same thing as Kim. Huge! How is it going to be moved?

Glad you have a plan. And I hope the word 'awry' does not come into play when you implement it.  ;D
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: b.lindsey on February 22, 2016, 01:03:18 AM
Terry, unfortunately, if  you attach pictures you can't put text between them. To do that you have to host them on a remote site like photobucket and then put links after each blurb of text. Either was, I am enjoying following along as this monster progresses :)

Bill
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on February 22, 2016, 10:46:51 AM
I am building the same engine as Terry. I don't have an accurate value for the final weight, but I estimate a value of 1000lbs, or around half a ton.

Being awkward I cut all the teeth on my gears. I had to resort to using the rotary table for the final drive gears, as the blanks were too large to fit under the cutter in the vertical plane:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Final_Drive_Gear_Cutting_MEM.JPG)

Fortunately the final drive gears have 72 teeth so the indexing is simple. I ended up cutting six final drive gears, as I'm making two engines and I also cut two gears for a friend who is making the same engine, and just happened to have his gear blanks ready at the right time. So that's 432 raisings and lowerings of the mill knee. It keeps you fit if nothing else.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 22, 2016, 09:21:16 PM
Hi Andrew,  If only I'd known.........you might you might have been able to cut EIGHT final drive gears!   :thinking:   Nice to hear from you again.           Cheers,  Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: DTR on February 23, 2016, 09:32:24 AM
What an amazing build! Watching with interest!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on February 23, 2016, 02:28:57 PM
Terry has indicated that he is not averse to me making the odd post in his build thread. I mentioned that I'd post something on making my connecting rods, so here goes.

I started with a large lump of hot rolled steel. For historical reasons I have a lot of hot rolled steel. I rather like it, although it is a bit 'sticky' and needs a bit more thought to get a good finish. Since it is rolled hot it doesn't distort when machined, and seems less prone to rust than EN1A. First job was to rough out to the correct thickness plus about 10 thou. Here is an apposite picture given the recent mention of side and face cutters in another thread:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_1.JPG)

After roughing to thickness, two slices of the correct width, plus a bit, were cut. I used a slitting saw to separate the slices in two cuts each 3/8" deep (no point in faffing around), one from each side. After some tidying up the tapered part and the internal radii were done using a hydraulic copy unit. I'm always keen to try out new toys!

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_2.JPG)

Note that the tool at the rear is upside down, so the lathe runs in the normal direction and all feed directions are familiar, ie, less chance of an operator foul up. Here is the slot for the bearing adjuster being cut, using a side and face cutter and done in one pass:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_3.JPG)

I had an issue drilling the through holes for the custom bolts that hold the connecting rod and strap together. Here is the setup:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_4.JPG)

Rather than use the big end bearings to set the position of the strap there are some gauge blocks held in place, and just visible. In general it is not a good idea to rely on holding two parts together in a machine vice. However, both the connecting rod and strap have been surface ground to thickness, so they are within a tenth or so of each other.  Drilling one connecting rod went well, on the second one I had a wobbly and broke the drill in one of the holes.  :'( I spent ages trying to drill it out with carbide drills and slot drills. Finally I took the connecting rod out of the vice to discover that the broken end of the drill was sticking out from the work. Using the bench vice it came out easy peasy. Fortunately no damage was done and the holes were still lined up.

The method of soft soldering bearing halves together before machining the centre hole has never worked for me. Instead I made an aluminium jig where the slot for the bearing halves is precisely located in the centre of the outer circle. So if the jig is indicated true in the chuck then the hole will be drilled and bored dead centre in the bearings:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_5.JPG)

Here are the final connecting rods:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Conrod_MEM_6.JPG)

Everything was home made except for the 2BA nuts. The rounded and tapered top of the bearing adjuster was done on the CNC mill. On the other hand the rounding of the little end was done by hand using sacrificial filing buttons. The little end bearings are hardened silver steel.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on February 23, 2016, 03:46:38 PM
Hi Andrew,
Nice con rods.  I'm sorry about the broken drill bit.  I certainly feel your pain there.  While I'm very sorry it happened to you, its nice to hear I'm not the only one who's broken off dirll bits!  :-\

Interesting to see that large gear being cut too!

You should seriously consider starting your own build thread!  I'd love to see your progress too.  Don't be deterred let the fact that there's another similar build going on at the same time.  That simply makes it more interesting! Then we can see how two different people attack the same problem, and see each person's techniques.

Thanks,
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on February 24, 2016, 11:15:31 AM
You should seriously consider starting your own build thread!  I'd love to see your progress too.  Don't be deterred let the fact that there's another similar build going on at the same time.  That simply makes it more interesting! Then we can see how two different people attack the same problem, and see each person's techniques.

Kim: I do have my own thread on this forum, although it's not intended to be a full build thread. Maybe I should add more to it on some of the more interesting parts I have already made?

http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,5008.0.html (http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,5008.0.html)

I run a detailed build thread on the TractionTalk forum, although I believe that one needs to be a member of that forum to view any of the threads.

As for broken drills it happens. I'm an expert at producing scrap!

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on February 24, 2016, 12:00:25 PM
I run a detailed build thread on the TractionTalk forum, although I believe that one needs to be a member of that forum to view any of the threads.

I am a member over there but not very good at remembering to go and have a look at what is going on :embarassed:

Can you believe there are others who spend more time surfing the web than they spend in their workshops  :lolb:

Jo
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jasonb on February 24, 2016, 12:42:24 PM
I am a member over there but not very good at remembering to go and have a look at what is going on :embarassed:

Just as well you have someone to let you know when a post that may be of interest crops up ;)

Quote
Can you believe there are others who spend more time surfing the web than they spend in their workshops  :lolb:

Whats even harder to believe is that they can make as many complete and working engines as well. I suspect that when they are in their workshops they spend their time using the machines not just stroking them :LittleDevil:

I enjoy Andrews posts where ever they may be and have leart a few things from them and also enjoying quietly following this one along.

J
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on February 25, 2016, 07:07:47 AM
Yes, I remember your thread now Andrew!  Just didn't connect it to you.  Sorry, I can have a hard time keeping projects mapped to people.  I apologize for that.  Still, in spite of my poor memory, these are very impressive projects that you and Terry are working on!

I'll have to see if I can find you on the TractionTalk forum.  I think I joined that to pickup some info on riveting a while back! :)
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on February 25, 2016, 10:50:36 AM
Kim: No apology needed! I find it quite difficult on this forum to find, and keep track of, threads. I've not posted on some threads because they have dropped out of the 'latest posts' list and I have been unable to find them by searching.

If anyone wants to look at my build diary on TractionTalk my sobriquet there is 'oly2brf5'.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Stuart on February 25, 2016, 05:23:26 PM
Had a read though your build very impressive indeed


Reading reminded me of a club member at the club I used to belong to as it was mostly loco based and due to me having personal wheels and I have sold all my loco's I am no longer a member .

