Model Engine Maker
Engines => From Plans => Topic started by: Bear on March 28, 2020, 03:44:15 PM
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Have not built my first engine yet. I only have a Taig lathe. No milling machine yet; however, Taig has a milling attachment available for the lathe that is not terribly expensive. I don't want to pay for a kit or for plans at this point. I do have other tools such as measuring devices, grinder, and a small cut-off attachment for my angle grinder.
I would like it to be a small engine; but, not miniature. Suggestions as to a good beginner engine with the lathe I have now, or with the addition of the Tag lathe milling attachment would be greatly appreciated.
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A great set of engines to start with, from very simple designs through some complex ones, set up for minimal machine tools are the collection of Elmer's Engines. They were originally published years ago, this site has them available for download:
http://www.john-tom.com/html/ElmersEngines.html
There is also someone with digital copies of his book that are very good, I don't have a bookmark to that site but sure someone here will post it.
Great engines to get comfortable with the new lathe, I think almost all of us here have built some of them.
Chris
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Yeah, the Taig milling attachment for the lathe isn't too expensive ($67) and I found it to be well worth it. The several projects I did were done with that attachment. It was worth it for me, even though I eventually got the mill. If I'd know I was going to buy the mill, I could have saved $70 by just getting the mill and skipping the lathe attachment. But it was worth it because I was able to do several projects which helped me see that this was a hobby that I wanted to invest in more.
If you get the mill attachment, you'll also need a set of collets to hold the end mills. You don't want to hold those in the 3-jaw chuck! :zap:
Glad to hear you're enjoying playing with your new Taig! :)
Kim
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Thank you, Chris and Kim. I will check out the Elmer's Engines. As for the milling attachment, I do intend to purchase a mill, hopefully sooner than later. I guess the $70.00 might be better spent toward a mill.
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In Post #5 in your "Lathe Opinions" thread I provided a link to the first engine I built: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,5886.msg114972.html#msg114972
It's a very simple wobbler with a good YouTube tutorial. Much simpler than the Elmer's #25 wobbler that I built next: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,5933.0.html
Jim
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Thanks, Jim. I looked at that one again. Doesn't it require a mill? I guess I could make the parts that don't require a mill, and then do the mill parts after I get my mill.
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The two engines in my avatar picture are Elmer's "Tiny", full scale and half scale. They were made before I had a mill. I only used my lathe and drill press. The flat surface on the columns were machined on the lathe by bolting the column to a plate mounted on the lathe that was made from a 2.5 pound weightlifting plate. The flat on the connecting rod was done by mounting it to the tool holder on the lathe compound and running an endmill in the three jaw chuck.
A big part of being successful in machining is creative work holding, toolmaking and setups. In the ten years that I have been in this hobby, the amount of tooling that I have made is crazy. I've made clamps, fixtures, boring bars, punches, dies, sine bar, cutters, collets, faceplate, gages, holders, etc.
-Bob
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For anyone building a first engine, I always recommend a Webster. Thousands of them have been built, the plans are free, and there are about a thousand build threads on the small engine websites about everything you ever wanted to know about a Webster engine.---Brian
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Thank you, Brain and Bob. I will check those out.
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Here's a link to a build of Elmer's Tiny using only a lathe and drill press: http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?topic=512.0 I'm sure there are other build threads out there as well.
Jim
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Thank you, Jim.
This forum is excellent. You are all extremely helpful. :)
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Thought I would give an update. Been practicing with my Taig lathe still. However, to be perfectly honest, I am still attempting to choose an engine to build. I guess I am a little apprehensive of jumping in and getting started. With that said, I am really looking forward to making my 1st engine.
I am also trying to decide on a milling machine. Probably Taig or Sherline (been researching). Of course, I will need a good source for the metal, after I finally figure out the engine to build.
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Hi Bear one thing to remember is that an exactly 1" rod will not go into an exactly 1" hole !!! ...so good luck with your first engine
Willy
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Thought I would give an update. Been practicing with my Taig lathe still. However, to be perfectly honest, I am still attempting to choose an engine to build. I guess I am a little apprehensive of jumping in and getting started. With that said, I am really looking forward to making my 1st engine.
I am also trying to decide on a milling machine. Probably Taig or Sherline (been researching). Of course, I will need a good source for the metal, after I finally figure out the engine to build.
