Model Engine Maker

Supporting => My Workshop => Topic started by: propforward on July 13, 2018, 10:48:16 PM

Title: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on July 13, 2018, 10:48:16 PM
Well, here is my story - such as it is.

Back in 2015 I had to take an extremely reduced salary because of circumstances beyond my control - and my new job was a silly distance from my house and shed.

So - I rented the house out, put my shed on its own electric meter and kept control of that (renters did not have access to it). That was a good move - I kept my property and still had access to my shed and tools.  :ThumbsUp:

Shed:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-7Zt5ZL9/0/a76c50f4/XL/IMG_3262-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-7Zt5ZL9/A)

I even finished an Elmer Number 14 wobbler - about February 2016 - and that was great fun.

So anyway - I left the job that was a long way from where I lived, found a better paying one with better employers, and in the general direction of my property. Result!  :ThumbsUp:

One day on the way to work though

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Misc/i-JRWK7Vr/0/11843b14/X2/28167950_10213591207468794_4156762205595237565_n-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Misc/i-JRWK7Vr/A)

Unfortunately I was not in the car.  :Mad:

So anyway, a few weeks in hostipal and rehab, several weeks off work, and even more weeks on crutches and then I got mobile again. Unfortunately, the damage to hips and knees meant I didn't get to my workshop and wasn't up to standing at a machine, so model engineering went on hiatus for a few years, and so I wasn't on this forum much.

Woe is me etc and whatever.

Fast forward past some more enjoyable events, and my wife and I finally moved back to my property a few months ago. Yay!

Before we moved, I took the opportunity to empty the large "storage" part of the shed into the house garage, and finish the shed out some more.

Mostly empty after a LOT of work (it was jammed full of stuff for the last few years)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-wP4zHGf/0/52419329/XL/DSC_0564%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-wP4zHGf/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GbqFhMc/0/bc198635/XL/DSC_0567%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GbqFhMc/A)

So, I had a builder, electrician and HVAC guy come in, and we took a simple and inexpensive route to "finishing" this section. basically, by using steel shed siding for the ceiling and OSB for the walls, it keeps the cost way down. Not as nice as sheetrock all taped and everything, but a lot quicker and cheaper. This part of the shed will be for a combo of storage, and "messier" parts of the fabrication process including band sawing, welding and tyre changing (for motorcycles).

So, part way through

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cvBpwpp/0/b08d58de/XL/IMG_3253-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cvBpwpp/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Ws8Fgvx/0/a9c4c8db/XL/IMG_3254-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Ws8Fgvx/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rpGKZQ6/0/661695c7/XL/IMG_3255-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rpGKZQ6/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Wnp9cPM/0/bc58e5fb/XL/IMG_3256-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Wnp9cPM/A)


Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 13, 2018, 11:01:31 PM
The sparky chap came in and ran wires, and the HVAC chap put in a nice big heater.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-b7HWJB7/0/64e319e5/XL/IMG_3263-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-b7HWJB7/A)


(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-8ptDrpS/0/7854c8ba/XL/IMG_3268-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-8ptDrpS/A)

And the builder put in a frame for a through the wall air unit.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5NXvbD5/0/2bf3a370/XL/IMG_3264-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5NXvbD5/A)

Once the OSB started to go up, it actually started looking pretty tidy.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-56hBpQF/0/e8a92c33/XL/IMG_3292-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-56hBpQF/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-SRc8bs7/0/a640d2fc/XL/IMG_3294-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-SRc8bs7/A)

In fact, it looked so decent that I thought I'd have it painted white to brighten it up, while it was empty. I'm glad I did. Of course, as soon as it was painted I had to jam the whole shed full of stuff while we moved from our other dwelling back to this one. These pics are part way into the mess.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-HPVdRsv/0/040a8a61/XL/IMG_3338-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-HPVdRsv/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rBjTx5q/0/5e6959a6/XL/IMG_3339-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rBjTx5q/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Hm3qfqH/0/1f98b3e9/XL/IMG_3340-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Hm3qfqH/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-42hKwVS/0/3225481f/XL/IMG_3342-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-42hKwVS/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9WsVPKk/0/c6a5aa06/XL/IMG_3343-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9WsVPKk/A)

For a few months, this part of the shed and the other section were both jammed solid. I don't have any pics of that - but it was depressing. Although I didn't have time to be depressed, because moving and unpacking take up so much effort.

But with that done, I gradually managed to start getting things in order. I now have access to my machine tools and work benches again, and the big area of shed is - believe it or not - getting organized.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-KMVQKRZ/0/73c75427/XL/DSC_0085%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-KMVQKRZ/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-SHkK92Q/0/327198f0/XL/DSC_0086%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-SHkK92Q/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-qptXmbd/0/41485a01/XL/DSC_0087%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-qptXmbd/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-XNqfW65/0/3aadf8e5/XL/DSC_0089%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-XNqfW65/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-QXzkQQD/0/12cbc893/XL/DSC_0091%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-QXzkQQD/A)

There is a lot to do - much stuff to get rid of. Four motorcycles will be leaving soon, and possibly others over time.

I added two welders a few years ago - haven't used them yet - but got them for a steal of a price. This year I'll make progress with those.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-dcLf5zW/0/b44201ca/XL/DSC_0104%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-dcLf5zW/A)

After a bit more organizing, I intend to spend a significant amount of time properly setting up my lathe and mill. I rushed into model engineering a bit, full of enthusiasm, and I see I have some adjustments to make to my machine tools. I find myself currently more interested in model engineering than motorcycling, so that will be the focus again soon.

My time away has not been wasted. I volunteered with a local university, and built them a vacuum system for making plasmas and thin films, and am helping a student there learn how to make nano structures and solid state devices. I did get to use my shop to make some fixturing for that - and it has been a rewarding process for sure.

Gratuitous pictures of strange plasma physics things:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Stuff/i-j6gT6DV/0/0c22e572/XL/IMG_3147-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Stuff/i-j6gT6DV/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Stuff/i-WqRDnnQ/0/fc2acb23/X3/IMG_3151-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Stuff/i-WqRDnnQ/A)

That's my story - looking forward to updating the shed pics as I go, and getting back to engines.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 13, 2018, 11:26:03 PM
One thing I am pleased about is that the tremendous amount of insulation is working really well. On a 95 degree day yesterday, the shoppe only got to 73 degrees, without even turning on the air conditioner. Good stuff. Still got some gaps and things to seal to make it rodent, pest and draft proof, but I must say - I really, really like my shed.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on July 14, 2018, 12:43:46 AM
Wonderful story. And looks like a wonderful shop. So sorry about the accident...but it always seems to take one down an interesting and even better road.

But! I am confused. Just where are you? Your language makes me think the UK or possibly Australia or New Zealand, but you specified temps in Fahrenheit.  ;D

Which, on that note, does anyone else on my side of the pond notice an undercurrent of moving to metric? More so than used to be?
I'm fine with it. I'm just trying to get used to the transition.

Uh...yes I know that Fahrenheit and Celcius have nothing to do with metric.  ;D The question just popped up in my mind.

Anyway...I'm glad things are working out for you propforward (what is your name?) and looking forward to seeing some more builds.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on July 14, 2018, 12:53:28 AM
Wow, did not take you very long to fill up that nice shop.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ian S C on July 14, 2018, 11:23:30 AM
Zee I think he comes from USA: Milling machine Grizzly, packing case Lamb's Wedge Cut Ranch Recipe(potato chips I think)HQ Idaho, and a Lakes Gas tank outside the shed (Minnesota Propane Association). That's what happens when you leave stuff laying around.
Ian S C
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: steamer on July 14, 2018, 12:27:59 PM
Good to see you on the boards again Prop!

Nice shop!

Welcome!

Dave
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: steamer on July 14, 2018, 12:31:21 PM
Please share any info you have about adapting to not standing at the machines.....that would be useful.... :popcornsmall:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on July 14, 2018, 01:13:06 PM
Great looking shed Prop. I hope my renovation will turn out as well as yours has.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on July 14, 2018, 01:56:16 PM
Zee I think he comes from USA: Milling machine Grizzly, packing case Lamb's Wedge Cut Ranch Recipe(potato chips I think)HQ Idaho, and a Lakes Gas tank outside the shed (Minnesota Propane Association). That's what happens when you leave stuff laying around.