This guy built a 6 inch traction engine and a very fine job he did when asked what was the next project he replied I have the patterns made and the are at the foundry for a 12 inch one , big clang when our Colective jaws hit the floor not sure how it went as I have lost contact

Stuart
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 26, 2016, 10:29:40 AM
12" to the foot scale can turn up from time to time, I have recently made a new water pump cock for the full size Burrell at work. I made a steel plug first to lap in the cock body.  Then a brass plug on the same set up. (photos below)  A friend happened to mention that there cannot be many folk building a miniature and full size at the same time. They are both single crank compound Burrells although the big one is a 12ton roller not a TE.
Comparing mine and Andrew's builds will be interesting...vast differences in equipment and approach. This is what makes this such a great hobby. I trust Andrew is having as much fun as I am :cheers:      Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 29, 2016, 09:21:27 PM
A bit more 4" progress.   Finished plumbing on the boiler crown, then did a bit more to the steering.  Given the equipment at home it seemed best to electric arc weld and then clean up with a little filing. (still some filing to do). Notice the minimal clearance between the steering shaft and belly tank / gear guard.              Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on February 29, 2016, 10:25:50 PM
Wow. It's very easy to see this as a full-size engine. Nice work!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on February 29, 2016, 11:42:44 PM
Some very nice work being done here Terry ,looking at this build gets me in the shed  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on March 01, 2016, 03:16:48 AM
Neat.  Love to see your work Terry.
You can really see all the parts you're working on, that's for sure!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 19, 2016, 10:11:07 PM
I have finally achieved some time in the shed.   :whoohoo:  My wife has an Ebay shop (wool/ribbons/haberdashery, etc) .Ever since she set it up I am required at frequent intervals to build more shelving for more stock, etc. assist with packing, posting.........it all intrudes into my swarf making. However progress has been made.  The steering assembly is now complete. I have started to mount the waterpump. Having noted Jadge's comments on his thread I have reduced the ram diameter by 1/8" Everything else is to Live Steam's drawing. Without CAD and the like I positioned it by eye :facepalm: Clamped in position with the eccentric set up and turning the crank I marked the fixing holes onto a paper stuck on the horn plate. Not wishing to do much dismantling drilling was a problem. I have aquired a 90degree drilling head. This worked well with a shortened drill bit. I did try the pump by hand and it worked by hand from a cup. Time will tell if it works OK in situ. Once it is fitted I will fix a gauge and see what pressure is achieved :thinking:     Still waiting for my cylinder.                        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on March 20, 2016, 12:50:22 PM
Nice work there Terry, lovely paintwork is that sprayed on or brush?

Mal.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 20, 2016, 09:42:44 PM
Cheers Mal,  All the priming  was brushed then dry flatted before brushing the top coats . I sprayed the tender and the belly tank. I know things are bound to get scratched during the build, but I am building a thing to be used and I don't want to build on this scale then take it all apart  again to paint.        Thanks for following along.                  Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on May 15, 2016, 09:48:48 PM
Now that summer is here :thinking: I've started to have a few weekends away with the caravan. This results in minimal shed time. I am always impressed by the expertise and technology that exists amongst MEM people and I salute you all.  :NotWorthy:: CAD, CNC ,etc has bypassed me so my shed activities are still in the dark ages.(and likely to remain so) You will understand I hope, my set up for making the expansion link.
Firstly the link was marked out  followed by lightly centre popping the outline. Then chain drilling hacksawing and filing. I did use the mill for the die-block slot. Progress was being made and I was enjoying myself. However when I drilled the first of the lube holes the drill broke off flush and has proved impossible to extract. :'(   I have started making a replacement link.            On a better note both belly and back tanks are now interconnected and have proved to be leak free with a water test.                  Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on May 16, 2016, 11:33:51 AM
There's nowt wrong with the techniques being used. Neat use of the 'crank' method of machining the slot rather than hanging the link way off the rotary table to get the correct radius by direct means.

I haven't made my expansion links yet, because I haven't re-designed the valve gear yet. I made an expansion link and die block from gauge plate a few years ago for a fellow member on TractionTalk. Even though the parts were done on the CNC mill I left a couple of thou on the slot and did final fitting by drawing filing using a Hoffmann roller as a gauge.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on May 16, 2016, 06:20:17 PM
Cheers Andrew,   I like the idea of the roller as a gauge. On full size, the die block fit is arranged with about half a thou taper from one side. it should only enter from one side and be a "perfect" fit when fully in position. I don't think I shall be doing that on the model!............Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Bertie_Bassett on May 16, 2016, 09:02:13 PM
some great work going on there, that 'crank' method for machining the slot is ingenious
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on May 17, 2016, 02:14:15 AM
Hi Terry great work your doing there ,no cnc or dro in my shed good set of files does wonders.

Mal.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: packmule on May 17, 2016, 07:46:35 AM
Excellent work .Its good to see the different ways to set pieces up and get the same end result. Looking forward to the next instalment  :ThumbsUp:

Bob
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on May 17, 2016, 11:19:19 AM
On full size, the die block fit is arranged with about half a thou taper from one side. it should only enter from one side and be a "perfect" fit when fully in position. I don't think I shall be doing that on the model!............Terry

Neither will I! A shake free fit from either side will satisfy me.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on May 27, 2016, 10:53:58 AM
Thank you Bertie, Mal, Bob and Andrew,      The first 20 months or so of my apprenticeship was spent on "bench fitting"....working with just hand tools.   I find it very satisfying, which is just as well with my shop!              Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on May 30, 2016, 10:52:59 AM
Made a little more progress with my valve gear recently.  I have deviated from the LSM drawings which show all the pins able to rotate in every hole.
On the full size engine at work the "rod" pins are located by dutchmen under the head. In my case a 1/8" long x 3/32" dia  piece of mild steel tightly fitted in the pin and located in a  small slot in the rod. This keeps the split pins vertical. The expansion link pin is located by a taper pin fitted at a tangent to it. I was a bit nervous drilling and reaming the hole for this having already scrapped one expansion link. I hope the photos are clear enough.   By the way,  anybody out there know why these little locating pins are called "dutchmen"?
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on May 30, 2016, 11:16:40 AM
Looking good! Are you following the LSM drawings as to valve events? Being awkward I am intending to work my way through the design of Stephenson valve gear and will probably change the design of valve gear and ports if appropriate.