Metal sources: https://www.speedymetals.com
https://www.onlinemetals.com
Jim
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Also check if there are any local metal suppliers - sometimes the commercial suppliers will sell 'drops', the offcuts from long stock, at very good prices. Worth asking around. Another online place with big selection is McMaster-Carr. Worth comparing prices at all three (with the two that Jim mentioned) - when you figure in shipping, sometimes either of the three will be cheapest, it varies a lot. McMaster does not have shipping estimator online, but they will quickly quote what you have in your shopping cart with an email or call. For larger diameter bars, places like Yarde Metals have a Drop Zone section on their website with the current selection of drops - great prices, but selection changes, and they usually only have larger diameters/thicknesses.
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I appreciate the responses. I'll get there eventually. Hopefully sooner than later.
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Hi Bear one thing to remember is that an exactly 1" rod will not go into an exactly 1" hole !!! ...so good luck with your first engine
Willy
Willy there is a way to get a 1" rod in a 1" hole, it works best if the metals are dissimilar, one goes in the freezer the other you heat up. Haven't done one in years, but used to make rods with balls on each end and a ring in the middle.
Gerald.
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Hi Bear one thing to remember is that an exactly 1" rod will not go into an exactly 1" hole !!! ...so good luck with your first engine
Willy
Willy there is a way to get a 1" rod in a 1" hole, it works best if the metals are dissimilar, one goes in the freezer the other you heat up. Haven't done one in years, but used to make rods with balls on each end and a ring in the middle.
Gerald.
Or a bigger hammer.... :hammerbash:
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Well, I finally decided (I think ;D) on a simple engine that I could do with a milling attachment for my Taig lathe. It is called the "Simple Oscillating Steam Engine" that I found on a website under the name of Steve's Workshop uk. Excellent plans and even a tutorial with pictures.
Now I need to either get a milling machine. I have been looking very hard at the Taig manual mill (wish they had a discount code) or the possibility of just using a milling attachment for my lathe. I also need to scrounge up the materials. Having access to the plans helps immensely in this regard :).
Any words of wisdom regarding the Taig mill or milling attachment would be greatly appreciated. There is a world of difference in price; however, if I am going to end up with the mill eventually, might as well save the money and forego the attachment.
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I have no opinion on your choice of Taig lathe or not but I can say you've made a good choice of engine for a first attempt. I say that because that was the one I chose for a starter and it taught me a good deal.
Jim
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That engine looks great, Jim. I am looking forward to my first try.
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The milling attachment for the Taig lathe is quite capable, but has a very small work envelope. I don't remember exactly but it seems like the "large" axis is about 4" and the shorter one is maybe 2.5"-3". Again I'm not certain on this, but it is pretty small. I remember having to do longer parts in two setups - first mill one length down to size, then preposition the part over a few inches and do it again.
For the price it is great. And it gives you some good capabilities. While it can't compete with the capabilities of the full mill, it is 1/10th the price!
So its all whether you want to spend 10x more and have more capabilities now, or spend less and have some fun, then spend the additional money in a few years (if you choose to, of course :)). That's a decision that only you can make.
Kim
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Kim, I have decided on the mill as opposed to the attachment. Thanks for your input.
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Excellent choice!
(of course, you know i'd have said that regardless of which path you'd chosen. Because both choices are good:))
If you order from Nick Carter, you'll get 10% off. That's the best deal I know about for Taig equipment.
Kim
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Thanks for the heads-up, Kim. Now I am waiting on a call back from a local metals supplier on
prices for brass and aluminum. I previously obtained 6061 aluminum round stock from them for $12.00 for a 2 ft length in 1 1/8 diameter.
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Was wondering if for this 1st engine, I could substitute aluminum for the brass it calls for in many of the parts. The brass is a little pricey, and as a first engine, I don't want to waste any, if I mess up.
I don't see any reason I could not substitute, other than aesthetics. What are your opinions?
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Was wondering if for this 1st engine, I could substitute aluminum for the brass it calls for in many of the parts. The brass is a little pricey, and as a first engine, I don't want to waste any, if I mess up.
I don't see any reason I could not substitute, other than aesthetics. What are your opinions?