I managed to zoom in on a motorcycle license plate - Minnesota.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Sleddog on July 14, 2018, 04:53:04 PM
Quote
I find myself currently more interested in model engineering than motorcycling, so that will be the focus again soon.

  ;D !       :-[ !

Glad to see/hear the shop coming along.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:40:48 AM

But! I am confused. Just where are you?

Hello Zee - great to make your electronical acquaintance again.

The detective work on this thread was fun! I'm an expatriate Brit, currently residing in Mn, as you rightly figured out. I'm Stuart by the way, pleased to be here. I hope to post more than vague ramblings soon.

 :atcomputer:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:46:10 AM
Wow, did not take you very long to fill up that nice shop.

Have a great day,
Thomas

Well, I already had this pile of junk on hand. I have got rid of a lot of unnecessary stuff - but there is more to go. There are 4 bikes slated for departure, and buckets of old scrap for the CB750 sidecar outfit that needs sorting out. It's been a bit like a sliding puzzle - the floor of the shoppe was completely covered at first, and grudually things got moved around, consolidated, shelves put up, and eventually walkways appeared. It's getting there - more importantly the machine shop area is opening up a bit and becoming usable again.

 (https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-N4pQ3ZS/0/918659ae/XL/DSC_0093%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-N4pQ3ZS/A)
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:49:54 AM
Please share any info you have about adapting to not standing at the machines.....that would be useful.... :popcornsmall:

Mostly I have been working towards standing again, which I can now do for extended periods of time again.

For the lathe that's essential - it's too high up to not stand.

For my mill - it is quite low down, and I find that this small office chair works well for sitting at it to operate it. (more junk on the floor to get rid of - it's embarrassing.)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-28p28SQ/0/76ab0fcb/XL/DSC_0100%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-28p28SQ/A)

In the fullness of time, if needs be, since my knees are not much good any more, I could make a new stand for the lathe and lower it down to sit at. Or else I'll get a smaller lathe and bench mount it.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:51:22 AM
Great looking shed Prop. I hope my renovation will turn out as well as yours has.

Bill

Thank you - I am quite sure yours will turn out superbly, and I am looking forward to seeing it progress. I've been reacquainting myself with some of your excellent build logs, which I think will be invaluable once I really get started again.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:53:20 AM
Quote
I find myself currently more interested in model engineering than motorcycling, so that will be the focus again soon.

  ;D !       :-[ !

Glad to see/hear the shop coming along.

Wait - YOU!

 ;D

Good to see you here. I haven't given up on riding, but I'm not drawn to it as I once was. For now. All in good time. I've decided not to force it, and just get back to it when ready. My new Tiger is ready to rock and roll, so it's all good.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on July 15, 2018, 12:41:06 PM
Hi Stuart,

I built this Roll-around, adjustable height chair to use in my shop. It relieves your back and legs no matter what you are working on. The seat goes down to 10-inches and up to 35-inches. This might be of help to you.

Have a great day,
Thomas
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 01:25:54 PM
That is an excellent device - ingenious!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Sleddog on July 15, 2018, 01:44:15 PM
Prop, hope to possibly see you at the Blackhills show.


http://www.blackhillsmodelengineeringshow.net
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ian S C on July 15, 2018, 02:44:01 PM
We are closing in, there is a election advert on the wall for James Stuart for Sheriff, Sheriff Stuart is the Sheriff in Anoka County Minnesota, in 2015 he was national Sheriff of the year, he is still the Sheriff around those parts.
  Wish I had even a fraction of that shed.
Ian S C
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ye-Ole Steam Dude on July 15, 2018, 03:36:28 PM
Hey again Stuart,

I found my original drawings to build the chair and have posted them in the "Plans and Drawings" section here in the Forum.

Thomas
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 15, 2018, 11:50:50 PM
Prop, hope to possibly see you at the Blackhills show.


http://www.blackhillsmodelengineeringshow.net

I'll put that on the calendar - could be good to make a weekend of it.

I got some more sorting done today, and now the area by the lathe and mill is clear again.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-MWsnWS9/0/859ecead/XL/IMG_4936edit-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-MWsnWS9/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-vXfTKht/0/6a973577/XL/IMG_4937edit-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-vXfTKht/A)

I used to have a tire changing tool in this part - but I have now relocated it to the other part of the shoppe. I'm going to build another piece of bench to put here, which will be for my other hobby, and most specifically for the airbrush spraybooths I have. Will be useful for painting flywheels and engine bases and columns as well.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GZz5HmD/0/873a7626/XL/IMG_4939edit-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GZz5HmD/A)

The air conditioner surround is a mess. I had to pull it out last weekend because it turns out it was poorly installed and leaking water. I think I have that fixed, so I'll trim around that and tidy it up.

But really, now it's time to stop with putting up shelves and moving stuff around (oh sure, there will be more of that, it never really stops) and get on to the machine tools again. Next episode - adventures in tramming a square column mill, and levelling a lathe.  :ThumbsUp:

I refuse to cut any of my castings until I make sure everything is square and aligned properly.

 :thinking:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on July 16, 2018, 12:24:19 AM
Looking comfy.  :ThumbsUp:

What's the machine to the right of the lathe?

And I carefully ask...do you have another fire extinguisher near a door?
I would worry about getting to the one on the wall in case of an issue.

I see what looks to be an emergency stop to the left of the lathe. If it is...what's it for?
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on July 16, 2018, 12:32:22 AM
Looking comfy.  :ThumbsUp:

What's the machine to the right of the lathe?

It's a cnc router - it's capable of cutting metal as well - small parts, light cuts. I keep thinking about using to engrave things, maybe make some small fancy flywheels or something. I just set up a new computer next to it today (well, not new, inherited from a previous job when I moved on, but better than the computer that was attached to the router).

Quote
And I carefully ask...do you have another fire extinguisher near a door?
I would worry about getting to the one on the wall in case of an issue.

Yes - and this one will be relocated soon. I keep flammables in a special cabinet out in the other part of the shop, and take a lot of care with that stuff - but it seemed prudent to have a few of these about. To be honest, if a fire ever starts and I can't get to the extinguisher then I'll just abandon shoppe and call the fire brigade. Hope it never comes to that, and I work the ounce of prevention vs pound of cure approach as much as possible. Nothing gets left plugged in - just as a small example.

Quote
I see what looks to be an emergency stop to the left of the lathe. If it is...what's it for?

It's actually just a lockable power switch, and I have absolutely no idea why I installed it, since all I have to do is pull the plug out of the wall to make the lathe "dead" safe. A throwback from having to consider lockout/tagout procedures at work I think.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 11, 2018, 01:10:45 PM
So I spent a bit of time rearranging that corner of the shed, and built a new bench

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Vz3G6hN/0/40ec94c4/XL/IMG_4940-edit%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Vz3G6hN/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9MCHFR7/0/c0d0996f/XL/IMG_4941-edit%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9MCHFR7/A)

I did put crossbars and a top on it

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5JjD6Lf/0/eaa7334d/XL/IMG_4942-edit%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5JjD6Lf/A)

Decided I didn't like the layout, and last weekend rearranged some things to make it more useable. Had to cut two holes in the wall for my little hobby spray booths to vent through, and added dryer vents to the outside so that they can breathe without letting bugs, varmints, critters and old man winter in. New arrangement I am pretty happy with.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-VkBxGNt/0/cba7176b/XL/IMG_4980-edit%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-VkBxGNt/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-wQMCKpb/0/1ff7e6de/XL/IMG_4982-edit%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-wQMCKpb/A)

This area of the shed is primarily for another hobby I picked up when I wasn't mobile. Ended up enjoying it a lot, so I'm sticking with it. Not as interesting as machining, but I enjoy it anyway, and the paint booths will certainly be handy for painting up steam engines.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-T63xgth/0/4458b7d8/XL/DSC_0106%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-T63xgth/A)

The other part of the shed is progressing nicely - got some more junk to get rid of over coming weeks, and then I'll show that area off again.

Still have to put some trim around the A/C unit, should do that today.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 11, 2018, 01:19:01 PM
Next project is tramming the mill, (I said that before, but got distracted) and setting up the coolant dispenser on the lathe and mill. Properly this time. I did it once before but wasn't happy with it.

Gradually getting back to metalwork.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on August 11, 2018, 02:27:07 PM
Looks like a fun place!

Tell me about that paint booth. I've been considering one for some time now.