No idea about 'dutchmen', I've not heard the expression before. However, I will be half inching the idea for my valve gear.  :ThumbsUp:

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on May 31, 2016, 09:44:17 PM
Still on the subject of valve gear, here is a picture of the full size one at work.              Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on June 01, 2016, 01:29:55 AM
Nice work there Terry like the idea on the locating pin to stop the pin from turning

Mal.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on June 01, 2016, 11:05:49 AM
Still on the subject of valve gear, here is a picture of the full size one at work.              Terry

Thanks Terry; at first glance the LSM drawings seem to be a pretty good copy of full size. It'll still be interesting to work out what I want the valve gear to do and then see how close one can get to the 'ideal'.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on June 13, 2016, 10:00:00 PM
I made a start on the crosshead today.  I tried to flycut to square up the casting but the hammering that the mill was getting made me stop. :(
I could not inflict that amount of suffering on the little Raglan. Things went a lot better,, albeit slower, when I tried with a 4 flute end mill. Once the outside was square some old-school marking out was done, then back on the mill. With no power feeds I'm in for a lot of winding on this one!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: mal webber on June 14, 2016, 11:48:24 PM
Excellent work Terry ,have not machine a single casting in my projects yet looking forward to having a go at this sort of machining.

Mal
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 24, 2016, 09:47:34 PM
I have been pottering on a little in the workshop lately, nothing worth detailing, just odds and ends. Crosshead , slide bars and safety valve mainly.
On the full size safety valve there is a slotted link fitted inside the spring so if the spring breaks the valves and lever stay attached rather than flying off somewhere :o No such stuff is shown on the drawings. I assume due to lack of space. I have added some plumbing but am now held up waiting for my cylinder to return :shrug:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 07, 2016, 10:02:55 PM
Been dismantling the engine today. I forgot to cut the keyway that locks the right hand final drive gear to the axle :facepalm2:  i shall take the opportunity to cut the oil access in the gear guards and finish paint them while they are off.

Moving into the machine shop from the erecting shop :Lol: (all in a 20ft. shed) I have started on the HP valve, initially just squaring up in the mill ready to mark out
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on August 08, 2016, 11:09:59 AM
Looking excellent! The final drive gear castings look a bit different to mine; are they original Filby castings?

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 08, 2016, 02:11:45 PM
The castings came from John Rex,  Andrew.   
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on August 08, 2016, 07:24:27 PM
Oooops, I think I may have asked the same question before.  :embarassed:

However, your righthand final drive gear is different to mine around the holes for the drive pin. Yours seems to follow the pattern of holes, whereas mine is just a circle. May be the pattern has been simplified over the years?

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 08, 2016, 09:04:52 PM
Hi Andrew,      I started with two sets of castings.  One I bought off John, the second (incomplete) set came with a Holt boiler I bought whilst the first set was on order. Unlike you, I decided to make things one at a time and put the second lot away. Soon after it became obvious that my ancient Colchester was dying so I hastily machined all the "big" stuff while it was still going. When the time came for gearcutting I just fetched out a set of machined blanks and sent them off. Having now looked again I see they are different but I don't know which is which :shrug: I have took some pics for you to see.

Progressing with the hp valve , I  carried on after tea.   Starting the mill to continue with the exhaust recess I followed the wrong line :Mad:
 It is probably scrap!! Anyone got any ideas? :help:             Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jo on August 08, 2016, 09:46:34 PM
Progressing with the hp valve , I  carried on after tea.   Starting the mill to continue with the exhaust recess I followed the wrong line :Mad:
 It is probably scrap!! Anyone got any ideas? :help:             Terry

Fettle a bit of spare bronze to fit the mistake and Silver solder in. Then whistle a merry tune, carry on milling and not admit it to anyone  ;).

Jo
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: 10KPete on August 08, 2016, 10:00:23 PM
Progressing with the hp valve , I  carried on after tea.   Starting the mill to continue with the exhaust recess I followed the wrong line :Mad:
 It is probably scrap!! Anyone got any ideas? :help:             Terry

Fettle a bit of spare bronze to fit the mistake and Silver solder in. Then whistle a merry tune, carry on milling and not admit it to anyone  ;).

Jo

Gets my vote!!

Pete
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on August 08, 2016, 10:16:44 PM
Thanks for the photos. My casting is the same as one on the left, without gear teeth. Clearly a simpler casting, and presumably the later of the two? Not that it's going to be that visible when everything is assembled. Never mind the fancy shape though, I'll be more than happy if all the holes for the drive pin line up!

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 09, 2016, 05:36:57 PM
Thank you Jo and Pete,         It's an obvious solution isn't it?      When you jump up and down with smoke coming out of your ears it limits your ability to think clearly ::)       I will post the repair pics when done.        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jasonb on August 09, 2016, 05:48:17 PM
The other option is to mill the large part off completely and make a plate with a hole in to solder to the block. I have done a couple of valves this way as its easy to do the recess when its a through hole

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v156/jasonballamy/Engineering/Tidman%20Organ%20Engine/Tid148_zpsyq48bich.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v156/jasonballamy/Engineering/Tidman%20Organ%20Engine/Tid149_zpsyuxlx2zx.jpg)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 09, 2016, 07:06:57 PM
Cheers Jasonb..... I shall weigh up all the options before I commit..          Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 19, 2016, 09:32:37 PM
HP valve repair...........I extended the "mistake" slot to provide a mechanical key, then fettled a bit of bronze and silver soldered it in. Carried on milling and job's a good un!    I was concentrating and forgot to whistle a merry tune :lolb:   

 Thanks to Jo and Pete for the method.         And to Jasonb for the alternative.


Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: 10KPete on August 19, 2016, 09:41:05 PM
....whistle a merry tune....and no one ever knows you're afraid...

 :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 19, 2016, 09:24:41 PM
I have finally got my cylinders back from John Rex and am very pleased with them. :cartwheel:      I do not like farming stuff out but sometimes it is required. A quick look at the photo of the cylinder on my mill and you will understand. (and forgive me I hope).  I still have to drill / tap loads of holes and make all the glands, front covers, etc.                 Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on September 22, 2016, 11:12:04 AM
Looking good Terry. Did John drill and tap any of the holes? A friend of mine got John to machine his cylinder casting, but was slightly disconcerted to discover most holes were tapped M6 whereas he'd be making parts assuming they'd be ¼" BSF. Mine will definitely be ¼" BSF, and 2BA for the glands, as I've already made the studs and nuts.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 22, 2016, 09:21:22 PM
Hi Andrew,  very little drilled and nothing tapped.  Most holes are M5.  I too am doing 1/4 BSF. studs and nuts,  M6 setscrews would not look nice at all. Also the height of the LP valve is different to drawing. Never the less I'm happy to be able to progress and quite satisfied with John's work.
Your latest stuff on TT looks good. The eccentric strap oilers look well...we have three Burrells at work and no oilers are the same...typical Burrell!

Regards         Terry :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 22, 2016, 10:36:30 AM
   A little progress has been made recently.  Firstly the "spigots" that fit inside the cylinder covers. Having no suitable bar stock I chain drilled out of plate  and turned them to size on a suitable mandrel.  I had nothing to use to locate them onto the covers accurately, so with the covers in place a spot or two of  superglue held the spigots once dropped in the bores from the other end. Taken out in one with the cover it was simple to spot though, drill and tap.  Prior to final assembly the screws will be loctited and "popped" to retain them.