Hi Bear, one of the things we learn over the decades is how to de-mistake parts as we go along..!!! Aluminum can be tricky to machine as it tends to tear when being machined unless the perfect tool profile ,correct speed ,suitable suds etc etc etc also when making parts it is best to bore the holes first and then turn the spigots, rods... Also you learn far more on the first engine than the following ones... hope this is helpful
Willy
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Very helpful, Willy. Thank's.
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Was wondering if for this 1st engine, I could substitute aluminum for the brass it calls for in many of the parts. The brass is a little pricey, and as a first engine, I don't want to waste any, if I mess up.
I don't see any reason I could not substitute, other than aesthetics. What are your opinions?
My first engine was aluminum, with some steel (fly wheel and piston) and brass (brazing rod). I think it boils down to whether you want to build a great looking first engine or to learn how to accurately machine parts or in many cases re-machine parts!. :facepalm: These engines are all made up of individual parts any of which can be re-done later in a fancier material.
Here's a possibility for you for a starter engine kit: https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2594&category=386435363 It looks a lot like the first engine I built.
Just my take on things.
Jim
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Most Grades of aluminium are difficult to machine with Tipped/Tungsten tools
Grade 1100 aluminium bar stock is 99.9% pure.....soft and not friendly to machine
Grade 2011 aluminium bar stock has a few 0.% in the brew :stir: of lead, copper, bismuth......lovely to machine with HSS cutting tools and kerosene as the cutting fluid
If the engine were to be run even on [lubricated] air, using dissimilar materials would pay dividends.....an aluminium cylinder with a bronze piston would certainly be acceptable
https://www.ryerson.com/resource/the-gauge/aluminum-bar-which-grades-make-the-grade
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Jim, at this point, as you have referenced, I am more inclined to go for function and fit over form. I would rather just use materials I can easily get here. I will be picking up a bunch of aluminum round bar tomorrow (very good prices at the local metal dealer). I also was able to get a hold of a 1.5" square piece of aluminum.
Derek, the only aluminum I have, and that I will be obtaining tomorrow is 6061. I see in the link that you provided, the 6061 get a "B" for "machinability". I guess it will have to do.
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Jim, at this point, as you have referenced, I am more inclined to go for function and fit over form. I would rather just use materials I can easily get here. I will be picking up a bunch of aluminum round bar tomorrow (very good prices at the local metal dealer). I also was able to get a hold of a 1.5" square piece of aluminum.
Derek, the only aluminum I have, and that I will be obtaining tomorrow is 6061. I see in the link that you provided, the 6061 get a "B" for "machinability". I guess it will have to do.
I've had great luck machining 6061. I use WD40 for lubricant. Smarter folks may have more input.
Jim
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Hi Bear,
I have been following your thread with interest. A few years ago now I went through much of the same process as you are doing now. Bought the lathe, then found it would be really good to have a mill as well, and tried the accessory for the lathe.
I have to say I was a bit disappointed. Rigidity is everything, well, almost everything, and I did not find the accessory rigid enough. I am sure a more experienced machinist than me would have done more with it, but I set about saving for a mill. I spent a bit more to get a dovetail slide for the head raising and lowering, and geared speed change with no belts. I have been very pleased with it.
I like that engine you have chosen. It is very similar to some of my early efforts. Despite the price, I prefer brass or bronze for parts that will wear over aluminium, but many successful engines have been made in aluminium, so I would not discourage you either way. As Willy says, you learn to redesign around you mistakes so most of the material is salvaged and often the part.
By the way you don’t need a mill to machine that flat face on the cylinder block. Turn the cylinder sideways in the four jaw, set so the cylinder axis is really parallel to the face of the chuck, (it is worth doing this really well) and machine the flat as a facing cut.
It does not have to be perfectly centred, which is another skill to learn, but if you can get the centre somewhere within the circle of the pivot pin, you will get a nice symmetrical machining pattern. Amazing what you can do with the four jaw, especially when you set the material eccentrically.
Looking forward to seeing some progress.
MJM460
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I appreciate the tip, Jim.
MJM, thanks for the pointers. I will have to try to mill a flat surface on round stock with my 4 jaw. The inexpensive aluminum will come in handy for practice. I will eventually break down and buy some brass or bronze.