Is it necessary to vent if all you use is acrylic?
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 11, 2018, 03:03:08 PM
Thanks Zee.

The booths are an amazon purchase, and about 100 bucks each. I am absolutely pleased as punch with them. What I have here is two paint booths next to each other, because one wasn't quite big enough. They come with LED lights, and they really light up the interior of the booth. For a cheapo solution I am really impressed. The fans are quite loud, but not enough to be safety hazard.

In terms of acrylics I use those too - I didn't buy these booths until I started using solvent based lacquer paints, where venting outside is essential. Nevertheless, breathing in acrylic paint is certainly not a good idea, but I think you can just use a decent inexpensive respirator to deal with that.

Here is the link to the spray booth

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NLQ019A/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s02?ie=UTF8&psc=1

They come with lengths of flexible air conditioner hose and a rectangular outlet nozzle that is designed to wedge in a window opening. When I had my scale model setup in the last house I lived in, I made a piece of PVC trim into a window insert, and put the two vents into that. You can just see it behind the spray booths in this pic.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Scale-Models/English-Electric-Lightning-F6-148/i-NTXsjnZ/0/ccb1fe03/XL/DSC_0290%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Scale-Models/English-Electric-Lightning-F6-148/i-NTXsjnZ/A)

That was actually a fun little space, but my shed is much, much better. I do enjoy spending time in there.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on August 11, 2018, 05:37:19 PM
Thanks. I had been looking at that.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 25, 2018, 06:30:27 PM
Well, today I made progress in the hobby we're more interested in, that of machining.

I have had a bad habit in the past, of pressing forwards and not paying enough attention to set up of my machine tools, then being frustrated with inaccuracies. I have vowed to pay more attention to set up, especially before starting my next engine - which is to be from castings.

So today, I made an effort to tram my mill. I already knew from previous measurements that the column was not square to the table. One direction is easily adjusted, because the head is rotatable. But for the other direction (Y direction) you really can only use shims, inserted under the column where it attaches to the base.

A couple of years ago I bought one of these:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-CG6SWHJ/1/1944b02f/XL/IMG_3626%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-CG6SWHJ/A)

Not essential for tramming, because these tools are easily made, or you can use a single dial gauge on an arm of course - but for the price this was rather nice.

Basically, to use it you zero one gauge using a little magnet supplied with the tool

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-gcztwtS/0/86a09c90/XL/IMG_3627%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-gcztwtS/A)

Then rotate the gauge 180 degrees and zero the other dial

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-tp973st/0/30bd147d/XL/IMG_3629%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-tp973st/A)

Then you lower the head and place both gauges on to the table. As you can see, a little off in the X direction.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RT6cvhR/0/a65b5d5b/XL/IMG_3630%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RT6cvhR/A)

I adjusted that in (the angle of the camera shows an error, but I was closer than this when observing each gauge up close and personal).

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5JDNz58/0/4fe5f95d/XL/IMG_3631%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5JDNz58/A)

That was the easy direction. The one I was really concerned about was the Y direction. Using the same calibration procedure, I discovered this amount of error:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZmkcGzt/0/10c90c7d/XL/IMG_3632%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZmkcGzt/A)

Not very satisfactory.

It took me a few goes (during which I made the problem WAY worse before it got better), but by inserting different thickness shims under the edge of the column, I got the error down a lot (getting quite close in this pic):

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9CmMF6S/0/73b86d7d/XL/IMG_3634%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9CmMF6S/A)

I'll likely take a look at this periodically and see if it changes over time.

So now I can think about actually machining something.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 25, 2018, 06:50:34 PM
I should add that I did go back and check zero calibration before calling it done, and also tram in the X direction again too - best to be thorough.

Next jobs are to install the coolant drain on the lathe chip tray properly, and also add coolant dispenser to the mill.

This sudden burst of alignment enthusiasm was caused by ordering a new vise today - after reading Bills thread. Looking forward to getting that set up and actually getting on with some real play time.

 
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on August 25, 2018, 07:14:03 PM
Well, today I made progress in the hobby we're more interested in, that of machining.
There might just be one hobby a bit more interesting. At least there used to be.
I have had a bad habit in the past, of pressing forwards and not paying enough attention to set up of my machine tools, then being frustrated with inaccuracies. My brother.

Interesting method for zeroing the tool (i.e. the magnet). I just place mine on the surface plate. Makes me wonder if using the surface plate doesn't account for something or the other.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 25, 2018, 07:20:09 PM
I don't think so - I think it's just a means of touching down on a fixed height above the table that doesn't shift about, so that you don't have to raise or lower anything when rotating the tool around. But then you still have to lower the head down to get the DTI's onto the table.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 25, 2018, 09:12:14 PM
Well, I also got the coolant pump installed - more specifically fitted the drain spigot on the chip tray so that it doesn't leak. Seems to work fine - although I did surprise myself and spray a bit of coolant around the place. Oops. Nothing that a shop towel couldn't sort out though.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ndsjkSp/0/5e9c3246/XL/IMG_4989%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ndsjkSp/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-LMGXWHC/0/6574176c/XL/IMG_4990%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-LMGXWHC/A)


With all that done, I pulled this out.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RdJ8d5D/0/8bd93ded/XL/IMG_4993%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RdJ8d5D/A)

I'm going to go and read up Bills thread about this, but I may well make a start on this tomorrow.



Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on August 25, 2018, 10:02:17 PM
Congrats on the new vise. We will need pics of course once it arrives  :).  Looks like a PMR #1. Will be looking forward to seeing the build on that one!!!
Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 25, 2018, 10:10:47 PM
That's exactly what it is, and I'm excited to start. Probably with a few of the more simple parts, but I think I may even take next friday off and get a 4 day weekend in and some good shop time at long last. Actually make something instead of just organize - although there's more of that to do too.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Kim on August 26, 2018, 12:24:35 AM
Nice work on the tramming, Stewart!  Nice looking tramming tool.  I've seen them, but never been convinced that the convenience would be worth it.  Did you find it helpful?  Did it make tramming simpler and make you more likely do to it more frequently? That would be a good plus!

I just barely got around to tramming my new mill (the one I got last Christmas :)).  I knew it was a little out of alignment, but hadn't bothered/remembered to do it.  But it's done now and I can rest easier.  (As long as I remember to check it periodically.  :Lol:)

Looking forward to your new thread on the PMR casting!
Kim
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on August 26, 2018, 12:39:20 AM
I worry about that 4-jaw chuck. 8" no? Quite a bit of weight.
Might there be a better place for it?
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on August 26, 2018, 02:03:25 PM
Kim,

The edge technologies tool does make tramming much less of a chore, and as a result I'm likely to check tram more frequently. That said - I can't bring myself to recommend it as a "must have" tool, because there are other methods which don't need the expense. But I bought this a few years ago when I had better resources. Today, I wouldn't spend the money on this item, but I'm glad to have it. It would be pretty easy to make one to be honest - in fact I have recollection of a post by Bogstandard (I think) on just such a tool way back in the starting days of the forum.

Carl - that is indeed an 8" 4 jaw, and it is a weighty fellow. That said - not sure what a better spot would be? The pic may be deceiving - I don't have to stoop or climb over a bunch of stuff to get it, it's really easy to pull out of its spot. I may even move the coolant pump further behind the lathe now I have it running, which will improve access even more. However, I found this 8" 4 jaw a bit large on the last engine I made, so yesterday I actually ordered a smaller 4 jaw chuck and back plate, and should have those this week. I ordered some other tooling as well. I recently sold a motorcycle to fund some new items. I'd also like a new rotary table / chuck, but I'm holding off on those until I've done some more research. I may have to sell some other junk to have enough to get the right one for the job, but one thing at a time.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 01:32:56 AM
Well, got a few new items today. A 6” 4 jaw chuck, and an E40 collet chuck and collets. I need to mount the back plates on the spindle and finish them off, but I think I’ll hold off on that until I’ve performed some alignment tests on my lathe.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-sqXRj6M/0/e133c063/X3/IMG_3682-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-sqXRj6M/A)
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 01, 2018, 01:44:13 AM
Always fun to wait on the big brown truck knowing he will stop at your house with goodies  ;)

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 01:45:28 AM
Oh yes! Never gets old, getting new stuff. :D
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 01, 2018, 02:29:58 AM
I'll be very interested in seeing your travels with the collet chuck.
It's something I want for my lathe but I don't now enough to be confident enough to spend the bucks.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 02:35:09 AM
The main reason I got it is for holding the smaller diameter round stock. It was also recommended by some machinists I know. Now - they approach machning from a production viewpoint - not the same for a hobby machinist by any means, but I like the idea of the collet chuck. I’m treating myself with funds from a motorcycle sale. :D

Still waiting for my milling vise - but they have to make it first.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 01, 2018, 02:40:13 AM
Smaller stock yes. I'm also interested in square and hex stock.
But I have to admit, given my level of experience/interest, is it really necessary?