As mentioned before there are LOTS of studs to make and I have no "production" machinery.  I resorted to threading one end , cutting off and once a quantity had been made screwing into a threaded mandrel to finish the other end. After a while I gave up and ordered the rest on line :shrug:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 22, 2016, 10:52:01 AM
I started next on the  pistons and rods, etc.  Pistons I machined from iron castings.  ( not prepared to or capable of the lovely hollow ones that Andrew has made) This was all easy stuff as can be seen.

I the set the piston rod  length by trial and error against the slide bars which I had already made and checked from crank stroke and crosshead dimensions.  The  drawings differ and I may be wrong :thinking: we will see.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 23, 2016, 04:39:24 PM
A bit more progress today, drilled the slide bar support  and assembled it to the cylinder. Next step is to sit in on the boiler and set it using the con rod and turning the crank. I thought it would be safer to drill all the holes with the engine on the floor. earlier in this thread Kim and Zee were asking how I was going to move it and I outlined my plan :embarassed:  Unfortunately it didn't work :Mad: the bench is too long to sit at right angles to the door and there is too little garden width for the engine crane AND ramps. It looks like I shall have to make  a gantry.   
Never mind, a visit from my great grandaughter cheered me up.            Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on October 23, 2016, 11:07:48 PM
earlier in this thread Kim and Zee were asking how I was going to move it and I outlined my plan :embarassed:  Unfortunately it didn't work :Mad: the bench is too long to sit at right angles to the door and there is too little garden width for the engine crane AND ramps. It looks like I shall have to make  a gantry.

Sounds like its time for a bigger shed!  ;D
Sorry to hear about the complications in moving your engine. I'm sure you'll get it worked out. 

Never mind, a visit from my great grandaughter cheered me up.            Terry
Great picture! That would cheer ANYONE up!  :ThumbsUp:
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 24, 2016, 12:09:57 PM
Cheers Kim.

Sadly a bigger shed is not an option.......Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 29, 2016, 11:02:52 AM
Hello again,           Having got my cylinder assembly ready I couldn't resist dropping (wrong word...it's VERY heavy) it onto the boiler to see how it looked.    Another case of two steps forward and one back :ThumbsDown: #the reinforcing ring around the top mud hole is in the way of the slide bar support bracket which will have to be modified at it's base.
            At work waiting for restoration are two nice engines which I aim to model in much smaller scales than my current big lumps. One is a disc crank, slide valve single cylinder mill engine, and the other a small vertical stirrup or tuning fork engine.  All my 4" scale stuff was OK ten years ago when I started but is now too heavy :old: Never the less, I will finish them and I look forward to steaming them.

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 01, 2016, 09:29:08 PM
I'm currently working through the valve gear. I have given up on the drawings and basically working it out as I go along. All you modern folk out there would be on the computer modelling by now ;)   My poor Raglan mill had to work hard to flycut the base of the weighshaft bracket but was OK with small cuts.          Onwards and upwards.    The ball ended valve rod link will be re-made now that I have a bit more experience in that area.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on November 02, 2016, 07:14:57 PM
Terry: Looks like you're making excellent progress. I've modelled the cylinder, crosshead and slidebars in CAD and I recall that everything was pretty similar to the drawings. However, I missed out the 1° back slope on the cylinder, much too complicated, albeit I think the full size engine had the back slope. Smells a bit like a design foul up to me - "Oh fudge the cylinder is a bit high, never mind just file a bit of the back of the mount and pretend we intended it that way".  :D

I'm one of those nuts who will be re-designing the valve gear and porting using the old school diagrams, and 3D CAD, when I get around to that part of the build.

I've been taking a break from my engines recently to play with machining gears, but I did make my valve rod couplers a couple of months ago:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Valve_Rod_Coupler_MEM_1.JPG)

However, I cheated  :embarassed: by using the hydraulic copying unit and a CNC machined pattern in sheet steel:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10022/normal_Valve_Rod_Coupler_MEM_2.JPG)

As you can see I ended up making three; if you want the spare you can have it.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 02, 2016, 08:19:35 PM
Cheers Andrew,   I'd love your lovely valve rod coupler but I feel that if something is within the capacity of my shed then I ought to have a go at it. I do appreciate your offer though.              Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on November 02, 2016, 08:56:47 PM
I'd love your lovely valve rod coupler but I feel that if something is within the capacity of my shed then I ought to have a go at it.

Fair enough. I'll keep the spare for people to fondle when I show parts what I have made.

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 04, 2016, 09:20:52 PM
Hi Andrew,  The 1 degree back slope is very obvious on the big ones at work. I've never enquired about it but i suspect you are correct. The horn plates / crank position is probably designed for the single cylinder. Inclining the taller scc cylinder was the easiest option maybe.

I hope you are not offended by me declining your generous offer of your spare valve coupler.

Best Wishes                    Terry



Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 16, 2016, 08:34:24 PM
Inspired by Andrew's lovely valve couplers I set to in the shed.............drew a half section on some ally plate and clamped to the lathe bed........bolted a pointer to the topslide.............worked two controls together with my eyes on the pointer/template, and there we go. Nowhere as good as Andrew's but made in MY shed.                   Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: fumopuc on November 17, 2016, 06:14:29 PM
Hi Terry, impressive your progress with this build.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 18, 2016, 11:40:17 AM
Cheers Achim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on November 20, 2016, 12:03:08 PM
Nowhere as good as Andrew's but made in MY shed.

Doesn't matter; they look fine to me. As long as they do the job, that's what counts.  :ThumbsUp:

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 08, 2017, 08:25:12 PM
Hi all and best wishes or 2017             

I have managed to progress a bit more, it involved rather a lot of drilling and tapping of the boiler. It's something I do not enjoy because of  the risk of drill/tap breakage.  It all went well and the cylinder is now fixed. Since taking the photo I have also bolted down the weighshaft housing. Having got everything in alignment  I started to assemble the valves/rods, etc. so I could progress to setting the eccentrics on the crank. Everything remains lovely and free when I tighten to a good finger tight but stiffens up when nipped up with a spanner. :cussing: I am trying the fixing in sequence to see where the fault lies.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: steamer on January 08, 2017, 10:44:00 PM
Make sure the valve rods float vertically about the that tie bar.........

Dave
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on January 09, 2017, 02:29:09 AM
Hi Terry,
That IS a lot of drilling and tapping.  Looks very good to me!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Dave Otto on January 09, 2017, 01:07:18 AM
That's beautiful Terry you have to be pleased how it is coming together.


Dave                 
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: steamer on January 09, 2017, 03:17:54 AM
Yes its Beautiful!!!!!!