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Bear....there is a very recent oscillator build here on MEM & the owner installed a 0.005" thick UHM [plastic] shim between the cylinder valve plates & the mating centre column surface
http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,9630.msg217388.html#msg217388
Derek
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Thank's, Derek. I guess the issue with aluminum to aluminum is wear? If so, not so concerned about that at this time. At this time, my goal is to make an as precise as possible (for me) engine that functions well. Am I missing something, since I cannot, due to lack of experience, "see the forest for the trees"?
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I think that brass is called for in such situations because it is to a certain extent "self lubricating" and mating surfaces slide across each other easily. (no doubt other more learned voices may correct me but I'm speaking from experience). Aluminium, being softer, can catch and raise burrs and bind up in such places. This can be mitigated by the use of a lubricant between mating faces but they will still wear quicker than brass.
In short - go for it. As I see it your objective is to learn how to use your machines rather than produce a long lasting engine.
Jim
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Seconding what the others said - always best to have parts that move agaist each other be made of different metals. Otherwise they can were and gall, sometimes very quickly.
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Thank's guys. You hit it right on, Jim; my objective is accurate machining and initial function, for now.
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Update: I purchased a new Taig milling machine, and have used it a little so far. It is a very nice milling machine, and I am very pleased with my purchase. I have been messing around with it just to try it out. However, I am working on the cylinder for my engine, and I used the mill to put the flat on the cylinder.
The cylinder is to length. I need to find a 12 mm reamer for the bore, after I drill the bore. My next step is to drill the offset bore. I have not built the frame yet because i need the material. I do have material that is half of he thickness called for, and I am considering doubling it up, maybe with rivets, and proceeding in that manner. I will use wood for the base.
I did make a practice piston; but, the length of the rod is too long. I will have to make another. Part of the fun.
Between the lathe and the mill, I can't stay out of the "shop". Enjoying :).
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Update: I purchased a new Taig milling machine, and have used it a little so far. It is a very nice milling machine, and I am very pleased with my purchase. I have been messing around with it just to try it out. However, I am working on the cylinder for my engine, and I used the mill to put the flat on the cylinder.
The cylinder is to length. I need to find a 12 mm reamer for the bore, after I drill the bore. My next step is to drill the offset bore. I have not built the frame yet because i need the material. I do have material that is half of he thickness called for, and I am considering doubling it up, maybe with rivets, and proceeding in that manner. I will use wood for the base.
I did make a practice piston; but, the length of the rod is too long. I will have to make another. Part of the fun.
Between the lathe and the mill, I can't stay out of the "shop". Enjoying :).
Well done Bear. I think you made a good decision to go ahead and go with a mill.
Early on I bought this set of reamers: https://www.amazon.com/Grizzly-T10085-7-Piece-Chucking-Reamer/dp/B006SJK3BI/ref=sr_1_16?dchild=1&keywords=chucking+reamer&qid=1586916487&sr=8-16 I've added a few other sizes, but have used these a lot.
I also bought this basic set of stub (screw length drills): https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B0XJ08O/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1 I've since bought a nice set of screw length numbered drills to go with them.
Have you got the picture thing figured out yet. We love pictures.
You might consider doing a build thread for your engine (although you're kind of doing that already). The nice thing about build threads is that they're a great way to document your work, as well as ask for input. The one's I've done have been a huge help for me.
Jim
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Thank's, Jim. I will see about posting some photos.
I have a question as to alternatives to a reamer for boring. The length of the cylinder is 30mm, open on both ends. Is there a boring bar that would work on the Taig lathe to bore to that length? With the standard Taig boring bit (1/4"), would it be possible to bore from each end after precisely reversing the piece in a 4 jaw (independent jaws) chuck?
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If the Taig takes 1/4" tools then one of the 6mm insert holders and a CCGT tip would do the bore all from one end, this sort of thing.
https://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Cutting-Tools/Lathe-Turning-Tools-Indexable/ARC-Indexable-Turning-Tools/ARC-S-SCLC-R-95-Boring-Tool-Holders
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The cylinder bore needs to be a single cut, you cannot do it half way and turn it round :hellno:
You could use a milling cutter held in the lathe tool post as a boring tool :)
Jo
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Jason and Jo, I appreciate the responses. As to the boring bar, I was wondering if it would be stable enough at only 1/4" at that length. I'll need to check the US market for a similar item.