I'm thinking yes. At a minimum...why  not? It takes certain variables out of play for me.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 01, 2018, 02:54:48 AM
What did you decide on for the vise Stuart ?

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 02:57:44 AM
Is it really necessary? Very good question, and one I ummed and ahhed over a fair bit. But as you say - it takes certain variables out of play, and that was the final deciding factor in the end. It was a fairly priced set up, although not inexpensive for sure. But I felt it will expand the capabilities of my lathe, without adfing a smaller machine tool.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 03:00:15 AM
What did you decide on for the vise Stuart ?

Bill

I did order a Kurt 4”. Very excited to try it out. Should have it at the end of September.

Maybe I can pop into the Minneapolis factory and watch them make it?

Probably not - although I’d really enjoy that.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 01, 2018, 03:07:17 AM
Ah great. I guess they are still ramping up production on the 4" version, but you will love it...worth the wait!!

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 03:18:00 AM
I’m sure the 4” is much lower demand, but I think it’s the right size for my little mill. I have fiund my bigger vise quite unwieldy - also it’s clamping leaves a lot to be desired. It is incapable of holding work firmly against parallels. 
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 07:56:39 PM
Adventures in accuracy..................

Today I made a start on finding out the truth about my lathe. I'm sure I'm not the first amateur to just buy a machine tool, assume it was good and start butchering metal, but that doesn't excuse it as an approach. I now want to know where my lathe is, and then see if I can do anything about any errors.

I started with the much celebrated "Rollies Dad" method of measuring alignment. Using a 26" long aluminum round bar (rod) held only in the chuck, I performed the measurements, and found that

At headstock - TIR = 0.002"
Mid way - TIR =  .004"
At tail stock (25.375" from head position) TIR = .003"

Does it seem likely that bed twist could be such that the measurement is worse half way along? Also I wonder if there was some crud on the bar. I think I'll do this again and clean and measure the rod diameter at each position.

According to my acceptance test in the lathe manual, parallelism of headstock axis to the bedways is 0.001" over a 12" length. Based on that these measurements seem encouraging. But I'll return to that.

I then had a try at a test bar. I found a nice piece of 2" steel, and chucked it up, then took a few very light cuts along it.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-jmjrKR7/0/24c21687/XL/IMG_3684%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-jmjrKR7/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4kVvVn4/0/a1255873/XL/IMG_3685%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4kVvVn4/A)

The diameter of the bar measured

1.4814" at chuck end
1.4830" at mid point (4.5" )
1.4850" at end of bar (9.0")

I must admit that these numbers are better than I had expected (although I had no real reason to expect any particular amount of taper).

While looking through the manual, and investigating the headstock, I was pleased to find that the headstock is equipped with jacking screws, to use in alignment.

So it seems to me that I should be able to take out that 2 thou in 9" taper by jacking the head slightly.

On tuesday I will have access to a machinists level, so at this point I don't think I'm going to adjust anything until I put that on the bed, and see if I can double check the twist that way.

But I wonder if all I'll need to do is adjust the headstock a bit to take out the taper - and then will have a pretty accurate machine (within the realms of the home enthusiast).

I measured run out on the test bar for fun, and got approx 0.0005" at the chuck end, and a bit less than 0.0010" at the 9" end. Not sure what to make of those numbers at this point, but I think the roundness is in spec in comparison to the inspection test report. Probably not much more I can do with that aspect, and I think that is satisfactory.

After that I just busied myself with my new backplates. My lathe has locking dogs on the backplates supplied with it, so spot faced the new ones, and drilled and tapped holes to make use of those.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-k3wcFfs/0/1b8cafb3/XL/IMG_3686%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-k3wcFfs/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3QhDHzH/0/9e0eb5fa/XL/IMG_3687%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3QhDHzH/A)

Fun times! After tea and sammich, and more tea I expect, I'll go and do some more. I think my lathe is accurate enough to start making some of the jig parts I want for my grinding rest, but I'll hold off engine parts for now.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 01, 2018, 08:14:46 PM
If I recall, Rollies Dad needs a straight bar. 26" is pretty long. What was the diameter?

When you turned the steel, was anything holding the end?

I'll be interested to see how you go about checking for twist with the level. I've done it but I don't have confidence I knew how.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 08:22:21 PM
Well, according to the blurb, Rollies Dad method specifically does not require a straight bar, since you evaluate the difference in run out. 26" is pretty long, but I felt it would give a good idea of the nature of the whole length of the bed. However, you do need to know the diameter is either the same at each measurement point, or measure the diameter for comparison. I'll repeat it this afternoon, and add that aspect in, since this is a stock bar, it could have variation in it. Or crud on it. It's a 1" dia bar.

From Rollies Dads write up:

"The difference between the "near end average distance" and "far end average distance" is a measure of the misalignment of the spindle axis with the ways."

That means on my numbers near end and far end are 0.0005" misaligned, and the midway point is .001" misaligned (using the means of the TIR per RD method). I'm not sure I could really adjust that out without chasing my tail a lot. But I need to do this again.

I did not support the end of the steel bar - basically I followed the method outlined in my lathe manual, which was very specific about not supporting the bar end. But consequently the cuts must be very light.

I'll post my results as I keep going. Very much a voyage of discovery - quite rewarding in many ways.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 01, 2018, 08:29:07 PM
Now if they would just make a 2" one for the sherline  :thinking:

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: RonGinger on September 01, 2018, 10:01:01 PM
Rollie was a Volvo mechanic. He used to save and pass out all the gas struts he replaced. They were hard and smooth and round. I believe round was the most important requirement.

Its hard to believe how that method is all over the net. Rollies dad would be impressed. A few of  us used to gather in Rollies shop from time to time to just talk shop. His dad lived right across the street and when he saw a bunch of cars he would come over. He had been a machinist all his life, and was then in his late 80's. One day he explained the method to us all, and one guy in the group, Steve Wellcome, wrote it up for HOME SHOP MACHINIST. After it was published Steve got a letter one day with a 20 dollar bill form a guy that said he had used the method and his lathe was straight for the first time.  Later, after the NEMES group was formed (1996) Rollie described the method at a meeting and someone in the group put a write  up on the net. After that it just went nuts and has spread all over the net.

It was fun to be at the start of a legend.

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 01, 2018, 11:42:38 PM
That is very cool that you were there for that. It is astounding how widespread the method is, but more astounding is that it is referred to as "Rollies Dad's" method, which is fitting, and makes me feel good that someone is getting recognized in this way.

I redid my Rollies Dad measurements. These I find more believe-able. Not sure what I did wrong first time - call it set up practice.

This time, I scribed a location at the headstock end, another 12" away, and another 12" away from that. Then measured the diameter of the bar in each location twice, at 90 degrees to each other.

Here is the set up for the vertical test. Horizontal is the same, but with the dial gauge mounted appropriately.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5628dhr/0/48f92fbc/XL/IMG_3688%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-5628dhr/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-6G4qTm6/0/ceb7be74/XL/IMG_3689%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-6G4qTm6/A)

And here are the measurements.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9GmhjjC/0/f68d6ee8/XL/IMG_3690%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9GmhjjC/A)

This essentially translates into about 4 thou misalignment over the first 12", increasing to 6 thou misalignment over the second 12" span. Given the nature of measurement and error, it's fair to call it 5 thou per foot.

I was tempted to start shimming, but I think I'm going to have a look using the machinists level first and see how it compares.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 02, 2018, 12:11:10 AM
I may want to trade lathes with you. But I'll wait a bit and see what else you find.  ;D
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 02, 2018, 12:32:37 AM
I may want to trade lathes with you. But I'll wait a bit and see what else you find.  ;D

 :ROFL:

Wait until I've adjusted it first. It might be even worse then!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 02, 2018, 01:54:08 AM
I may want to trade lathes with you. But I'll wait a bit and see what else you find.  ;D

 :ROFL:

Wait until I've adjusted it first. It might be even worse then!

