Model Engine Maker

Engines => From Kits/Castings => Topic started by: Flyboy Jim on October 13, 2019, 05:38:52 PM

Title: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 13, 2019, 05:38:52 PM
Here's the official start of my PM Research #5 build.

For various reasons I got stalled out on the build of my Parsell & Weed engine. I was just getting to a tricky part (to me) of the build when I drifted away and was hesitant to try and start up where I left off............ without getting my hand back into the whole machining process first. You see........... there's folks that have, for example, 10 years experience, machining metal. Then there's those of us, like myself, that have 1 years experience, 10 times. It's actually worse in my case, in that I only have 1 years experience, 3 times!  :-\  I'll be spending a certain amount of time reading my own past build threads to get the machining gears turning again.

So ok "motormouth" what does any of that have to do with the title of this thread?  :shrug:

Well, thanks to the generosity of Thomas and Terry, I'm now the proud owner of a PM Research Coke Bottle Engine #5 that was getting "re-homed". https://www.pmmodelengines.com/shop/steam/steam-engines/steam-engine-5/ It's going to be a great project to help get me back to my machine journey here on MEM. What a great group we have here!

My build will be a little bit slow getting started (to be explained soon), but I can still get plenty done before actually cutting metal.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on October 13, 2019, 05:52:53 PM
What are waiting for? lets get going!  :lolb:
Looking forward to following along Jim.

Dave
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 13, 2019, 05:54:20 PM
Lets start this easy Jim, how about you show us your castings  :stickpoke:

Jo
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 13, 2019, 06:14:08 PM
Popcorn is ready.....
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 13, 2019, 06:41:20 PM
Lets start this easy Jim, how about you show us your castings  :stickpoke:

Jo

No Problem. Here you go Jo:  :)

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/Cast-2.JPG)

So here's my tale of woe:

About the middle of August I fell off my motor scooter (unfortunately is was moving at the time) and broke my ankle. Had surgery to put it back together with a splice plate on Aug. 28. Things were going great for the first 5 days and then a staph infection set in. I spent the next 2 weeks in the hospital having 3 surgeries to get rid of the infection. Wasn't real sure during that time if I was going to leave the hospital with my foot still attached or not. Anyway, they were able to close up about half of the 4" (imperial) incision but was left with about a 1" hole in the side of my ankle. Home for 2 weeks and then back in 9 days ago where a plastic surgeon did a "flap procedure" to fill in the hole. So far so good. That brings me to where I'm at now. The good news is that the bone has been healing all this time.

Right now I have to keep my foot elevated most of the time, but as soon as I can have my foot down for extended times I can get to work in my soon to be set up sit down machine shop. Should be easy with my Sherline equipment.

I'm excited to get going on this new adventure!

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Admiral_dk on October 13, 2019, 07:42:28 PM
Ow man - I mean, the bones can be bad enough, but the infection can be a real killer (in more ways than one)  :(

I hope that you get well soon and back to normal mobility  :cheers:

Best wishes

Per
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 13, 2019, 07:49:52 PM
Ouch!

Better that you waited for the flap procedure than just filling it with JB Weld....

Hope the rest of the healing goes well!   :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on October 13, 2019, 08:09:44 PM
Hello Jim,

Man some people will do almost anything to keep from having to take out the garbage... :lolb:

Stay off the foot until you are really ready.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Kim on October 13, 2019, 10:33:53 PM
Yowsa!  I was just about to leave you a "Good to see you getting back in the shop" post.  But now I'll change it to "It's good to hear your mending well!"

Take care and don't get ahead of yourself.

But when you're ready, I'll be here, popcorn in hand, ready to cheer you on with the Coke Bottle engine!   :popcorn:

Hopefully, you'll be back with both feet on the ground soon!
Kim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on October 13, 2019, 10:59:52 PM
Ouch! I shattered my right heal bone in a car wreck back in 1997 so I have an idea what you are going through.
Had a compound fracture and there was some concern about blood flow to the flap. fortunately it healed up ok. I did end up getting it fused a year or so later due to the pain that just never got any better.
After the fusion it hasn't given me any trouble at all.

Rest easy and take care.
Dave 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on October 14, 2019, 12:15:43 AM
Oh man, what a bummer Jim. Hope the healing continues well. Looking forward to your #5 build when you can get to it. Hoping I can get back to mine soon too.

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 14, 2019, 07:25:15 AM
Quote
About the middle of August I fell off my motor scooter
That was a daft thing to do Jim  :facepalm:

While you are recovering you will have plenty of time to do some real casting fondling and we can all look forward to seeing swarf sign  :)

Jo


P.S. Surus wanted me to mention he does not count that photo as a photo of your castings  :ShakeHead:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 14, 2019, 02:25:22 PM
Thank you guys and lady for the well wishes. Also for the gentle reminders not to over do it until healed. I shall make a point of re-reading those comments each morning.......especially now that I'm starting to feel a little friskier each day.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: J.L. on October 14, 2019, 03:18:43 PM
Hi Jim,

Your account of the event and the follow up makes me cringe! At least you are still warm and breathing! And you have a very positive outlook.

Good on you.

Take care.

John


Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 14, 2019, 04:00:55 PM
Hi Jim,

Your account of the event and the follow up makes me cringe! At least you are still warm and breathing! And you have a very positive outlook.

Good on you.

Take care.

John

Thanks John.

I've learned a couple of things from this ordeal. 1). Infection, on this level, can be a really bad thing and 2). When they tell you before surgery that 1 in 1000 can get an infection from the procedure...........you can actually be that 1000th person.  :(

Not to get all "philosophical", but this is one of those times in life I'm forced to sit back, take stock, and decide what I want to do with the rest of my life. I don't think I'm unique in this. I've sensed the same thing in reading between the lines in a lot of threads. Participating in a forum like MEM, where folks just "keep on keeping on", is better than any medication the doctors can prescribe.