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My small-diameter boring bar is 1/4" diameter, and I've used it to do 2.5" deep holes in steel. It does take some experimenting sometimes with speed and height/angle to keep it from chattering, depending on the material. For aluminum or brass, no problem.
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That sounds good, crueby. Now I need to find a USA source. Thank's.
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I did a little internet research, and have decided to make a holder for a 3/8" boring bar now that I have a milling machine.
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On boring bars, I have had bad luck with the ones with a carbide tip brazed on, most are garbage. Better results with ones that take inserts or are sold carbide or cobalt steel.
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That sounds good, crueby. Now I need to find a USA source. Thank's.
I got this boring bar, a while back for my PMR #5 build: https://www.shars.com/3-8-scxcr-indexable-boring-bar
I've purchased quite a bit of stuff from Shars and have been satisfied.
Jim
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I did a little internet research, and have decided to make a holder for a 3/8" boring bar now that I have a milling machine.
That's the part that worries me. What do you mean by a holder? Does it allow adjustment for the cutter to move in the XY plane?
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Good point Zee. When we started talking boring bars, I was thinking of the type used on a lathe. For the mill, there is a boring head that adjusts for diameter, holding a bit also termed a boring bar a lot of the time. Bear, which were you referring to? Both can do the same thing, some differences.
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Crueby, I would like to be able to afford a solid carbide one. Also, see below as to your last post.
Jim, thank's for the link. I signed up for the email from them, and am considering that item. I will look to see if they have a 5/16"shank.
Carl, the "holder" I am almost done making fits in the Taig lathe tool post. I will not be able to change the height; but, I did drill the boring bar holder hole on the lathe, hoping that will center it's height. I have Almost completed the holder. Left it installed in the toll post, after milling operations, and I have drilled it to 5/16" so far. Before I proceed, I have to decide on a either a 3/8" or 5/16" shank boring bar. If I decide on the 5/16", all I need to do is drill and tap 2 holes to hold the boring bar with set screws.
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Like Chris, I also use a boring head on the mill, as you need to adjust the position incrementally and accurately to maintain depth of cut as the diameter of the hole progressively increases. The process is to drill a suitable starter hole, then enlarge the hole towards the required size by small adjustments of the boring head. I can’t think of how you would do this with any easily made or simple home made holder. Approach final size carefully with a few final spring removal cuts as you get close.
For the lathe, again like others, I clamped a square bar of steel in the tool post, and first drilled a bit under size using a drill chuck in the headstock. For final sizing, a reamer is usually recommended, but the right size end mill cutter also works well. Three set screws in the side of the bar hold the tool securely.
The tools for the boring head, also available as a separate small set seem to have the top face on the centreline of the shank. So top flat gives zero top rake for brass and bronze, and rotate the tool a little for top rake for carbon steel and especially for stainless steel. As this will affect the tip height, I should have placed a suitable packer under the block before boring the holder block, so removal of the packer gives suitable top rake, replacing it gives the zero required for brass and bronze. Currently I mostly use it on brass and bronze so zero top rake is fine.
My mentor made a boring bar from 3/8 inch silver steel and brazed on the tip. Definitely not the first time he had done it. When he sharpened it properly, it cut beautifully, and those brazed tips allow higher surface speed cutting if required and last a very long time in hobby use before further resharpening is required. The result is a very stiff bar that works well In the lathe, and will work with a starter hole drilled to about 3/8 inch or slightly less. But I use the commercial set for the boring head, even though less stiff and hence needing lighter cuts.
MJM460
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Thank's MJM.
To clarify, I am in the process of making a block that will fit my Taig lathe tool post. I milled the block on the milling machine. With the lathe (drilling from the headstock), I have drilled a hole in the block while the block was securely mounted to the Taig lathe tool post on the Taig lathe.
The only thing left to do is to drill and tap the holes for the set screws to hold the boring shank in the block that is secured to the tool post. Once I purchase and receive the boring tool, it will be secured in the tool post block with the set screws, and will be used for boring on the lathe.
I do not intend to do any boring on the mill, at this time. Eventually, I will purchase a boring tool for the milling machine.
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Okay, I went frugal. Instead of buying a lathe boring tool bit and paying for shipping, I purchased a 5/16" diameter round of HSS. I will attempt to grind it to resemble the small Taig lathe boring tool that came with my lathe, and then insert it in the tool holder I made.