That's my M.O.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: 10KPete on September 02, 2018, 03:09:34 AM
I think you'll be very surprised at how much that rod droops at the end. I don't see any attempts to measure/compensate for that.

Pete
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 02, 2018, 03:21:55 AM
It's a journey. As always I'm very happy to hear specifics of what I should be doing differently? As I say, next step is look at twist with the machinists level, then try straightening.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 02, 2018, 03:34:32 AM
There's been some replies as I've been typing, and I see you're going to do it - the lathe must be level before making further adjustments.

Any alignment errors you are seeing at the moment are a combination of bed misalignment, headstock misalignment and chuck misalignment. You need to minimize the variables or you'll start chasing your tail all over the lathe.

Also, make sure the whole lathe is as rigid as possible - if it's not already be sure the stand is firmly on the floor. Concrete is rarely perfectly level and often you'll need shims under the feet. Flex anywhere in the structure will affect alignment and needs to be minimized. 

If you are unsure about leveling please ask, as it is a critical first step for lathe accuracy.

Dave.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 02, 2018, 03:41:50 AM
Thanks Dave, I appreciate the comments and encouragement.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: 10KPete on September 02, 2018, 03:47:03 AM
I agree with all that Baner said with the exception of level. It may be that the term is used slightly differently than I..??

The bed way must be flat. Level is just so stuff doesn't roll/run/whatever.

Flat is checked on small stuff by putting the part on a surface plate.

Most lathes won't fit on most surface plates! So, we use a very sensitive level to compare one end of the bed with the other end and pray they're both the same!!!

What you do with a twisted bed depends upon the situation....

 :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 02, 2018, 03:53:20 AM
Well that level is on the way, and I can pretty much gaurantee readings each end of the bed won' be the same. I'll put off deciding how to adjust until I know what the numbers are though.

I think generally in machine tool terms everyone understands "level" to really mean "twist" - or level relative of one end of the bed to the other.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 02, 2018, 04:50:23 AM
Well that level is on the way, and I can pretty much gaurantee readings each end of the bed won' be the same. I'll put off deciding how to adjust until I know what the numbers are though.

I think generally in machine tool terms everyone understands "level" to really mean "twist" - or level relative of one end of the bed to the other.

That's where I'm hoping to get more clarification. As has been pointed out elsewhere...lathes and mill were used on ships. I'm thinking it's all about 'twist'.
Which, to me, seems another way of saying "squareness".

I've recently learned that 'squareness' doesn't necessarily mean 90 degrees but could be 'being in the desired position/location'...like getting a room squared away.

Hm. I recently moved my lathe and now realize I never checked its 'level', 'twist', 'squareness'...or all those things we do.
I've also recently discovered that my new shop floor is not level to earth. Things roll around.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 02, 2018, 05:58:51 AM
Yep flat is what I meant.

I think leveling a lathe refers more to the tool used, rather than being 'level'. But by the nature of the tool the lathe ends up 'level' by default. ;D

Though saying that I usually shim one side of the machinist level to bring it into range, rather than jacking the whole lathe up... 
 
'Level' is not really an issue for the lathes and machining tolerances in a home shop, as long as the lathe's not going to tip over you should be right.
 
Dave.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Stuart on September 02, 2018, 08:45:43 AM
The word level leads to a misconception in this case , the bed must be in the same plane at the headstock and tail stock , and is easily tested with a level .

Ok now the exception to using a level war ships , many large ships have a machine shop on board , so how do you use a level at sea ?


On a mill it’s better to be tangent to the big ball , makes setup easier
On a lathe it helps but not a requirement to the accuracy of the lathe

The method I use is to get it near with a level then do test cuts on a 50mm bar with no tail stock support , this means the bar must be short ,then take the twist out of the bed with the jack screws or if your lathe has jack screws on the HS then use these . Then and only then introduce your tail stock with a longer test bar take test cuts and set over as required


If I need a taper I use a taper attachment ,but before I had that I used a set over tail stock center , and left the TS alone ( hemmigway have a kit for one )
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Ian S C on September 02, 2018, 11:42:49 AM
With the ??ridgidity of most stands for lathes in a home workshop, the only thing that will move with the jacking screws is the lathe stand, a bit different when the stand was an cast iron structure weighing twice(or more) the lathe its self.
Ian S C

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 01:08:27 AM
Machinists level arrived.

Headstock end.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GC9M9bj/0/bd57aa40/X3/IMG_3729%20%28Large%29-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GC9M9bj/A)

Tailstock end

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GCpBKBs/0/ee772093/X3/IMG_3730%20%28Large%29-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-GCpBKBs/A)

Yep, bed is twisted.

We can fix that though.

Stay tuned for the next thrilling installment of Props workshop adjustments.

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on September 05, 2018, 01:25:25 AM
I'd blame it on local gravitic anomalies....
 :zap:
 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 01:32:23 AM
You mean I’m standing too close to one end?

 :ROFL:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 05, 2018, 02:32:31 AM
You mean I’m standing too close to one end?

 :ROFL:

Stand next to the other end and see if changes.  ;D

If it does...you're in a world of trouble my friend. And that's spelled with a 't'.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 02:44:54 AM
Or trouble spelled with a capital S.

 :thinking:

Well anyway, the weekend can't get here too soon. I want to try adjusting things now.

If the cabinets are too flimsy, and I can't straighten the bed out, or if it doesn't hold over time, then I may have work waterjet me out some 1/2" thick steel plates to beef up the cabinets a bit. I don't get those for free though, so I'll try as is first.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 05, 2018, 02:57:25 AM
What is that measurement? 2 ? over what ?.

If I understand correctly...you set the level across the ways at one end and then some distance (other end)?
I ask because I want to know if I did it right.
It looked like mine had no twist...but I don't know if I measured correctly.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 05, 2018, 03:01:44 AM
Nice looking level Stuart. Great addition to the toolbox even if not used regularly.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 03:02:22 AM
Zee - the specific measurement doesn't matter so much - basically the gauge needs to read the same each end of the bed. Again - being "level" isn't what's important here - being flat (along the bed) is. I'm not about to take the time to get the bubble in the middle of the gauge at each end, I'm just going to match the tailstock end (picture 2) to the headstock end (picture 1).

On Saturday, when I get into this, I'll position the level carefully and record what I'm doing, and post about it. Tonight was a quick placement to see what I have ahead of me. This looks to me like I should be able to use shims to get the twist out.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 03:03:24 AM
Nice looking level Stuart. Great addition to the toolbox even if not used regularly.

Bill

Thanks Bill - I thought so too. Plus I can use it to get my turntable set up properly as well. I went back and forth about the expense, but being able to keep an eye on the bed over time easily is a nice facility to have.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 05, 2018, 03:07:34 AM
The precise measurement doesn't matter so much - basically the gauge needs to read the same each end of the bed. Again - being "level" isn't what's important here - being flat is. I'm not about to take the time to get the bubble in the middle of the gauge at each end, I'm just going to match the tailstock end (picture 2) to the headstock end (picture 1).

Understood. You want the same reading, whatever it is, at both ends. I was just curious to know how much twist those readings meant.
As I said before, you're my guinea pig  ;D so I can learn to improve my own machine's accuracy.  ;D

No pressure.  ;D
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 03:11:01 AM
The precise measurement doesn't matter so much - basically the gauge needs to read the same each end of the bed. Again - being "level" isn't what's important here - being flat is. I'm not about to take the time to get the bubble in the middle of the gauge at each end, I'm just going to match the tailstock end (picture 2) to the headstock end (picture 1).

Understood. You want the same reading, whatever it is, at both ends. I was just curious to know how much twist those readings meant.
As I said before, you're my guinea pig  ;D so I can learn to improve my own machine's accuracy.  ;D

No pressure.  ;D

Well, each graduation represents 0.005” out of level per 12” of distance. I will make an initial judgement of shim thickness to try based on that. Got to start somewhere. After that......

I hope I don’t disappoint! The pressure is on. I’ll psych myself up for a few days.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: 10KPete on September 05, 2018, 05:05:47 AM
After you check each end I would recommend that you release any fasteners holding the bed to legs, bench, etc. and see what happens. If you must apply forces to straighten the bed you'll want to know the real adjustment needed.