Jim

PS: I'm sure by now folks are really hoping my engine kit shows up so I'll actually post something engine related!  :shrug:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: bent on October 14, 2019, 04:48:30 PM
Ow ow ow.  Get well soon Jim.
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: TerryWerm on October 15, 2019, 03:26:43 AM
All the best to you in this new adventure, Jim!  You should see the castings on your doorstep tomorrow. I too will break out the popcorn and follow along a couple of times per week as time permits. But, as others have already said, take care of that leg and don't overdo it!
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 15, 2019, 05:19:40 PM
Thanks Bent and Terry.

Terry, Columbs Day may slow the arrival slightly, but if not today certainly tomorrow.

A neighbor moved some things for me yesterday, so got a start on setting up my sit down Sherline shop. Now after seeing a picture of Chris's work area, I've got a great idea for a roll around-sit down Sherline shop. I want to be able to use it during the winter in my heated woodshop, but also want to be able to roll it out easily if I want to use my power woodworking tools.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 16, 2019, 02:56:39 AM
Look what showed up in todays mail:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/PMR__5.JPG)

More details tomorrow.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 16, 2019, 02:59:46 AM
Oboyoboyoboyoboy!!!
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 16, 2019, 09:12:08 AM
Casting fondling time  :pinkelephant: Why are they still in the box  :noidea:

Jo 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: MJM460 on October 16, 2019, 11:25:16 AM
Looking good, Jim.  I am looking forward to you you recovering enough to make a start.

But it will also be interesting to see how you plan the build before you actually start cutting metal.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

MJM460

Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 16, 2019, 02:51:56 PM
Casting fondling time  :pinkelephant: Why are they still in the box  :noidea:

Jo

Jo,

Tell Surus that that is todays project.  :) That and get a good look at the plans. That and read some more on Bill's and Eric's build threads. That and more posts here. That and more planning for my roll around Sherline shop. I'm gonna be a busy man today!  :)
.
Jim

PS: Yesterday my plastic surgeon told me to start putting my foot on the floor for short periods to start training it for real life again. "Hey no problem Doc"!  :whoohoo:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: mike mott on October 16, 2019, 04:40:20 PM
Jim just read about your situation, funny how life sets us up to reevaluate what we really want to do with our time. hope you foot heals up well and that you are mobile again soon. Looks like a nice engine project.

Mike
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 18, 2019, 02:49:21 PM
Jim just read about your situation, funny how life sets us up to reevaluate what we really want to do with our time. hope you foot heals up well and that you are mobile again soon. Looks like a nice engine project.

Mike

Thanks Mike. You hit that right on the nail head. I had major surgery 35 years ago. Totally changed my outlook on life. I can already see this present  glitch is changing what I want to do with the REST of my life.

That's where my PMR #5 build comes in. For a long time I've been thinking that I "should" get back to machining, but just couldn't quite get myself going. Then WHAM this PM Research #5 kit drops into my lap. Suddenly the "should" get back to machining turns into I "want" to get back to machining!

Jim

Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 18, 2019, 03:30:56 PM
Last we saw those castings they were still in the box   :disappointed: Come on Jim we want to see more of them  :stickpoke:

Just because you can't stand to convert them into swarf doesn't mean we can't discuss their possible machining and any potential issues  :)

Jo
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 18, 2019, 04:04:43 PM
Last we saw those castings they were still in the box   :disappointed: Come on Jim we want to see more of them  :stickpoke:

Just because you can't stand to convert them into swarf doesn't mean we can't discuss their possible machining and any potential issues  :)

Jo

 :) I'm working on that post right now, Jo. Believe me there's plenty to discuss, before any swarf flies.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 18, 2019, 04:22:37 PM
OK...... since I'm getting some ......ah.......input from this certain person across the pond...............lets get something machining related posted!  :atcomputer: Actually..... I think Jo is pretty patient....... but that Surus dude seems kind of pushy.  :Lol: Plus...... he wouldn't even let me count my cast as a casting.  :shrug:

Here's the link to PM Research for my project: https://www.pmmodelengines.com/shop/steam/steam-engines/steam-engine-5/

I've gone through the whole "Kits/Castings" section and was able to find two build threads:

Eric's (aka Cletus......aka TennesseeWhiskey) build: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,2302.0.html

Bill's (aka Bill) build: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,8015.0.html

These threads are invaluable to me. Not only for Eric's and Bill's posts, but for all the rest of the helpful info that others have posted. Since I can't do much else right now, I've been taking notes while working my way through them. I can't believe how much I've forgotten during the time I've been away.

I'm also making a list of ......ahem...... a few new tools I might need!   :whoohoo:

Jim

PS: Next post we'll start to look at this kit in more detail. In particular the machining of the "cake bottle" using my Sherline lathe and mill.

 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on October 18, 2019, 04:49:17 PM
I will try to get back on mine soon Jim. Your getting me enthused again, now just have to find the time.

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 19, 2019, 05:51:03 PM
Another 24 hours and still no signs of the castings having escaped the box   :disappointed:

Come on Jim, Surus is chomping at the bit to see these. He is becoming a real pain. And I can't even offer to buy him his own set as the UK supplier doesn't have any  :toilet_claw:

Jo

P.S. Surus hasn't see any cake bottle engines and thinks I have been holding out on him  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 12:45:24 AM
With help of neighbors who made the mistake of saying "let me know if you need anything", and after seeing the picture of Chris's Sherline shop, I was able to get my prototype shop set up. The bench will eventually be replaced with an adjustable height/roll around bench. That way when I need to use my table saw I can just roll it out of the shop.

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030632.JPG)

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030631.JPG)

OK Surus, my impatient little friend,  :pinkelephant: here's a picture of the parts out of the box:

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030634.JPG)

There weren't as many cast iron (still plenty I'm sure) parts as I thought there might be and they're really nicely done. Plans are nice as well.