I ordered this HSS round bar and some other stuff from Grizzly. They are currently having free shipping on orders over $35.00. They already shipped the order (same day).
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Hi Bear, The round hss will make a nice boring bar to start your collection, and give you a good idea of whether you actually need anything else. I suggest sensible rather than stingy! You can still buy others as you get to understand when you will need them.
I don’t know where you are up to on what shape to make it, but here are some pictures of the one made for me by an expert, so it may be a help for the shape you need.
This one is made from 1/4 inch hss rod. By the time it is ground, the tip does not quite cut to 1/4 inch, so it can’t do a 1/4 inch hole deeper than about 3 mm before the shank rubs on the cut with the angles as ground.
First photo shows top view. It is set in the tool post but rotated so the tip is on the centre height before final tightening.
Second photo, view from below showing the relief area ground away under the tip. Tip is pointing away from the viewer in the picture.
Third picture is a closer view of the relief. I hope this is clear enough.
It needs a starter hole, anything from about 6mm or perhaps a little less, then to be off set at a small angle by off-setting the tool post a few degrees, so it is boring a hole anything over about 7 mm dia. and the back of the tool is clear as it enters. Perhaps a bit smaller, but it gets uncomfortably tight if you are going more than about 3 mm deep. For 7 mm and above you can go as far as it will reach so long as you set it at a slight angle so the side of the rod that is in line with the tip does not rub.
As far as I understand the critical points, the top of the ground tip is on the centre line, under the tip is ground back so that it is smaller than the radius cut by the tip. I have tried to add photos to show this as it is hard to describe, and a sketch on the background, end view on the tip, the full bar dia. dotted, and showing the end view in solid line. Did my best to get a photo from below showing the ground away section, which tails off at about 130 degrees from the tip.
Others may be able to give more hints for grinding, but the end result of this shape is very satisfactory. I have used it on brass, bronze and carbon steel all with good results. Great for creating a flat bottom in a hole made a bit short of the required diameter with an ordinary drill.
I also have included photos of other boring bars from my collection in case they are of interest to anyone. There is a brazed tip on 3/8 dia silver steel for a stiffer bar, a set for the boring head which I also use in blocks for ordinary boring, a small commercial example with a slot that closes to clamp the bar when tightened in the tool posts. It uses tiny tips from 1/8 square hss tool steel. Most of the boring head set have not yet been sharpened. You can see in the photo that the corner below the tip actually describes a larger diameter that the top corner, this corner rubbing is the reason they do not work well as received. You do have to check and if they are like these, they do have to be sharpened. You can see the difference in the photo.
I hope that helps,
MJM460
I can see that the lighting was not too good on the last two, I have tried again replaced them this edit.
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Great post, MJM. Thanks for all the effort expended. The photos will be extremely helpful for me to grind mine. Should be receiving the HSS round bar in a couple of days (weekend wait), and I will grind and report back.
In the meantime, I tried the boring tool bit that came with the Taig lathe, but, it did not work well only because the initial bore size needed to be larger than the finished 12mm size in order for the tool grind to work. But, I least I learned something for when I grind the HSS round.
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Ground my piece of round HSS for boring on the lathe, and secured it to my holder. Bored the cylinder for my piston. Worked well. Now to finish the piston.
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Well done! You will find that tool very useful. You can save time on a larger hole by starting with a suitable undersize drill, then that bar will allow fine cuts to get to final diameter. This procedure overcomes many of the issues with a drill bit wandering, so the hole is not straight, or sometimes making slightly non- round holes. The boring bar will true up the final size and profile.
I suggest only add further boring bars when you identify the need, and only then if you don’t have something else even more useful to you in the machining you actually want to do. A bar with a larger shank, especially with a brazed on tip or even hss tip clamped in the end is useful for deeper holes when the little one will spring a bit, giving a bit of taper to the final diameter. So when the need arises.......
Did you take any pictures?
MJM 460
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Thank you again, MJM. Your photos were very helpful for grinding my boring bar. The length of my boring bar is such that I will, when the need arises, be allowed to grind the other end and reverse it. I'll see about getting some photos.
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I did a little internet research, and have decided to make a holder for a 3/8" boring bar now that I have a milling machine.