Dave
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: b.lindsey on January 09, 2017, 03:20:07 AM
Very impressive Terry. Just an amazing piece of equipment!!

Bill
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 09, 2017, 10:47:02 AM
Looking really good Terry.  :ThumbsUp:

I keep getting an itch to start machining my cylinder blocks, but I won't be able to finish them until I've re-designed the valve gear, and hence the steam ports. However, I'm not looking forward at all to drilling any holes in the boiler.

How did you ensure alignment of the drill/tap? And what sort of drill, some people recommend a mag drill but they're "HOW MUCH" expensive!

Have you thought about the governor yet? I'm about to machine the bevel gears for same. According to my CAD model the governor pulley and mating crankshaft pulley are 3/16" out of alignment. I'm not sure whether to start hacking bits off the governor casting, or just live with it and use a crossed belt, as apparently the pulleys are out of alignment on the full size engine.  ::)

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: steamer on January 09, 2017, 02:05:23 PM
Looking really good Terry.  :ThumbsUp:

I keep getting an itch to start machining my cylinder blocks, but I won't be able to finish them until I've re-designed the valve gear, and hence the steam ports. However, I'm not looking forward at all to drilling any holes in the boiler.

How did you ensure alignment of the drill/tap? And what sort of drill, some people recommend a mag drill but they're "HOW MUCH" expensive!

Have you thought about the governor yet? I'm about to machine the bevel gears for same. According to my CAD model the governor pulley and mating crankshaft pulley are 3/16" out of alignment. I'm not sure whether to start hacking bits off the governor casting, or just live with it and use a crossed belt, as apparently the pulleys are out of alignment on the full size engine.  ::)

Andrew

At least on this side of the pond....you can rent mag base drills.....just sayin.   
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 09, 2017, 09:12:01 PM
Cheers Gents,

Dave,    the problem seems to be  with the hp valve rod so I will investigate further.

Andrew,    As this is a road loco I am not fitting a governor, that is reserved for my agricultural version which is no where near as advanced.
I have to admit the holes where drilled by eye !!!    I welded an extension bar to a tapping size drill and spotted thro. using a bush in the cylinder base holes. Standing on the bench I set the drill as near perpendicular as I could and braced my arms against owt that was near :facepalm2: Tapping was done with a 12" long chuck type tap wrench which was easy to hold in position with my left hand (braced again) and spin the tap with my right. The result is pretty good. There are a couple of pics. but they are on the laptop which is mis-behaving at present.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on January 10, 2017, 11:46:46 AM
Thanks Terry, useful to know it can be done by hand. The cheapest mag drill hire I could find was £125 for a week. I'm a slooooooow worker so I'd be looking at a monthly rate.  :(

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: steamer on January 10, 2017, 02:07:50 PM
Thanks Terry, useful to know it can be done by hand. The cheapest mag drill hire I could find was £125 for a week. I'm a slooooooow worker so I'd be looking at a monthly rate.  :(

Andrew

I can understand Andrew....$150 a week isn't cheap..they cost 10X that...!    ask about a 1 month rate..?     Never know till you ask.

Dave
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 10, 2017, 02:45:33 PM
Those pics off the laptop.............
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on February 26, 2017, 09:24:26 PM
I've been busy recently but managed to get in the shed for a few "intensive" sessions.  The main activity being valve timing / setting. To make things easier I made a transparent valve so I could see all the ports. I set the forward eccentric but had to shim the reverse rod in order to set the reverse eccentric. With the expansion link as the drawing there was too much die slip. I made a longer one which sorted that out. I marked the eccentrics and removed them with the crank to cut the keyways, not wanting to rely on grub screws.
Next problem was that as yet the budget did not allow for a press for my keyway broaches. I had some wood though and cobbled one together.(see pic 2) It worked so well I am only going to replace the lower bit with some steel.
Some more bits were made and fitted. The reach rod had to be made in two bits due to limited space, but I could imagine it running soon :whoohoo:      I was so engrossed in progress that I totally forgot to use the camera enough.......apologies

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 06, 2017, 08:11:31 PM
Hello again, I've been continuing to progress of late and managed to get it to run on air...almost killed my small compressor!   It did about six revolutions but it was enough to confirm the valve setting. I have now set up for a  hydraulic test, so need to borrow the pump from work. After some head scratching I found a route for the drain cock control, so made and fitted that. The next bit will be fitting the blower assembly. I have also made a start on the motion covers but forgot to photograph them today. Will post next time.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on March 06, 2017, 09:12:58 PM
Very nice looking Terry!

Sorry if this is a silly question, but what's the ratchet thingy that shows up in that last picture?
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 06, 2017, 10:23:41 PM
Hi  Kim,     It's only silly if you DON'T ask!....... It's the oil pump. The ratchet wheel moves around a couple of clicks every time the valve rod moves back and forth and puts a bit of steam oil into the steam chest and hence into the cylinders.     Regards.....Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on March 06, 2017, 11:26:02 PM
Wow - simply beautiful work!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 19, 2017, 09:47:31 PM
One advantage of modelling in large scale is that on the odd occasion you can go "freestyle" ::)  I have decided to fit my road Burrell with a full canopy.  No drawings, just an awareness of construction and form in full size, then make it up as you go along....if it looks right, etc. I can hear the groans but it is nice to have a change from chasing thous. I can see the finished article in my mind ;) In the meantime I attach a few pics of progress on some fittings. The size of things allows me to stick weld.
The last picture is the set up I used to "adjust" the safety valve.                Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on March 19, 2017, 09:54:01 PM
Wow. (No groans from here.)
I've missed a bunch of this.

In post 131, the 2nd picture, there's a lever looking thing with a handle on either end.
I've probably missed this in the thread, but how where the handles attached?

Thanks. Keep it going!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 19, 2017, 10:02:49 PM
Hi Zee, I think the lever you mention operates the regulator which is fitted in the top of the cylinder.
 Your shop is coming along nicely, I bet you can't wait to go swarfmaking :cartwheel:     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on March 20, 2017, 12:01:26 AM
Thanks Terry.

Regarding the lever...post 131...for some reason I can't quote your post. In any case...it has a handle (nicely made by the way) on either end and a very long link/rod going from the middle to the top of the picture.

How were the handles attached to the lever? Both the lever and handles look like aluminum.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 20, 2017, 09:03:27 AM
Hi  Zee.      The lever was made from flat mild steel as were the handles. These were the socketed  and silver soldered to the ends.      Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on March 20, 2017, 10:02:27 AM
Ah, steel. Thanks.  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: steamer on March 20, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Sounds like a plan to me SCC.....