Pete
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 05, 2018, 10:00:18 AM
I’ll second Pete’s advice. Lathe beds usually spring back to level when the fasteners are released. Twist tends to be the fault of flimsy sheet metal stands, on this size of lathe anyway.
Also, Feeler gauges are a cheap source of a large range of shim stock, handy when you need to make super fine adjustments to lathe levels.
Dave.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 05, 2018, 01:20:52 PM
Yes indeed, that sounds like a logical approach, that's what I will do. Thanks for your input!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 05:52:49 PM
One of these arrived during the week.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-dwbVJV6/0/a3a03e7d/XL/IMG_4994%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-dwbVJV6/A)

Should be useful for some general tasks. Available from all the usual import machinery places for the same price.

Anyway, enough of that. I know you are all gagging to know about the exciting adventures of lathe alignment.

So off we go.

First off, I loosened all the bolts securing the lathe to the stand, and placed the level at headstock and tailstock ends.

Headstock:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-kVMWc2w/0/4667ac5d/XL/IMG_4996%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-kVMWc2w/A)

Tailstock:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Bk8vs8h/0/d58ad7b9/XL/IMG_4997%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Bk8vs8h/A)

Would have been nice if they had read the same, but it is what it proverbially is.

Since I had everything loosened up, I thought I'd make an attempt at levelling the lathe crosswise, as well as straightening it.

At one point, I was nearly there.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3tTxM8Q/0/6608bbfa/XL/IMG_5000%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3tTxM8Q/A)

However - the truth is that the stands that came with the lathe are flimsy, and just as predicted by several folks, it is damned difficult to get the machine to behave.

In the end, after much shimming, I decided to abandon the crosswise levelling somewhat, and focus on removing twist.

It took a lot of work, but at the end the scale read as follows:

Headstock end

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-39NNcSM/0/e93b7d7c/XL/IMG_5001%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-39NNcSM/A)

Tailstock end

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-WgKcb9r/0/afbe9687/XL/IMG_5002%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-WgKcb9r/A)

Now tell me if you think I'm wrong, but honestly I think that's as close as I'm going to get it on these stands. You have to overcompensate with shims, to deliberately bow the stand some and still apply twist to the lathe. I don't have a lot of confidence that this will stay put over time - so I'll keep checking it periodically - but I think this is going to have to be acceptable for the time being. A future project may be to fabricate a really solid welded square steel tube frame.

In the meantime, on to the test bar.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 08, 2018, 05:58:15 PM
That looks pretty good to me! Nice addition on the little sander too. That should be handy for lots of things.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 06:01:12 PM
So here is my test bar - 1 1/2" diameter, with 8 1/2" of length available for turning.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-tL4QgFb/0/90610e35/XL/IMG_5003%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-tL4QgFb/A)

I took a very light skim cut along the bar, a couple of times until I was certain I had turned the whole diameter all the way along, then measured the bar at the headstock end, center of the machined portion and far end of the machined portion. Measurements were taken 4 times in each place, rotating the chuck 90 degrees between each measurement, to get an average for each position.

Here are my results:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZC96vjf/0/fdebfd59/XL/IMG_5005%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZC96vjf/A)

The red number is just becuase I picked up a different pen.

Averages

Headstock - 1.4668"

Center - 1.4659"

End - 1.4645"

So approximately 0.001" of taper per 4"

That seems a bit much. So now I'm psyching myself up to attempt a headstock alignment.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 08, 2018, 06:05:17 PM
Stuart, it looks like the bubble in the level is sitting at maximum travel. It may not be indicating level. The bubble needs to be within the red lines to be reading true. You can shim the level on one side to bring the bubble into range. Just make sure the shim is placed at the same point on the level on each reading. 

Dave.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 06:05:37 PM
That looks pretty good to me! Nice addition on the little sander too. That should be handy for lots of things.

Bill

Thanks! I really don't see getting it any better.

I keep running into little clean up jobs where I think a sander will be less agressive and easier to use than a grinding wheel, and hopefully a little better than a hand file.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 06:07:43 PM
Stuart, it looks like the bubble in the level is sitting at maximum travel. It may not be indicating level. The bubble needs to be within the red lines to be reading true. You can shim the level on one side to bring the bubble into range. Just make sure the shim is placed at the same point on the level on each reading. 

Dave.

I'll double check that immediately, but if you look at some of the other pictures you can see the bubble can disappear way off beyond the visible area of the scale.

Didn't think of shimming the level though to get better readings - that's smart. Back off to the shed. If the level reading is still satisfactory then I'll be looking in to removing the taper.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 08, 2018, 06:16:04 PM
My bad Stuart. Just went and checked my level, (same as yours) and you’re right, the bubble does travel further. Sorry, I’ve been tripped up on that problem before, it looked like it was happening to you too.

Dave.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 08, 2018, 07:49:44 PM
Nice! This is helpful.
I'm looking forward to seeing how the head stock alignment goes. I suspect I need to the same thing.

You no doubt know this...keep that sander away from your fine machines.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 07:58:40 PM
My bad Stuart. Just went and checked my level, (same as yours) and you’re right, the bubble does travel further. Sorry, I’ve been tripped up on that problem before, it looked like it was happening to you too.

Dave.

Oh no - no worries at all. I very much appreciate such advice, as it helps me to be thorough. I did what you suggest anyway, which has the added benefit of increasing measurement accuracy. By moving the bubble to the center of the range, you get it onto some graduations, so makes for a better reading.

Headstock:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZTxDc2b/0/4460e8ea/XL/IMG_5007%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZTxDc2b/A)

Tailstock:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-b47NsFX/0/1dc1e10f/XL/IMG_5006%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-b47NsFX/A)

Pretty close I think. Bear in mind again some parallax error from camera positioning. When looking with your eye in real life, the readings are closer - although not identical.

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 08:03:29 PM
More good news though - I made adjustments to the headstock using the jacking screws.

After the first adjustment, here are my measurements:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-6wDmgbs/0/1edccd40/XL/IMG_5009%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-6wDmgbs/A)

Down to about 0.0007" taper per 4". Not too bad.

After another adjustment:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-K7sP3F3/0/265819aa/XL/IMG_5010%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-K7sP3F3/A)

I think I am now within gauge uncertainty levels (not that I've performed a gauge R and R study), but given that the head stock and mid way readings overlap, and the far end average is .0004" off the headstock end - well I'm just going to declare the lathe as fit for making parts.

Still need to set up the tailstock, which is next. Or maybe I'll machine the new backing plates for the chucks now, then do the tailstock.

I have to say though, I am quietly (not too quietly) pleased with myself for making me go through this.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 08:04:39 PM
Nice! This is helpful.
I'm looking forward to seeing how the head stock alignment goes. I suspect I need to the same thing.

You no doubt know this...keep that sander away from your fine machines.

 :ThumbsUp:

The sander is in a whole different room. Band saw and sander are in the "dirty" part of the shop. Or - perhaps that should be "non precision" part.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 08, 2018, 08:06:31 PM
Nice! This is helpful.
I'm looking forward to seeing how the head stock alignment goes. I suspect I need to the same thing.

You no doubt know this...keep that sander away from your fine machines.

 :ThumbsUp:

The sander is in a whole different room. Band saw and sander are in the "dirty" part of the shop. Or - perhaps that should be "non precision" part.

My whole shop is the 'non precision' part.  :lolb:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 08:11:58 PM
:D

I don't buy that. I see the parts you make. That popcorn engine is going to be a cracker. Or is that a popper?  :thinking:

Anyway, this also showed up. A little 2" compound milling vise.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3Bk6nZd/0/704af8ad/XL/IMG_5008%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3Bk6nZd/A)

All I'm waiting for now is my Kurt vise - but then that is the end of the money from the motorcycle sale. I'd need to sell another bike to have signifcantly more tooling money - not quite ready to do that. In any case, I'm well set up now. Time to make parts!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 08, 2018, 09:37:12 PM
Nice!  :ThumbsUp:

That looks very similar to the X feed I have. I love that thing.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 08, 2018, 09:51:14 PM
Well done Stuart. Once I get the lathe all rejuvinated (cleaned and painted and all lubed up) I am planning on going through the process as well. Thanks for leading the way.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Kim on September 08, 2018, 11:20:54 PM
Very nice Stewart!  It's a bit of a pain, but you'll be happy to know you did it as you move forward with parts making.