I got started doing some fondling and fettling, which will be the subject of my next post (hear that Surus  :pinkelephant:)?

I'm enjoying thinking in "machining" again.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on October 21, 2019, 01:11:34 AM
Hello Jim,

Very nice layout, is this a part of your hanger.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 01:31:21 AM
Hello Jim,

Very nice layout, is this a part of your hanger.

Have a great day,
Thomas

Yes it's a 11'x 22' room that's built inside of the hanger. It houses my wood working equipment. It's easy to heat, so I'm wanting to use it in the winter. The hanger itself is heated, but is a large area keep heated to working temperature.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 21, 2019, 02:25:00 AM
Nice setup!  ...does look familiar....  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on October 21, 2019, 02:31:26 AM
Beautiful setup Jim. I like it a lot!!

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 02:46:14 AM
Thanks Chris and Bill. You two were the inspiration to start putting this sit down setup together. Was out there until my foot said it's time to stop. I think it's going to work well.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Kim on October 21, 2019, 05:18:03 AM
Nice shop you've got there Jim!
And a nuice set of castings too! :)  :popcorn:
Kim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 21, 2019, 07:23:04 AM
Thanks that worked thanks Jim   :) Surus is now busy comparing your castings with his so hopefully my life will become a little quieter and I will be allowed to make some swarf.

Looks like you have more castings in the set than I thought :thinking: The quality looks good.


I'm interested to hear about how you might tackle your castings... As you can see we will have some of our own to do one day and if someone thinks he wants a particular engine done I may even be allowed to take them into the workshop to make it ::)

Jo
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: TerryWerm on October 21, 2019, 01:39:36 PM
Jim, it is nice to see how well you are adapting to adverse conditions! There may not be as much delay to this project as you first thought!
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 02:32:14 PM
Thanks that worked thanks Jim   :) Surus is now busy comparing your castings with his so hopefully my life will become a little quieter and I will be allowed to make some swarf.

Looks like you have more castings in the set than I thought :thinking: The quality looks good.


I'm interested to hear about how you might tackle your castings... As you can see we will have some of our own to do one day and if someone thinks he wants a particular engine done I may even be allowed to take them into the workshop to make it ::)

Jo

Glad I could help Jo. We have to take care of our little helpers (or are we actually the helpers while they run the show).  :shrug:

The coke bottle and the base are the first castings I'm going to work with...........at least to the point of doing enough machine work to mount the two together. I gave it a little thought yesterday and will continue that thought process in a post today.

By the way what is the engine you show in the picture? Looks really interesting. Does Surus  :pinkelephant: know you have it? Whoops......just noticed him keeping a close eye on the parts.........he doesn't look too thrilled!


Thanks Terry. It was a huge help getting my shop set up. I've always worked standing up, but can already tell this is going to work just fine.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 21, 2019, 03:02:39 PM
By the way what is the engine you show in the picture? Looks really interesting.

That Model Bottle engine is a 1890's Bottle Frame Engine as drawn up by C J Stilson and marketed by Precision Service Company. I am not sure if they actually went into production as my Supplier was commissioned to make the prototypes and to check the drawings out. There were two basic types and the drawings included a few possible personalisations to confuse the builder  :facepalm:


:thinking: The flange on the bottom of the castings look a bit small for gripping in a chuck. What do others think? At least Jim your bottle is made of something solid. Surus' one is made of Cast Bronze so will mark if you even think of touching it, then he'll know I touched it  :facepalm2:

I'd start with the base and see how you get on with sitting at the machines  :paranoia:

Jo

P.S. I can just about get at those castings as Surus is pre-occupied waiting to pounce on the long suffering postman as he is expecting more castings ::)
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Captain Jerry on October 21, 2019, 03:14:33 PM
Jim


That is a very nice looking shop, just needs a bit of swarf to make it look right.  I like the wood floor. I put wood in my shop a few years ago because concrete is so hard on the feet. A nice side benefit is that when I drop a small part, which I do frequently, it makes a much louder sound hitting the wood and I can even follow the second and third bounce to help find it!


I resorted to a rolling chair several years ago because of leg, back and foot pain, and because of the general fatigue that comes with age.  Now, if I feel good enough to make the short walk to the shop, I can stay there all day. My shop is not as compact as yours so I have to scoot around a bit from lathe to mill to grinder.  I found that the standard 1 1/2 inch casters had a hard time with even a small chip on the floor.  I was able to replace them with larger diameter wheels with a soft tire.  It makes travel much better.  It raised the seat height a bit and that worked out well for me. My 9x20 lathe is mounted on the standard base and and the raised casters made a much better fit.


Leaning over in a chair to pick up a dropped part or tool can be a challenge so I make sure that there is a pair of long nose pliers at each work station.


Congratulations on the nice shop and getting back to it. 


Jerry
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 03:15:35 PM

That Model Bottle engine is a 1890's Bottle Frame Engine as drawn up by C J Stilson and marketed by Precision Service Company. I am not sure if they actually went into production as my Supplier was commissioned to make the prototypes and to check the drawings out. There were two basic types and the drawings included a few possible personalisations to confuse the builder  :facepalm:


:thinking: The flange on the bottom of the castings look a bit small for gripping in a chuck. What do others think? At least Jim your bottle is made of something solid. Surus' one is made of Cast Bronze so will mark if you even think of touching it, then he'll know I touched it  :facepalm2:

I'd start with the base and see how you get on with sitting at the machines  :paranoia:

Jo

P.S. I can just about get at those castings as Surus is pre-occupied waiting to pounce on the long suffering postman as he is expecting more castings ::)

That is a beautiful engine Jo! I hope you can distract Surus long enough to build yours.