You're the president and COO of your engine company...do it however you want!   :ThumbsUp:

Dave
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 27, 2017, 09:02:52 PM
A bit more canopy progress. Nothing technical so just a few photos.....
Last photo:  "I suspect the shop Elves have just been evicted by Security"           Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Chipswitheverything on March 27, 2017, 10:22:59 PM
Yes, an elf would be no match for a deterrent of that calibre!   The engine is looking magnificent , Terry, and the airy workshop with the pictures up looks like a nice place to be to sit and review progress...     Dave
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on March 27, 2017, 11:18:06 PM
Outstanding engine!

How much do you think it weighs now?
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 28, 2017, 05:23:02 PM
Dave,    Yes I have to admit I spend too much time just sitting with a brew and "revueing"  :thinking:

Hi Crueby,     If I remember correctly the drawing puts it at about 13cwt. I plan to weigh it when finished.

Cheers     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on March 28, 2017, 05:55:42 PM
Dave,    Yes I have to admit I spend too much time just sitting with a brew and "revueing"  :thinking:

Hi Crueby,     If I remember correctly the drawing puts it at about 13cwt. I plan to weigh it when finished.

Cheers     Terry
Wow - not going to tuck that under your arm and carry it outside. Very impressive!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on March 28, 2017, 10:16:52 PM
Dave,    Yes I have to admit I spend too much time just sitting with a brew and "revueing"  :thinking:

Hi Crueby,     If I remember correctly the drawing puts it at about 13cwt. I plan to weigh it when finished.

Cheers     Terry
Wow - not going to tuck that under your arm and carry it outside. Very impressive!

Are you sure?  :thinking: How big is Terry?
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on March 28, 2017, 10:37:35 PM
Dave,    Yes I have to admit I spend too much time just sitting with a brew and "revueing"  :thinking:

Hi Crueby,     If I remember correctly the drawing puts it at about 13cwt. I plan to weigh it when finished.

Cheers     Terry
Wow - not going to tuck that under your arm and carry it outside. Very impressive!

Are you sure?  :thinking: How big is Terry?
Ummm... Good point!   :o
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 29, 2017, 05:13:54 PM
Just to clear up any mis-understandings...Terry is NOT big enough to put this thing under his arm :lolb:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on March 31, 2017, 08:32:22 PM
The day has finally arrived when I hope to extract my engine from it's bench in the shed :whoohoo:    I enlisted the help of my son in law....he was outside........I was inside   ...... and daughter and wife were on the camera.
It was a bit tight in the doorway but we made it.  Now I will set up for its hydraulic test and hopefully light a fire :pinkelephant:
When the boiler inspector has done his stuff I will finish all the rest including the lagging and boiler tins.    Still a LOT to do.           Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Admiral_dk on March 31, 2017, 08:47:38 PM
You came very close to have to "re-model" the garden "wall" in order to get it in and out, but you succeeded nicely so far  :ThumbsUp:

A very beautiful "model" (the size isn't quite model in my book, though it is scaled down) that you can be proud of  :praise2:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on March 31, 2017, 08:59:24 PM
Absolutely stunning!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on March 31, 2017, 10:13:13 PM
Wow Terry!  That's beautiful!

And a little scary! Looks like it was pretty tight in a few spots - and that short rock wall next to the pathway!
Are you going to be able to turn past that and get it out of your shed? :)

That is a real stunner! Just beautiful Terry!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on March 31, 2017, 10:29:01 PM
 :pinkelephant:

That is awesome. What an achievement!  :ThumbsUp:

To you... :DrinkPint:
or, if you prefer...
 :wine1:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 02, 2017, 05:38:42 PM
Thank you for all the kind comments.

Admiral...I take note of your observation that this may not be a model in the sense that it is not "small". I never imagined that it would take me so long to build :disappointed: At my current age it is TOO big, and I still have a second one in build in agricultural form. :ShakeHead:
Once that is done I do plan to progress on to smaller stationary steam engines so please bear with me.

Regards to all          Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Admiral_dk on April 02, 2017, 07:56:52 PM
Terry

You shall not apologize for the size at all - it is your creation and project + one to be proud about.

The reason I don't consider it a model as such (witch it is according to the "book"), is the fact that it is more than big enough to do real work for a living ....  :o .... but that is just me or more correctly my reference ....

Best wishes

Per
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 02, 2017, 09:04:39 PM
Cheers Per.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: 90LX_Notch on April 02, 2017, 10:27:56 PM
Absolutely beautiful work Terry.  As mentioned above, something to be very proud of.

-Bob
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 17, 2017, 09:12:53 PM
Made a little more progress.  Sorted all the leaks and managed to hold 240psi. The regulator has been refitted so as soon as I get the chance I will put a fire in and check safety valves, injector and pump. If all goes well send for the boiler inspecter :cartwheel:
 
There is a lot of wood on the full size one at work which I am trying to replicate . Apart from some brackets and little brass hinges it is not something I will detail.

Another distraction from swarf making is  a visit from the mutt wanting to play ::)

Lots of space in the "erecting shop" with the engine outside.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: pgp001 on April 17, 2017, 11:04:24 PM
I see its going to be an "Isaac Ball" engine then.

Phil
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 18, 2017, 05:29:00 PM
Well spotted Phil :cheers:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: pgp001 on April 18, 2017, 07:44:45 PM
I bet a few people are wondering what we are talking about !!
Which engine is it out of interest  ?

We used to own an ex Isaac Ball engine many years ago.

This is the day we had it delivered in 1965.

(http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/pgp001/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-02-02_zps3c04f8ef.jpg) (http://s456.photobucket.com/user/pgp001/media/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-02-02_zps3c04f8ef.jpg.html)


The little lad stood near the back is me, I just turned 61 last week  :old:

(http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/pgp001/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-06-02_zps10c539a9.jpg) (http://s456.photobucket.com/user/pgp001/media/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-06-02_zps10c539a9.jpg.html)


You needed to have understanding neighbours in those days.

(http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/pgp001/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-01-02_zps0a1a0995.jpg) (http://s456.photobucket.com/user/pgp001/media/Vehicles/Various%20Traction%20Engines/Mann%20Tractor/scan-01-02_zps0a1a0995.jpg.html)

It is the oldest Mann Tractor known to exist, and has since been converted to a wagon.

Phil
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 19, 2017, 08:37:14 PM
Phil, I have sent a p.m.       Love the loaded Leyland lorry........I bet that rolled a bit on corners :ROFL:

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 30, 2017, 10:10:20 PM
I've been a bit sidetracked lately but had some time this weekend so I put a fire in it :whoohoo: I had to rest a tall pipe on top of the chimney to get  a good draught and things progressed.... unfortunately the safety valves lifted at 150 instead of 160. Then I discovered the injector refused to work.  That was sort of expected as I have realised that the water supply plumbing to it is too small. I stopped the engine to check over bearings etc. It had been running with nice even exhaust beats both forward and reverse so my valve timing seems spot on. When I tried to restart it seemed reluctant :headscratch: I turned it over by hand only to find a VERY tight  spot, so the fire was dropped and left to cool and I went for my tea.
Much later I started disconnecting bits one I at a time hoping for the engine to free-up.  Piston rods....valve rods....slide bars.....water pump....bearing caps.......still tight :wallbang:   Much later I discovered that the high gear selector fork had picked up on the gear...relief!
I append a couple of pictures, as yet we have no video, please be patient.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on May 01, 2017, 01:31:59 AM
I append a couple of pictures, as yet we have no video, please be patient.