Thanks for sharing your journey,
Kim
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 08, 2018, 11:32:12 PM
Not yet fellas. He hasn't done the head stock alignment yet.  ;D

No pressure.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 08, 2018, 11:42:43 PM
Thanks everyone for your support. The input I have received has been very helpful indeed.


Not yet fellas. He hasn't done the head stock alignment yet.  ;D

No pressure.

You mean tail stock. Turns out that this was the easy bit.

A couple of years ago I purchased an edge technologies tailstock alignment bar. There's no need to go this route of course, but at the time I was afeared of making one. Anyway since I have it, I used it.

The setup:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-2h2HS3p/0/2b14c12a/XL/IMG_5011%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-2h2HS3p/A)


Zeroed the gauge at the headstock end

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-xhTLh9c/0/c9d490b5/XL/IMG_5012%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-xhTLh9c/A)

Moved down the bed to the other end and...............

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rjZ4Hvc/0/36f54696/XL/IMG_5013%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-rjZ4Hvc/A)

Turned the spindle over by hand - the needle didn't move. Well, it sort of vibrated. I didn't believe it so I did it a few more times, same result each time.

So I turned my attention to my new chucks.

I carefully faced the backing plate, then turned the step diameter down ever so carefully, and got a nice, tight fit in the chuck.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-nmRWGq7/0/94769e19/XL/IMG_5014%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-nmRWGq7/A)

Bit of a shame that the counterbores and holes for the screws aren't the right size on the backing plate. Never mind, easily fixed on the mill. Job for the morning.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-bGGhq65/0/b2cf778c/XL/IMG_5016%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-bGGhq65/A)

I did the same for my collet chuck, and by really slowly sneaking up the diameter, got a perfect sliding fit. I can't feel any play at all, so very happy about that.

I now have a collet chuck! I think this will be really helpful for the small diameter stock.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-zNrGRFX/0/8a858b90/XL/IMG_5015%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-zNrGRFX/A)

Having cleaned off the lathe and oiled it, it's now time for a barley pop, and some quality time with the missus.

A good, productive day today, I really feel good about all this.

 :whoohoo:

Thanks everyone for following along. A bit of encouragement is good to have.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 09, 2018, 12:14:32 AM
Thought he described that above Zee.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 09, 2018, 12:23:57 AM
I think he meant tailstock.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Baner on September 09, 2018, 12:33:47 AM
Excellent job Stuart! :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:

Machine tools are so much nicer to use when setup properly. :)

Dave.

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 09, 2018, 12:34:49 AM
I find the Edge Technology guys have some helpful things in their line up, and reasonably priced for the most part.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 09, 2018, 12:59:50 AM
Yes they do - on the whole decent value I think.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 09, 2018, 02:12:04 AM
You mean tail stock. Turns out that this was the easy bit..
Thought he described that above Zee.

Okay okay. I got my head mixed up with my tail. Happens all the time.

On the other hand...he still has to look at the head stock, no?  ;D

Very useful and helpful Stuart!

But...it sounds like your tailstock is fine. Which means I learned nothing.  :'(

And you got a collet chuck!!! You bum! That's on the top of my list but I can't do it until I have confidence my machine is properly adjusted...and can find something that works.

[EDIT] got my pastings screwed up but I think it's readable. It's late. What I can I say?
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 09, 2018, 02:36:51 AM
I've had a few beers, so I can interpret your postings perfectly!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 22, 2018, 12:41:33 AM
Well, a great big YAY today, my new vise arrived. Very nice it is too.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-x7x5MW5/0/8435549b/XL/IMG_3750-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-x7x5MW5/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-PZv9vCn/0/acd11b41/XL/IMG_3751-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-PZv9vCn/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-JhppCbc/0/88878413/XL/IMG_3753-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-JhppCbc/A)

It’s not like no one here has ever seen a Kurt vise before, but this is MY Kurt vise, and I’m ever closer to actually making steam engine parts.

So that’s nice.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 22, 2018, 12:51:08 AM
The cheap old import vise will come off of there in the morning. I'll likely get rid of it, although not immediately.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on September 22, 2018, 01:15:06 AM
Only thing better than new tools is top notch new tools!


 :cartwheel:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: b.lindsey on September 22, 2018, 01:32:13 AM
It's beautiful Stuart!! You will notice quite a difference between it and the import I am sure.  Congrats on the new toy.

Bill
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Flyboy Jim on September 22, 2018, 04:23:45 AM
What a beautiful vise! :ThumbsUp: Might be a little big for my Sherline mill, but I'd love to have one to just set on my workbench and look at!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: ShopShoe on September 22, 2018, 01:33:32 PM
Slight Diversion of Thread for Banter:

Quote:

"And you got a collet chuck!!! You bum! That's on the top of my list but I can't do it until I have confidence my machine is properly adjusted...and can find something that works."

--

If you have to justify it, just remember that collets should be more accurate and you have to use one to line up your machine more accurately. At least that's what I tell myself...........


ShopShoe
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 22, 2018, 01:34:51 PM
Slight Diversion of Thread for Banter:

This thread is always open to diversionary banter.  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Sleddog on September 22, 2018, 02:13:59 PM
Very nice Prop! You should celebrate with PIE!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 22, 2018, 02:37:53 PM
Excellent idea! I shall make it so.  :lolb:
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Tennessee Whiskey on September 22, 2018, 05:02:52 PM
Nice one Stuart. I think I remember you saying it was a 4”. I bought myself a new 4”  once for my Grizzly mill. Due to the size of the mill, I had to move the moving jaw plate to the rear of the the jaw to hold the wide part. Needless to say, I forgot about where the part was now touching and drilled a nice 5/16” divot in the movable side  :facepalm: :facepalm2:  Bought Bridgeport clone next week with a new 6” Kurt. I still walk by the 4” and slap myself in the back of the head  :lolb:  Enjoy it man

Whiskey
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 23, 2018, 12:30:25 AM
Thanks Whiskey, those things are easily done, alas.

Pleased to say the Kurt is everything everyone says they are. That import vise has no lockdown mechanism like the Kurt does, and that Kurt holds things SOLID. Very nice. Wasn't sure at first if it was worth spending the $$'s on such a tool to put it on a basic import mill, but actually it was well worth doing, especially after making the effort tram the mill.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Art K on September 23, 2018, 02:41:17 AM
Stuart,
I have enjoyed following up on your workshop. I have the standard 1/2 acre plot in the city of Madison. I added 8 feet to the back of my garage to have my present shop. Not large by any standard but adequate. I do need to do some sort of set up to use the band saw from my dad. I will need to special order some 62" metal blades, but it will be better than a hacksaw.
Art
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on September 23, 2018, 12:47:21 PM
Thanks Art, great to hear from you. You will find that bandsaw a very handy addition. Much easier than a hacksaw for cutting blanks of stock for one thing.

Mine is a cheapo one from Grizzly, and it took a lot of set up, but now it does a decent job.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on September 23, 2018, 02:39:24 PM
Thanks Art, great to hear from you. You will find that bandsaw a very handy addition. Much easier than a hacksaw for cutting blanks of stock for one thing.

Mine is a cheapo one from Grizzly, and it took a lot of set up, but now it does a decent job.
This year I added a bandsaw from SawBlade.com, current project has been giving it a huge workout, very happy with it. I find it makes a much squarer cut with much less waste and cleanup on the lathe, plus is much much faster and easier on me.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Flyboy Jim on September 24, 2018, 09:25:45 PM
Thanks Art, great to hear from you. You will find that bandsaw a very handy addition. Much easier than a hacksaw for cutting blanks of stock for one thing.

Mine is a cheapo one from Grizzly, and it took a lot of set up, but now it does a decent job.
This year I added a bandsaw from SawBlade.com, current project has been giving it a huge workout, very happy with it. I find it makes a much squarer cut with much less waste and cleanup on the lathe, plus is much much faster and easier on me.

Which bandsaw model did you get Chris?

Jim
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on September 24, 2018, 11:13:32 PM
Thanks Art, great to hear from you. You will find that bandsaw a very handy addition. Much easier than a hacksaw for cutting blanks of stock for one thing.

Mine is a cheapo one from Grizzly, and it took a lot of set up, but now it does a decent job.
This year I added a bandsaw from SawBlade.com, current project has been giving it a huge workout, very happy with it. I find it makes a much squarer cut with much less waste and cleanup on the lathe, plus is much much faster and easier on me.

Which bandsaw model did you get Chris?