I agree in that I'll start with mating the coke bottle to the base. Once that's done accurately I think the rest of the machining will go well.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 03:20:58 PM
Jim


That is a very nice looking shop, just needs a bit of swarf to make it look right.  I like the wood floor. I put wood in my shop a few years ago because concrete is so hard on the feet. A nice side benefit is that when I drop a small part, which I do frequently, it makes a much louder sound hitting the wood and I can even follow the second and third bounce to help find it!


I resorted to a rolling chair several years ago because of leg, back and foot pain, and because of the general fatigue that comes with age.  Now, if I feel good enough to make the short walk to the shop, I can stay there all day. My shop is not as compact as yours so I have to scoot around a bit from lathe to mill to grinder.  I found that the standard 1 1/2 inch casters had a hard time with even a small chip on the floor.  I was able to replace them with larger diameter wheels with a soft tire.  It makes travel much better.  It raised the seat height a bit and that worked out well for me. My 9x20 lathe is mounted on the standard base and and the raised casters made a much better fit.


Leaning over in a chair to pick up a dropped part or tool can be a challenge so I make sure that there is a pair of long nose pliers at each work station.


Congratulations on the nice shop and getting back to it. 


Jerry

Thanks for the info Jerry. Hadn't thought about the problem with the small casters. I like the idea of adapting larger wheels to a chair or stool.

I installed the wood floor last winter for the same reasons as you. I really like it.

Jim

PS: This looks interesting: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Toolstud-Adjustable-Shop-Seat-HRAS/202018314
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 21, 2019, 11:50:24 PM
The first task at hand is going to be mounting the coke bottle to the base.

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030635.JPG)

The aluminum base just needs a little cleanup. The coke bottle itself needs the bottom trued up. The trick will be truing it up so it sits perfectly vertical. The trick to do that trick will be securing it perfectly vertical or possibly horizontally.

The first way I thought of is to get a "Horizontal Milling Conversion" for my Sherline mill: https://sherline.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/6100inst.pdf If used in the "B" position I could mount the coke bottle horizontally which I think would be pretty stable.

I then tried it in my milling vice. It was actually more stable than I thought it would be, but still not the greatest.

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030636.JPG)

Next since my 4 jaw chuck was handy I tried it. Way more stable.

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030637.JPG)

Next up was my 3 jaw self centering chuck. I could mount it on the mill table perfectly centered under the spindle. If the top of the coke bottle is cast fairly accurate (looks like it is) that would get the top end in perfect position. That would just (easy to say) leave getting the base centered under the spindle. I read on Eric's build thread about filling the center of the bottom with wood in order to be able to mark the center.....so I'll explore that option.

(http://lister-engine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030638.JPG)

Jim

Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 22, 2019, 01:34:11 AM
Given the choice between 3 and 4 jaw, I'd go with the 4-jaw, have found that it can be tightened down more, and holds more securely than the 3-jaw. Also, you can put a hold-down clamp into the slot around the rim (the screw adapter or the rotary table came with one, I think) that will keep it from un-screwing itself from the table, very important when milling!

Another option is to turn the mill vise on its side to grip the casting, though it may be too rough to work well.


However it is secured, use light cuts - that is a lot of leverage up to the base of the casting.

You mention getting the base perfectly centered to mill the bottom flat. Why? The base just has to be flat and perpendicular to the rest, why does it have to be centered?

 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on October 22, 2019, 02:06:38 AM
Hey Jim

I have retrofitted both of my shop chairs to polyurethane wheels, they are about the size of roller blade wheels and not too terribly expensive; and they work great!
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=office+chair+wheels+for+hardwood+floors&crid=2XC6QY8WTV083&sprefix=office+chair+wheel%2Caps%2C218&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_2_18

Dave
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 22, 2019, 02:19:28 AM
Given the choice between 3 and 4 jaw, I'd go with the 4-jaw, have found that it can be tightened down more, and holds more securely than the 3-jaw. Also, you can put a hold-down clamp into the slot around the rim (the screw adapter or the rotary table came with one, I think) that will keep it from un-screwing itself from the table, very important when milling!

Another option is to turn the mill vise on its side to grip the casting, though it may be too rough to work well.


However it is secured, use light cuts - that is a lot of leverage up to the base of the casting.

You mention getting the base perfectly centered to mill the bottom flat. Why? The base just has to be flat and perpendicular to the rest, why does it have to be centered?

 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

My reasoning for centering was that if the top was centered and the bottom was centered then the piece must be vertical. The 4 jaw does seem better for all the reasons you listed and I'll go that way. I just need to figure out how to ensure the casting is vertical. I might be over thinking this........not the first time!   :thinking:

Definitely very light cuts.

Jim

Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 22, 2019, 02:22:06 AM
Hey Jim

I have retrofitted both of my shop chairs to polyurethane wheels, they are about the size of roller blade wheels and not too terribly expensive; and they work great!
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=office+chair+wheels+for+hardwood+floors&crid=2XC6QY8WTV083&sprefix=office+chair+wheel%2Caps%2C218&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_2_18

Dave

Those look great Dave, thanks.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on October 22, 2019, 03:09:09 AM
Another option would be to mount it to the mill table bottom side down with some shims to bring it into plumb. This could be verified using a precision square and the parting line of the casting. Then a clean up cut can be made on the upper surface. Then flip it over and skim the bottom. You could do it in stages incase some adjustments need to be made.

I would need to go back and look but I think this is how I did the bottle frame on my Pacific engine.

Dave
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on October 22, 2019, 03:15:05 AM
It starts at post 31 on my build, as I indicate I didnít take any pictures of the initial setup; but it was pretty much as I described above.

Dave
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 22, 2019, 03:21:51 AM
Another option would be to mount it to the mill table bottom side down with some shims to bring it into plumb. This could be verified using a precision square and the parting line of the casting. Then a clean up cut can be made on the upper surface. Then flip it over and skim the bottom. You could do it in stages incase some adjustments need to be made.

I would need to go back and look but I think this is how I did the bottle frame on my Pacific engine.