 :'( :'(
It's so hard to be patient. You ask a lot.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on June 18, 2017, 09:29:20 PM
Hi All,         Well the boiler inspector came, did the cold inspection followed by the hydraulic,  all good.  He then went on another job in the area while I put things back together and lit a fire.  He was due back at 1pm......2pm fire roaring, good head of steam....no inspector :Mad: Apparently there was a hold up at the other job (as often happens) ....By 3-15pm I had run out of coal :facepalm2: and was having problems with BOTH boiler clacks. As a result I dropped the fire to stay safe. Cue for inspector to arrive :ShakeHead:  I need to fix another date for steam test.
 In the meantime I shall take it cold and unfinished to the Isaac Ball reunion at  Fylde Vintage and Farm show this weekend. It can sit alongside the real one that has occupied my time at work these last couple of years.

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 24, 2017, 09:33:22 AM
The last few jobs on the engine were "rushed" to meet the date for the Isaac Ball reunion. As a result we never got round to the final steam test and it was exhibited "cold". (see 1st pic, it's alongside ETHEL, the 12 ton Burrell I've been putting together these last couple of years.)
I have now fetched it back home, had another fight to get in the shed and back on the bench to finish it properly.
I am going to increase the pipe size connecting front and back tanks, also the injector feed. I was dissapointed to discover that when the drawing is followed the bottom of the water gauge is 13/16ths BELOW the firebox crown!! That also will be corrected.   Still having fun though :LickLips:    Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on July 24, 2017, 10:15:06 AM
Beautiful pictures.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: fumopuc on July 24, 2017, 01:16:04 PM
Good to see it whitout any damaging back on the bench.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on August 23, 2017, 09:03:33 PM
A little more progress.   Re-painted the belly tank as it was off the engine and made bigger connecting pipe for both tanks. Also enlarged the injector supply from the back tank. Boiler inspector didn't like malleable fittings on the steam take off so made new ones from solid.  I am now in the process of some traditional wood lagging. Boiler tins next.
Off to Grindley Brook Wharf this weekend with the caravan, so will spend Sunday at Onslow park Steam rally near Shrewsbury to visit some friends.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on August 24, 2017, 12:01:53 AM
The paint looks very nice, Terry, as does the lagging.  It never ceases to amaze me, just how BIG this is!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 01, 2017, 10:47:24 PM
Hi,  Just on the off chance that there is someone out there who likes steam rollers I attach a photo that my boss took today. Me and the 12inch scale Burrell that I have been putting together for some time. It was our last steaming together.........it has been sold :'(           Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: pgp001 on September 01, 2017, 11:35:57 PM
Hi Terry

I like steam rollers.........as a child I was brought up in the coal bunker of an Aveling & Porter roller called "Billy Boy" which my dad restored back in the 60's
I bet you are gutted the Burrell has been sold, it looks superb.

Phil
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on September 02, 2017, 01:35:09 AM
Hi,  Just on the off chance that there is someone out there who likes steam rollers I attach a photo that my boss took today. Me and the 12inch scale Burrell that I have been putting together for some time. It was our last steaming together.........it has been sold :'(           Terry


Absolutely beautiful!

Thomas
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 02, 2017, 01:39:56 PM
Cheers Guys,    Phil...it's going to a good home and will be rallied :)         Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 11, 2017, 05:39:18 PM
Back to the 4 inch!  Not my favorite task...making the boiler lagging tins.  Off to visit a friend this week and borrow his rolls.(actually he has a BMW) ;)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on September 11, 2017, 09:09:54 PM
Hi Terry,
Your sheet metal parts look good.  How did you cut them all?
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 11, 2017, 09:25:53 PM
Hi Kim,       Scribed lines from paper patterns, then carefully jigsawed with a fine tooth blade. Cleaned up edges with a long file with tin clamped between two lengths of angle. Most edges are covered with brass banding anyway.

How soon will you be steaming?..................Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on September 11, 2017, 10:33:09 PM
Thanks for the detailed answer Terry.  Makes sense.
That's basically the way I'm doing it, but it looks so easy in your picture!  So I wanted to know if you had any secrets.  Other than lots of experience and practice!  :Lol:

How soon will you be steaming?
Oh, it'll be a long time for me.  I still have to make a boiler.  And since I've never done that before, it'll be yet anther learning curve for me.  But oh, what fun!  Right? :)
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 30, 2017, 10:33:15 AM
Yes Kim, a lot of fun.....what a great hobby we have :agree:

Been busy so have only just rolled my boiler tins. Camera battery was flat :facepalm2: so no pics.  Next job is fitting them and then as good a paint job as I can manage.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on September 30, 2017, 04:59:32 PM
Nice looking rolls there, Terry.
How did you get the "s" curves?  Did you make a pattern for comparison?
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on September 30, 2017, 06:59:18 PM
Hi Kim, I assume you mean the cylinder cover. It's actually spaced off the cylinder casting by an 1/8" x 1/4" steel strip at front and back to provide space for the lagging. I simply bent them first to get the shape then rolled the tin from both ends until the shape matched. The next step is to drill / tap 5ba in the casting for the brass fixing screws. I shall have to do that with a hand held drill and am not looking forward to it.
Regards           Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 15, 2017, 10:29:58 AM
Well, I think I'm on the last lap now :whoohoo:  With no room to spray inside I was planning to do the tins outdoors. The weather has been so bad I brush painted them in the shed and I'm quite pleased with the result!  The boiler layout is such that the rearmost boiler band cannot be a full circle so the top had to be fixed with a long piece of threaded rod (see pic) I have fitted motion covers, cylinder drain pipes and water lifter feed. I have also made and fitted a larger oil pot for the big end. Next move is another battle to get it out of the shed :(  Final thing will be to steam it and blow down several times to clean the boiler internals. I have made a removable seat so its away we go.  I will arrange for a video of it running and post when done.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jon Cameron on October 15, 2017, 11:05:24 AM
Looks lovely, will it be lined out eventually as well?