That's the part that worries me. What do you mean by a holder? Does it allow adjustment for the cutter to move in the XY plane?
I'd forgotten you were working on a lathe.
Yeah, pictures would help. Some people use a photo hosting system (e.g. Photobucket - but they took a black eye when they changed their requirements) and I think the forum also has a method for hosting photos.
But to start out...simply use the 'Attachments and other options' you see under the window when you post a reply.
The downside is you can't insert the picture within your text.
The only thing is, there is a limit to the size of the photo. Today's cameras and phones take photos too large for the forum.
I use paint.net to resize (I generally select 640) but you can also adjust the lighting/contrast. paint.net is free but there are many programs available to resize a photo.
It also helps to show your location in your profile (left of your posts).
Some people don't like to get too specific about location for security reasons but it's helpful to at least know what country you're in.
That way people can suggest vendors/suppliers most appropriate for you.
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Thank's Carl. I do have my location in my info; however, i can't figure out how to get it to the left of my posts.
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Update: I haven't posted on my beginner engine for a long time. I reached a holdup on trying to figure out how to drill the crank pin hole on the one piece piston. It was too small to put on a v block. I think I will now re-chuck it and mount the chuck to my mill vise and then drill the small hole.
I also obtained a Craftsman 109 lathe that has kept me busy getting into good usable condition (although it was usable from the beginning), and I think have succeeded in doing so. Just needs a tailstock and I want to make a toolpost post for it. I have made an adapter (actually 2) that permits me to use my Taig chucks on it.
I will continue to update on the engine; however, I did not want you to think I had given up.
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Thank's Carl. I do have my location in my info; however, i can't figure out how to get it to the left of my posts.
I think it's...
Go to 'Profile'
Select 'Modify Profile'
Type what you want shown in 'Personal Text'
Have you posted any pictures yet? An easy way:
Below the window in which you are posting a reply is 'Attachments and other options'.
Select that then you'll see an item called 'Attach' with a 'Choose File'.
Select that then navigate to your picture and open it.
However, there is a size limitation for photos. I use 'paint.net' and generally resize to 640 wide but there are many options for software to do that out there.
Another (somewhat more difficult way) is to use a photo hosting service. I won't go into that now.
The problem with photo hosting services is that some charge for the service. Others may not charge but in the future may start charging and lock you out until you do.
That happened to a number of us. Worse, they don't allow the photos you had already posted to be shown.
Another option is to use the photo service provided by the forum. I haven't used it yet so I can't help with how.
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Okay, drilled the crank pin hole today. Now I need to drill and tap the cylinder cap holes in the cylinder. The plans call for 10BA. I have translated this to around .067" please correct me if I am wrong), so I think I will go with around 1/16". Got to translate that to a standard screw size now. This stuff is complicated ;D.
What do you guys do for inexpensive mini threads? Help would be appreciated.
By the way, Zee; I got the "USA" location done per your helpful instruction.
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Bear 0-80 is the closest common size for US threads. The nuts and bolts in a normal hardware store do not go this small. Models look best with scale versions of full size bolts here is a thread for scale nuts and bolts:
http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php/topic,628.0.html
Cheers Dan
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Thank you, Dan. Very useful information. On to the next stage of my first engine.
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Finished up with the cylinder cap; Nice suction fit; will see how that ends up working. Still need to drill the mounting and air holes.
As to the flywheel and shaft, I need a reamer. I don't have any reamers. The bore for the flywheel calls out close to 1/4". Reamers are a little pricey for good ones.
Is there a pretty standard size reamer that I can buy close to 1/4" that will be applicable to many different small model engine projects (so I don't need to buy too many)?
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I bought this set early on and have added more as needed: https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-7-pc-Chucking-Reamer-Set/T10085
They can also be purchased individually: https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-Chucking-Reamer-HSS-1-4-/G9409
Jim
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Thank's, Jim. Good price on the single one. Don't really want to fork out the money for the whole set, some of which I may never use.
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Thank's, Jim. Good price on the single one. Don't really want to fork out the money for the whole set, some of which I may never use.