Dave

That's a good idea Dave. I do have a some extra material to work with.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 22, 2019, 07:38:10 AM
Surus mentioned before you start milling anything you might want to do some Casting fondling :pinkelephant: and find the centre line down the casting so that when you mount it you will know that it is going end up with the ends matching the main bottle shape.  There is one centre to find down the open side and one down the solid side with the casting line (which could be slightly off the centre line).   You might also consider a little fettling first to make it easier to hold/mark the casting   :)

Edit: I like Dave's idea of milling the top and bottom flat by clamping the bottle on its side to the milling machine base  :thinking: How about bolting an angle plate to the milling table and clamping the casting vertically against that rather than trusting on just holding the bottom of the casting ... The casting is rather tall and if it moved while milling  :paranoia:

Jo
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 22, 2019, 09:26:24 AM
Surus mentioned before you start milling anything you might want to do some Casting fondling :pinkelephant: and find the centre line down the casting so that when you mount it you will know that it is going end up with the ends matching the main bottle shape.  There is one centre to find down the open side and one down the solid side with the casting line (which could be slightly off the centre line).   You might also consider a little fettling first to make it easier to hold/mark the casting   :)

Edit: I like Dave's idea of milling the top and bottom flat by clamping the bottle on its side to the milling machine base  :thinking: How about bolting an angle plate to the milling table and clamping the casting vertically against that rather than trusting on just holding the bottom of the casting ... The casting is rather tall and if it moved while milling  :paranoia:

Jo

Thanks for the input Surus.  :pinkelephant: If I can ever find one, I'll send you a cast iron peanut to fondle.  :LickLips:

Jo, if there's one thing I have right now, it's plenty of time for casting fondling and fettling! I enjoy this kind of challenge, so will spend a lot of time figuring out the best approach and experimenting with setups. I really appreciate all the great input.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 23, 2019, 02:41:14 AM
Another option would be to mount it to the mill table bottom side down with some shims to bring it into plumb. This could be verified using a precision square and the parting line of the casting. Then a clean up cut can be made on the upper surface. Then flip it over and skim the bottom. You could do it in stages incase some adjustments need to be made.

I would need to go back and look but I think this is how I did the bottle frame on my Pacific engine.

Dave

Dave, I played with your option today. Following Chris's suggestion, I mounted my 4 jaw chuck on my mill table, I machined both the top and bottom flat with the coke bottle fairly plumb. Now I've got a flat surface top and bottom which will make it much easier to use shims to get it perfectly plumb. I've got about 1/8" of material to remove, so lots of material to work with.

Felt good to make some swarf!

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 23, 2019, 02:50:46 AM
Picture!!!  Picture!!!   
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 23, 2019, 02:55:50 AM
Picture!!!  Picture!!!

Darn .......I knew I forgot something!  :shrug: It did feel somewhat like a momentous occasion!

I think I need to get a face shield. It was a little un-nerving sitting in front of the fly cutter (in fact I ended up doing the one legged stand for most of the operation!

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 23, 2019, 03:09:52 AM
On my Sherline I have several rectangular pieces of plexi that are handy shields, depending on the setup I pick a size that I can tape to the headstock to block chips. Also have leather apron and face shield when needed.
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 25, 2019, 01:13:14 AM
Got a little more "machine fettling" done today.

The opening at the top of the coke bottle was just under .625" so, since I didn't have a .625 reamer, used a .625" drill and drilled it out to true the hole up. The finished size will be .750".

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030639.JPG)

I then turned a friction fit plug and center drilled it.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030651.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030650.JPG)

Now I can use a center drill to locate the plug and thus the top of the coke bottle directly under the spindle.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030644.JPG)

Next up is to locate the center of the bottom. I'm thinking I'll fit a plug (probably wood) to it as well.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030652.JPG)

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 25, 2019, 02:13:11 AM
Excellent! 


 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on October 25, 2019, 02:26:06 AM
Great to see more progress Jim. Any hard places in that CI casting?

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 25, 2019, 02:42:40 AM
Great to see more progress Jim. Any hard places in that CI casting?

Bill

So far I've just skimmed little off the top and bottom, but no issues so far.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Jo on October 25, 2019, 07:35:34 AM
Swarf, swarf  :pinkelephant:

Jo
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on October 25, 2019, 11:52:48 AM
Good morning Jim,

Nice to see a bit of progress, just make sure that you take care of that foot.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 25, 2019, 08:24:04 PM
Good morning Jim,

Nice to see a bit of progress, just make sure that you take care of that foot.

Have a great day,
Thomas

Thanks All.

Thomas, I had an appointment with the plastic surgeon yesterday and the orthopedic surgeon this morning. All is healing as it should (compared to a month ago when nothing was going right).

I should be able to put in a couple of hours each day in the shop working on the #5. I'm enjoying figuring out how to get a foothold on machining the coke bottle. Eric's build thread has been a huge help in that process.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 27, 2019, 11:34:05 PM
I got in a couple of hours out in the shop today.

Continuing with the "machine fettling" of the coke bottle frame, I was able to mill the base so it stood nice and vertical. Sorry about the dark pictures. I only had my cellphone in the shop today.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/IMG_0910.JPG)

Once I had gained that foothold, I mounted my fixture plate to the mill table and secured the base to it. Then I could mill the top.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/IMG_0913.JPG)

I'm not at the final dimensions yet, but I now have some accurate surfaces to work with. Also after reading about Eric's problem with the lower crankshaft bearing I checked and the unmilled surface is equal height on each side.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/IMG_0914.JPG)

So far so good!

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on October 27, 2019, 11:58:11 PM
 :popcornsmall:
 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 29, 2019, 01:50:04 AM
Got a little more done this afternoon.