You've done some great work on this, and I've just been reading through the thread. I recently got the chance to drive a 4" foster and it has me itching to own an engine of my own one day. Look forward to the video.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 15, 2017, 06:05:40 PM
Hi Jon and a warm welcome to the forum. Thanks for your nice comments.  I tried lining a wheel spoke, it didn't go too well. For the time being I shall leave it as is. Maybe if I sold it I would get it lined.
Regards        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Jon Cameron on October 15, 2017, 07:02:53 PM
Lining is an acquired skill, needs a very steady hand and good brushes, usually a wrist support too, failing that masking tape to keep the sharp edges.  :)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 21, 2017, 09:13:12 PM
The weather has been so bad that my engine is still in the shed :shrug:  I cannot take it to work to store unless I get a dry period. This means that space is at a premium. Even so  I have restarted work on the second one. finished the perch bracket, welded the smoke box, etc.
I have no wish to bore folks so I will post very little...possibly just until I get a video to post of the road loco running.  We shall see.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on October 22, 2017, 10:11:09 PM
Just!      The delights of working with large scale but small equipment.  I was going to use the iron smoke box ring but is VERY hard so I didn't bother.

No more posts on this build now I promise.     Just the video of the road loco running in a week or two.   Regards to all and bye for now.

Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on October 22, 2017, 11:05:05 PM
Terry,  Looking forward to your video!
Please feel free to post, I've quite enjoyed all your posts and would love to see the 2nd one come together.

But its up to you.

Just wanted you to know, you're not boring me!  I'm finding it quite entertaining!

Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Steamer5 on October 23, 2017, 05:12:07 AM
Terry,
 I second Kim’s request on posts! Building a 4” traction engine on your size gear has got to be a challenge & setups & ideas are always most welcome by those of us still sitting thinking about how will I do that!
I was talking with dad yesterday & mentioned your build, as you have the same Mills, he was struggling to get his head around how as well!
Oh the video will also be good in due course!

Cheers Kerrin
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: 10KPete on October 23, 2017, 05:46:13 AM
I'll third that!!  I love what I've seen of your work, Terry, and I'd like to see more. A video would be outstanding!!

 :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on November 17, 2017, 08:49:53 PM
Thank you gents for your kind remarks re future posting. These last couple of weeks have seen me laid low by some sort of bug. I have done nothing, hence this late response. I went into the shop today...it's a bit crowded as the finished engine is still there. The opportunity to move/steam it has not appeared .  To cheer myself up I decided to fetch out all the bits of the second engine to have a "weigh-up". and to take family pics :thinking: I realise that I have progressed more than I thought. There is still a lot to make and to buy. Not much can happen until "no 1" is extracted so don't hold your breath! I have made a driving seat for it and my son has promised to visit and take the video. This may happen soon or not :shrug:  I live in an old terraced house in a preservation area. I have to find room in the road to line up the car / trailer/ ramps and engine and it is always crowded. Prior to that I need at least an hour to move it out of the shed, through the garden and side ginnel and onto the road. How I envy you guys with drives!  Thanks again for your encouragement. Andrew is posting again so there is still something for the BIG engine fans :Lol:          Best Wishes        Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: jadge on November 18, 2017, 10:30:23 PM
Andrew is posting again so there is still something for the BIG engine fans :Lol:

Quite so, at the current rate of progress I'll be posting for years to come.  :o

Andrew
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on December 23, 2017, 08:00:02 PM
Had some time out so continued a "tradition" that has been going on for 19 years!!.....taking grandchildren and great-grandchildren to our local Narrow Gauge "Santa Specials".Two older ones missing this year because of work :'( and one very new one not yet ready. A great time out and grandad gets his steam fix......I hope all our MEM folk have a great Christmas :cheers:   Still haven't done the video promised as the Burrell is still in the shed awaiting time / weather.        Best Wishes     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on December 24, 2017, 05:09:07 AM
Looks like a wonderful tradition, Terry!
Beautiful family!
Have a very merry Christmas :)
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 08, 2018, 11:49:21 AM
Found some more time recently so had a potter in the shop. Made and fitted the spigots inside the cylinder covers, finished all the studs for them, and marked out and drilled the slide bar support. Just waiting for the opportunity to fetch out / steam/video the "finished" engine.

Been having trouble with pictures so I hope it works this time.             Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Admiral_dk on January 08, 2018, 09:11:01 PM
Everything looks good so far - pictures included  ;)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on January 08, 2018, 10:04:02 PM
Terry, you guys working on these big 'models' amaze me.  I just can't get around how big they are!  :o
Looking good though!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on January 27, 2018, 10:17:46 AM
Having sold all the bits for my 2nd engine (mid shop crisis thread)  I had to get the 1st one out to access all the bits. To keep it safe security patrols were set up ^-^........
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on January 27, 2018, 01:06:33 PM
What Kim said. Amazing.

That is a beautiful model.  :o
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on April 30, 2018, 11:22:20 AM
After  a lot of "non-shed" time I have managed to extract the engine out of the house, onto a trailer, and take it to work.  The boiler inspector arrived and did the business. Fortunately I had solved most of the injector/ clacks/ water pump issues and we now have a legal boiler :pinkelephant:           I have just sent off for insurance and the NTET disc, so all go soon!

The mechanical lubricator is playing up so is currently being rebuilt >:(   When that is sorted I will post the video of it running.

Regards     Terry
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on April 30, 2018, 12:45:51 PM
Congrats!  :ThumbsUp: :cartwheel:

Looking forward to the video.
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on April 30, 2018, 01:10:53 PM
Congratulations!


 :popcorn:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: b.lindsey on April 30, 2018, 01:15:54 PM
That is a major hurdle Terry, and a sigh of relief no doubt that the boiler passed inspection. Also looking forward to the video.

Bill
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 02, 2018, 04:41:16 PM
Made a spacer and modified the fork to raise the nose so that it sits correct.  Ran it at the weekend :pinkelephant: Daughter took some videos.  Now need grandaughter's partner to sort out u tube/linketc.  (all too technical for me :old:)
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 02, 2018, 04:57:29 PM
Hopefully some video
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 02, 2018, 05:00:01 PM
forget it !  I will sort proper links
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 02, 2018, 05:24:10 PM
nW7mNEoDIZQhYhj9lKXL0MS_RFdX4YIWU
                                                             If this does not work you will have to forgive my incompetence and wait for family reinforcements of the IT kind :shrug:

 - family IT support activated - enjoy!
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: crueby on July 02, 2018, 06:21:38 PM
Magnificent!!!   
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: zeeprogrammer on July 02, 2018, 06:51:29 PM
The middle video didn't seem to take but the other two are excellent!
[EDIT] Now seeing all three videos. Excellent!

It's a wonderful model.  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Admiral_dk on July 02, 2018, 06:52:08 PM
Very nice engine and a fantastic runner in the last video  :praise2:
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: Kim on July 03, 2018, 05:46:20 AM
That is excellent Terry!  Thanks for going to the effort to get the videos posted, the Burrell really looks great!
Kim
Title: Re: 4"Burrell single crank compound traction engine
Post by: scc on July 03, 2018, 07:08:30 PM
Thank you gents for your encouraging comments...............Terry