Over the course of building a few engines, I think I've used all of mine in the set. I've got a few in-between sizes as well, plus an oversized couple...............it never ends! :)
Jim
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With the boring bar setup on the lathe, you can do the same job as the reamer with care, though a reamer will give you repeatable size. For things like cylinders, I like to bore it and use some lapping compound to smooth it out, then make the piston to fit. Lots of acceptable methods to peel a feline....
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Crueby, I thought about a boring bar. I did make one out of 5/16 hss round bar. I guess I need to make on out of 1/4" hss. It would be a lot easier if I could get just 1 or 2 reamers for multiple engine. Oh well, no one ever said it would be simple ;D.
Jim, I was afraid of that answer that "it never ends" ;D. Wish you guys would have said, just get a 5/16" reamer for use on most of the engine's flywheels :).
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Crueby, I thought about a boring bar. I did make one out of 5/16 hss round bar. I guess I need to make on out of 1/4" hss. It would be a lot easier if I could get just 1 or 2 reamers for multiple engine. Oh well, no one ever said it would be simple ;D .
Jim, I was afraid of that answer that "it never ends" ;D . Wish you guys would have said, just get a 5/16" reamer for use on most of the engine's flywheels :) .
I guess my point was that there is usually a number of ways to do most operations, and you don't need to have every tool. There is a specialist tool (or several) for each task, much of the time to speed up production in a factory setting. For us, we can pick and choose what tools to get. I use both boring bars and reamers, and as you pointed out there are only a few sizes that get used. Bottom line, have fun with it!
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... Bottom line, have fun with it!
Will do. Thanks.
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Wish you guys would have said, just get a 5/16" reamer for use on most of the engine's flywheels :).
Easily done by scaling each engine so that it's flywheel will accommodate a 5/16 reamed hole.
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Update: Got most of the parts almost done; except for hole drilling, some threading and of course fitting. Now I am trying to figure out the best way to drill and tap a shallow hole on the flat of my cylinder for a pivot rod. The depth is only to be no more than 3/16", and not perforate through into the cylinder wall. I guess I need a bottoming tap and a drill with minimal point to it. Any other ideas or tips?
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Bottom tap is usual way, if you have a broken tap you can even up the end on a grinder (keep it cool by dunking in water frequently, the tap that is) and use that after starting the threads with a normal tap. Biggest thing is to be sure not to let the tip of the drill break through into the bore. Gotta stop short, or it may dimple into the bore.
Got pictures of the progress?
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Thank's crueby. Here is a photo of all the parts I have made so far. Like I said, still have a few things to do before fitting.
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Crueby, good idea on the broken tap. I just happened to have a pretty new 6-32 that I broke on it's first use (wasn't too pleased at the time). I ground it down and threaded the pivot hole. Worked great. Now i have a 6-32 bottom tap :).
Time to get on it, and get this engine done.
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Crueby, good idea on the broken tap. I just happened to have a pretty new 6-32 that I broke on it's first use (wasn't too pleased at the time). I ground it down and threaded the pivot hole. Worked great. Now i have a 6-32 bottom tap :) .
Time to get on it, and get this engine done.
Excellent! :cheers:
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Almost done. Just need the air fitting. Used my air compressor, just holding the nozzle over the intake port, and it ran great! :)
I was focused on function over form, so the finish is not real good. It is made of aluminum and steel.
I would like to give credit to Steve of Steve's Workshop (http://www.steves-workshop.co.uk/steammodels/simpleoscil/simpleoscil.htm). His plans were what I used (although I deviated some, especially as to the materials), and he was extremely helpful in answering some questions by email.
Of course, the forum members here were very helpful. Thank's.
Here are some photos.
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The first is always special - so congratulations is in order :cheers:
Any change for a video ?
If you need to ask - shoot one (maybe with phone) and upload to youtube - place link here to it and remember to make public or just for this forum.
Best wishes
Per
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Thank's, Per. Once it is complete, I will consider making a video, and if posted, it will be for this forum only.
Today, my goal is to get the intake done. Need to go to the store to see what is available for fittings, or will just make my own.
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Well done Bear. :ThumbsUp:
Jim
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Thank's, Jim. Good to hear from you again.
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Got it completed with the air fittings. I am using a pressure regulator off my compressor, and I like the way I can make it go from very slow to fast and back again. Neat to see it going slowly.
Now I am hooked. Next, I am thinking stirling engine :).
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Congrats man!!!!
Dave
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Thank's, Dave.