Cleaned up the aluminum base. Located and spot drilled the mounting holes. Then drilled to final size. I didn't go by the location of the holes as marked on the base. Instead I went by the dimensions as shown on the plans. Not really necessary for these holes, but good practice for when I drill the holes for mounting the frame to the base.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030653.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030654.JPG)

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: J.L. on October 30, 2019, 09:17:04 PM
Good on you Jim for taking a crack each day with this project in light of the healing process and its complications.  :ThumbsUp:

John
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 31, 2019, 01:49:30 AM
Good on you Jim for taking a crack each day with this project in light of the healing process and its complications.  :ThumbsUp:

John

Thanks John. I'm getting a little more time in out in the shop each day.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 01, 2019, 02:09:11 AM
A little more time in the shop today.

After trying a couple of setups yesterday that didn't work so well, I had a great idea (too bad it was at 3:00 in the morning last night).  I centered my rotary table under the spindle and then mounted my fixture plate to it. Using the center drill that I had drilled the bushing, which I had turned to fit the hole in the top of the frame, I was able to center the top of the frame. With things slightly loose at the top, the base (which was already flattened), the base settled into position. Then securely clamped the base down. Got all carried away and figured out how to check the alignment of the top thru the full rotation of the RT with my dial test indicator. Totally unnecessary, but fun to play with! If you look closely at the milling around the circumference of the top you can see the results of my failed attempt from yesterday.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030667.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030668.JPG)

Anyway, I had a rigid setup and was able to mill the circumference of the top to spec.  :whoohoo:

I think I will leave this setup in place and mill the recess for the head and drill the mounting holes. Maybe even mill the bore. That presents another problem which I'll discuss soon.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030669.JPG)

I hope this explanation makes sense.................I'm not too sure about it myself!  :shrug:

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Admiral_dk on November 01, 2019, 12:19:30 PM
Looks to me like you are on the right track  :cheers:

 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on November 01, 2019, 12:43:47 PM
Looking great Jim. You must have the extended column on your mill to have that much headroom.

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 01, 2019, 01:09:11 PM
Looking great Jim. You must have the extended column on your mill to have that much headroom.

Bill

Admiral and Bill.

Yes, I do have the extended column ................. it's really been paying off on this project.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 12, 2019, 03:27:19 AM
Continuing to move along at my glacial pace.

I needed to bore the casting at 3/4" diameter for a length of 2 1/2". My Sherline boring bits were to short and my Arthur Warner lathe bit was too long, so I ordered a new boring bit from Shars with the intent of cutting it to the length I needed. I had enough Z to pull this operation off by 1/16".  :whoohoo:

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030675.JPG)!

I was successful and I as far as I can tell the bore is the same diameter for the entire length.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030676.JPG)

It's even round!

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030677.JPG)

Tooled up with a 3/8" end mill and trued up the top surface..............which was off by a few thou.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030680.JPG)

Then set up and milled the recess for the cylinder

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030681.JPG)

Next up is drilling the holes for mounting the cylinder.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: gbritnell on November 12, 2019, 04:08:26 AM
I have built a couple of PM's models and while I find them nicely done and supplied I just wish they would allow a little more finish stock on the castings.
gbritnell
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on November 12, 2019, 04:44:17 AM
Excellent!!   :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on November 12, 2019, 01:44:12 PM
I found that bore to be one of the trickier operations. Nicely done, especially on the Sherline!!

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 12, 2019, 02:07:26 PM
I found that bore to be one of the trickier operations. Nicely done, especially on the Sherline!!

Bill

Thanks Bill and Chris..

Machining this casting has been quite the challenge for both my Sherline mill and the operator.  :thinking: Very enjoyable.

Since you both are my "unofficial Sherline mentors" I spend a lot of time reading you two's Sherline build threads. Actually, I reread my own as well, since I can't always remember how I did some particular operation (something to do with that "CRAST" disease).  :shrug:

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on November 12, 2019, 04:08:15 PM
 :happyreader: I do the same thing sometimes - know that I made a part like that once....   :headscratch:

 :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: bent on November 12, 2019, 09:41:21 PM
Hmm, nice approach.  I think I'd use a boring head for the recess, but only because I don't have a rotary table...yet.  :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 13, 2019, 02:30:15 AM
Hmm, nice approach.  I think I'd use a boring head for the recess, but only because I don't have a rotary table...yet.  :popcorn:

I thought about using the boring head also, but found it difficult to adjust in small increments to the exact circumference I needed. Getting the bore to the exact size I needed was a challenge. It worked out great though. I got it to .002" less than the .750" I needed, so decided not to press my luck. With the end mill I could mill out to the exact circumference I needed. Then I took .010" bites at a time and just went around and around until I got the recess to a depth of .062.

I hope you're able to get a RT soon. It really does open up a whole new realm of machining possibilities!

Jim

 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: mike mott on November 13, 2019, 02:59:52 PM
Nicely done on the boring and facing Jim. I'm impressed with that much distance away from the clamped surface that the casting was rigid enough to do the recess without some form of supplementary support. Of course nothing to say about your skill in pulling it off. :whoohoo:

Mike

 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 15, 2019, 04:07:06 AM
Nicely done on the boring and facing Jim. I'm impressed with that much distance away from the clamped surface that the casting was rigid enough to do the recess without some form of supplementary support. Of course nothing to say about your skill in pulling it off. :whoohoo:

Mike

Thanks Mike,

If the bore needs some additional truing, I might be able to use these hand reamers that I bought at an estate sale a while back. That is, if they'll work with cast iron and if I actually learn how to use them!  :shrug: Need to learn more.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030683.JPG)

Decided not to drill for the cylinder, at this point, since there are some critical alignment requirements that need to be met and I'm not sure how to factor those in yet. Don't want to back myself into a corner.

So I mounted the top of the frame in the 4 jaw and took a light (very light) cuts on the base to finish truing it up (was only a few thousands off, relative to the top).

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030685.JPG)

Did a little milling of the sides of the base in preparation for drilling the holes for mounting the frame to the base. 

Not a lot of progress...........but progress just the same.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: mike mott on November 15, 2019, 05:55:29 AM
Nice work there Jim. Those reamers aren't to shabby either.

Mike
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on November 15, 2019, 01:24:39 PM
Great progress Jim.  When you do get to boring the cylinder, I would suggest holding it by the top end so you can bore the cylinder and true the base in one chucking.
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 15, 2019, 02:06:25 PM
Great progress Jim.  When you do get to boring the cylinder, I would suggest holding it by the top end so you can bore the cylinder and true the base in one chucking.

Thanks Mike and Chris. Also thanks for the tip Chris, I've got it duly noted.  :ThumbsUp: While going through Bill's build thread, I've noticed that there's a lot of operations needed for the cylinder. At least it's bronze and not cast iron.  :whoohoo:

Speaking of cast iron. I was milling (or trying to mill) the mold seam mark on the edge of the base (you can see it in the last picture above). Man is that little nub hard!  :wallbang: Might be time too order that Foredom system I've always wanted.  :cartwheel:

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Hans on November 15, 2019, 03:43:01 PM
Jim, I would hit that seam with a 4-1/2" grinder.

~Hans
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: bent on November 15, 2019, 07:01:09 PM
Was going to say the same as Hans, but I'd use a stone on a dremel tool, or a hand stone, or a file and take the fins/gates/parting lines off.  That's called fettling...or fondling if you're Jo. ;D
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on November 15, 2019, 07:07:54 PM
Second grinders/sanders on those, hard spots/sand/etc can really chew a mill up.


Now, if you NEED an excuse to by another tool like the Foredom, I'll back you up that its a good reason!   ::)

I do have another brand flex shaft tool, also have a Foredom that I picked up later. The off brand one has worked well for many years, it just chews through brushes on the motor faster than I'd like. Still working though! Very handy tools for carving work. I don't use it much for the engines, tend to use the 1" belt sander for those things. Another nice one is the little air-powered handpieces like the TurboCarver, which takes dental burs, runs around 400,000 rpm. Not for removing lots of material, but great for fine detailing, I use it for shaping valve ports.
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on November 15, 2019, 07:42:49 PM
I'll second the thoughts on Foredom. Quality stuff, not cheap as you know, but worth in in my opinion. Much like Sherline, they take a system view so things work together well

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 16, 2019, 02:30:18 AM
Now, if you NEED an excuse to by another tool like the Foredom, I'll back you up that its a good reason!   ::)

Yes..............nothing  like having a good "enabler" for a friend!  :ThumbsUp:   :lolb:

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 17, 2019, 03:15:49 AM
Continuing on .......I got the mounting holes drilled in the frame.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030686.JPG)

Then drilled and tapped the base.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030687.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030688.JPG)

Family shot..............a really small family!  :shrug:

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/normal_P1030689.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030691.JPG)

Now that I have the frame accurate at both ends I think it's time to start on the crosshead casting and see if my bore turned out as accurate as I think it did.  :thinking:

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on November 17, 2019, 01:33:43 PM
More nice work Jim. Before long I will be looking to your thread for guidance ...these days shop time is definitely hard to find...but thoroughly enjoying your build.

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 17, 2019, 02:24:42 PM
More nice work Jim. Before long I will be looking to your thread for guidance ...these days shop time is definitely hard to find...but thoroughly enjoying your build.

Bill

Thanks Bill. Getting control of the cast iron frame has certainly been a process (enjoyable) for me. Now I'm looking forward to just ( :lolb:) adding parts until it starts running.  :Lol:

Your build thread (using the same machines) has been (and will continue to be) a huge help. As is your P & W thread.

Jim

 
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Kim on November 17, 2019, 05:54:32 PM
...these days shop time is definitely hard to find...

Bill
Maybe you should go back to work, Bill!  Retirement doesn't seem to be giving you much shop time! :)

Enjoying your build, Jim!  :popcorn:
Kim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 19, 2019, 03:35:40 AM
I pulled the risers off of my lathe today and got started on the Crosshead casting. Nice to be working with bronze. Set it up in the 4 jaw and indicated it as close as I could.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030692.JPG)

Turned the shaft to .250 as called out.


(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030693.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030694.JPG)

Drilled and tapped for the linkage rod.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030696.JPG)

Reversed the casting and turned it down to fit the bore in the frame. It fits right nicely.  :whoohoo:

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030697.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030699.JPG)

Feels good to be back doing some lathe work.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on November 19, 2019, 04:22:32 AM
 :whoohoo:




I've noticed that you use collets in both your lathe and mill. Which type, and how much range does each collet have, above or below each nominal size? Do the sizes meet, or does the stock have to be right on the collet size?
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on November 19, 2019, 09:01:03 AM
Hello Jim,

Looking real good and enjoying following your "process" for each part.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 19, 2019, 02:18:27 PM
:whoohoo:




I've noticed that you use collets in both your lathe and mill. Which type, and how much range does each collet have, above or below each nominal size? Do the sizes meet, or does the stock have to be right on the collet size?

Thanks Chris and Thomas. It's good to be back to machining.....................even if it does go rather slow.................not being able to walk yet. That should end soon. I'm 12 weeks since the initial surgery to splice my fibia back together, so should get signed off for weight bearing this Friday when I see the orthopedic surgeon.

Chris, to answer your question, the collet you see in the last photo I posted is the 1/4" one out of this Sherline set:  https://www.sherline.com/product/30603090-mill-collet-sets/ They have very little adjustment.
The ER-16 collet holder that I use most of the time is a Taig lathe accessory: https://taigtools.com/product/er-16-adapter-for-3-4-16-spindle/ I had to machine a small shoulder off in order for it to work with the Sherline spindle.
I found a good price on Amazon for a set of Royal collets:  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004HW7MA8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 I see they're no longer available, but there are others out there..........just so they're fairly good ones. Mine go from 1/16" to 3/8" in 1/32" steps and have enough adjustment to work for anything (IE the sizes meet). I noticed that, for some reason, some of the sets I looked at left one of the sizes out (can't remember which one) so left a gap.

Beall makes an ER-32 collet chuck that looks interesting: http://www.bealltool.com/products/turning/colletchuck.php

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 21, 2019, 02:52:42 AM
Continuing on with the Crosshead. Mounted it in my 5C collet block and leveled it.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030700.JPG)

Mounted the collet bock in my vise and drilled and reamed to 3/32" as called out.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030702.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/normal_P1030703.JPG)

Milled the shoulder flat on both sides.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030704.JPG)

Next up is the slot for the connecting rod.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 24, 2019, 02:51:32 AM
Continuing on, stood the collet block on end and milled the slot for the connecting rod. Gotta get some better lighting for pictures.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030706.JPG)

Machined a filing button in order to file the half rounds, although I never did file down to it. Should of made it a little larger.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030707.JPG)

A little cleanup and I'm calling this part done.  :cartwheel:

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030709.JPG)

Jim

PS: Got the ok yesterday to start bearing some weight on my right ankle using a walker.  :whoohoo: It's nice to be standing on my own 6 legs!
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on November 24, 2019, 04:08:05 AM
Good news on the ankle  :ThumbsUp: Nice work on that crosshead too!!

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Kim on November 24, 2019, 05:40:21 AM
Nice filing button, Jim! That is interesting how you did that - with just one filing button.  I've always made two - one for either side.  But this seemed to work pretty well for you.  I'll have to keep that in mind. :)

Great to hear you can start putting weight on your ankle!  You you just have to build up slowly.  Don't over do it!  Do what the good doctor tells you, right?  :ThumbsUp:

Kim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Roger B on November 24, 2019, 08:42:28 AM
That's some nice work  :ThumbsUp:  :ThumbsUp:  The hand reamers you mention in post 83 are actually Acrolaps or equivalent:

http://acrolaps.com/index.htm

I use then with diamond paste for finishing my cylinders but you need an ultrasonic bath for cleaning afterwards. I am sure that other abrasives will work I just haven't tried them.
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 27, 2019, 03:15:25 AM
Thanks Guys.

Kim, the filing button was actually a little small, but it still helped to keep each side uniform as I filed them.

Roger, thanks for the info on Acrolaps. These seem to be a brand X, but are pretty nice and I think will be helpful once I learn how to use them.

I got started on the Lower Head Casting.

Turned the shoulder to fit into the mainframe.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030710.JPG)

Drilled and reamed for the piston rod and the the packing gland.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030713.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030714.JPG)

Turned the Lower Head Casting around and trued the face and turned to the correct diameter to fit into the recess in the mainframe.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030716.JPG)

That left a small area that couldn't be turned to the correct diameter to I made a mandrel to hold it while I turned that bit of metal off.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030717.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030718.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030719.JPG)

Everything fits so far. I'll show a picture of that in the next post.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: TerryWerm on November 28, 2019, 05:09:04 PM
Nice to see the great progress you are making!  It's been almost three weeks since I checked in here, so I had some catching up to do, but I am really enjoying your build.

I was going to comment about your 'reamers' being laps, but Roger beat me to it, so no need to say more about them.

Happy Thanksgiving!
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on November 29, 2019, 04:14:05 AM
Nice to see the great progress you are making!  It's been almost three weeks since I checked in here, so I had some catching up to do, but I am really enjoying your build.

I was going to comment about your 'reamers' being laps, but Roger beat me to it, so no need to say more about them.

Happy Thanksgiving!

Thanks Terry. Certainly not rapid progress, but I'm moving in a forward direction and enjoying myself.

Yes Roger set me straight on my lap set. Not a lot of info about them, but I did find this post that Brian made a while back: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?topic=4113.0
Also this one by Ramon: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,1908.0.html

Happy Thanksgiving to you as well.

Jim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on December 01, 2019, 04:20:59 AM
As I mentioned in the last post, here's a pic of the Lower Head Casting sitting in the Main Frame.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030721.JPG)

Turned, drilled and reamed the Packing Gland out of bar stock.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030723.JPG)

Centered the RT on the mill and moved the chuck over. Drilled the mounting holes in the Packing Gland

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030726.JPG)

Moved the chuck back to the lathe and parted off the Packing Gland.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030727.JPG)

Mounted the Lower Head Casting on the arbor, put it in the 3 jaw and mounted the chuck on the RT. Drilled and tapped the mounting holes for the Packing Gland.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030729.JPG)

While it was there I drilled the mounting holes.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030730.JPG)

It's nice to see a few parts that will become an assembly.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030731.JPG)

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030734.JPG)

There's still a little machining to do to the Lower Head Casting, which I'll do later.

Jim

Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: crueby on December 01, 2019, 02:32:32 PM
 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: b.lindsey on December 01, 2019, 02:34:58 PM
Coming along great Jim!! Still enjoying following your progress.

Bill
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Dave Otto on December 01, 2019, 04:32:04 PM
Nice work Jim, everything looks great!

Dave
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Kim on December 01, 2019, 05:59:24 PM
Great work on all those little brass parts, JIM!  :popcorn:
Kim
Title: Re: Flyboy Jim's PM Research #5
Post by: Flyboy Jim on December 08, 2019, 03:46:47 AM
Thanks guys.

Got a little work done on the Cylinder Head.

Clamped it in the 4 jaw and turned the bottom flat.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030735.JPG)

Reversed it in the chuck and moved the chuck to the mill on the RT. Drilled the mounting holes.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030737.JPG)

Then, using Bill's idea in his build thread, I turned an arbor, drilled and threaded mounting holes to match the holes in the Cylinder Head.  I was then able to mount the Head on the arbor in the 3 jaw and turn the OD.

(https://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10010/P1030740.JPG)

Jim