Jim
Its the Trajan 125, working out very well for me. I have used it to cut all the stainless and brass stock for all the wheels, pulleys, gears, plus all the bar stock on the Marion build. The original blade that came with it lasted a fair while, had to replace it a couple weeks ago, but it had made a lot of cuts in 2 and 3" diameter steel bar stock - it had not gone dull, but the weld cracked where the blade was joined up. I had gotten a handful of spare blades at the same time, I think they are a little better quality than the first one. They have a large variety of blade styles, with a selector for what kind of stock you will be cutting to help you pick the right one. One thing I like with this saw is that it does not require oil or coolant (says not to use it), since the speed is adjustable for the type and size of bar stock. It cuts nice and square so I waste less metal, the vise will take up to 5" bar. It seems much better made than the big box store brands, but is priced higher too.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Flyboy Jim on September 25, 2018, 04:47:28 AM
Its the Trajan 125, working out very well for me. I have used it to cut all the stainless and brass stock for all the wheels, pulleys, gears, plus all the bar stock on the Marion build. The original blade that came with it lasted a fair while, had to replace it a couple weeks ago, but it had made a lot of cuts in 2 and 3" diameter steel bar stock - it had not gone dull, but the weld cracked where the blade was joined up. I had gotten a handful of spare blades at the same time, I think they are a little better quality than the first one. They have a large variety of blade styles, with a selector for what kind of stock you will be cutting to help you pick the right one. One thing I like with this saw is that it does not require oil or coolant (says not to use it), since the speed is adjustable for the type and size of bar stock. It cuts nice and square so I waste less metal, the vise will take up to 5" bar. It seems much better made than the big box store brands, but is priced higher too.

That's a nice looking bandsaw Chris. Looks perfect for what we do.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: zeeprogrammer on September 30, 2018, 04:27:12 PM
What kind of footprint does that Trajan 125 take?
I've been thinking of getting rid of my horizontal saw. It takes up quite a bit of space, is messy, and I very rarely use it in vertical mode.
(By getting 'rid of' I mean moving it into the garage.)
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on September 30, 2018, 05:31:34 PM
What kind of footprint does that Trajan 125 take?
I've been thinking of getting rid of my horizontal saw. It takes up quite a bit of space, is messy, and I very rarely use it in vertical mode.
(By getting 'rid of' I mean moving it into the garage.)
It takes up a 28"x12" space on the bench, the saw section has a lock to hold it down horizontal so you can pick it up by the back of the blade guide to carry it around. It does not go up fully vertical. I was able to get mine at their intruductory sale price, it is up to normal price now. I don't know if they do sales around christmas or not. (I am in no way connected to that company)

https://www.sawblade.com/order-bandsaw-machine-trajan125.cfm

Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Flyboy Jim on October 03, 2018, 02:59:48 AM
What kind of footprint does that Trajan 125 take?
I've been thinking of getting rid of my horizontal saw. It takes up quite a bit of space, is messy, and I very rarely use it in vertical mode.
(By getting 'rid of' I mean moving it into the garage.)
It takes up a 28"x12" space on the bench, the saw section has a lock to hold it down horizontal so you can pick it up by the back of the blade guide to carry it around. It does not go up fully vertical. I was able to get mine at their intruductory sale price, it is up to normal price now. I don't know if they do sales around christmas or not. (I am in no way connected to that company)

https://www.sawblade.com/order-bandsaw-machine-trajan125.cfm

Looks like they're temporarily out of stock right now. I like the idea of a saw that can be stored out of the way when not needed. I've looked back at my past projects and thought about future projects and there's not anything that it couldn't of cut for me.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: Steamer5 on October 03, 2018, 04:03:04 AM
Hi guys,
A bandsaw in the shop soon becomes one of the most used tools ....... well it does in mine!
Hay Zee have a hunt for the mods I did to my saw, putting it on wheels makes moving it around easy. Oh you need to make the wheels on one end are lockable. Making the quick change bigger table means putting it on & off you don’t  try to do something that you shouldn’t on the “little table” backstop

Cheers Kerrin
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: gary.a.ayres on December 08, 2019, 11:55:26 PM
Great workshop, and an amazing tale of patience and dedication through adversity.

Well done!
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: crueby on December 09, 2019, 01:55:45 AM
Putting big tools like the bandsaw on wheels saves a ton of room in the shop, have had my Delta saw on them for years, very useful. The woodworking catalogs carry great ones, adjustable length sides, one fixed set one swivel, with a lever to lower it down to the floor and lock in place.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on December 27, 2019, 12:08:53 AM
Not exactly earth shattering this.....................but anyway - today I finally sorted out two fundamental problems with my Grizzly G0755 mill.

It's a nice mill to be honest, and since I squared the column up to the table has been performing really well.

But, a niggling fault with it, is that the lock screw handles on the cross ways were too long, and would always interfere with the ways when traversing the table. They are the spring loaded lever type, so technically you can pull the handle back, and rotate it without undoing the lock screw to get the handle out of the way. Trouble is - I would always forget - or when having released the lock screw, the handle would flop down and then interfere with the slide ways when traversing the table.

So today, I cut them short.


Left - as supplied, right - modified.
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RDPDq83/0/cd7e2530/XL/IMG_5241%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-RDPDq83/A)

Now they work really well. I can tighten the lock screws and they NEVER interfere with anything. It's beyond me why it took me this long to do this.  :noidea:


The other mod, of similar simplicity, was the lockscrew for the Y axis graduated collar.

It was so long, that it would interfere with the table when the table was moved towards its extreme travel position towards the operator. And this caused me to have to re adjust and re set my work several times.

So today, I cut the threaded part as short as I could and still lock the collar, and then turned off the top face of the lock screw so that when cranking the table to its extreme position, the collar lock screw passes under the table without interfering.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-BGn8jQf/0/66a7fb35/XL/IMG_5246%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-BGn8jQf/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-q8mnFTh/0/40b1d2d2/XL/IMG_5247%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-q8mnFTh/A)

Again.................no idea why it took so long for the light bulb to go off in my head, but after making these two very minor modifications, the mill has become significantly more enjoyable to use.

 :Lol:

Bad design by Grizzly (or whoever makes machines for them), but otherwise I think this is a super mill, for a great price. So, not too fussed, but glad I did these slight changes.

I want to put a DRO on this mill, then the collar won't be so important. But until then, the collar is how I index to position.
Title: Re: Workshop adjustments
Post by: propforward on January 04, 2020, 10:17:26 PM
Welcome to another enthralling update on "stuff happening in my workshop".

First off, a couple of new tools found there way in. Always welcome.

A micrometer holder for my larger micrometers

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-7q8ftHc/0/612c8380/XL/IMG_5279%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-7q8ftHc/A)

And a magnetic block for my ever-so-slowly progressing grinding jig.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-MLhv5HF/0/a7b0bcbe/XL/IMG_5280%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-MLhv5HF/A)

I have been selling off my various motorcycle projects that I acquired over the years, and using the funds to buy some new tooling. Hoping to get enough together for a DRO set up for my mill this year.

In other news, I have a little rotary table - it's a cheap Grizzly  4" model, with dividing plates - model number H5940. The time is approaching where I need to drill some bolt circles, so I thought I'd get the chuck put on it.

Finding center of the table was easy with the coaxial indicator.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-P8dvhRk/0/a8901349/XL/IMG_5281%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-P8dvhRk/A)

Then I used a turned slug in the 3 jaw chuck to indicate on and line up the chuck.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-778T3qh/0/9a8ad9ff/XL/IMG_5282%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-778T3qh/A)

That seemed to work out.

I'll be honest, I do not recommend this rotary table. It's cheap - and that's what you get. It does, however, seem to work.

To check it, I put this scrap aluminum disc in, and made a 6 hole pattern (just center marks).

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mH2J9Fz/0/c77c2ab7/XL/IMG_5286%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mH2J9Fz/A)

Upon completion, the center drill came down in the same place as I started, so that was encouraging.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-WS34cqp/0/2862bf07/XL/IMG_5290%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-WS34cqp/A)

The pattern seemed to work out. I measured hole spacings, and everything seems even.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-LMPVvQc/0/a640a9c8/XL/IMG_5292%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-LMPVvQc/A)

There were a number of problems on the rotary table - the eccentric collar that engages the worm drive gear in to the table kept slipping - it's locking mechanism didn't work. Backlash was awful, and after the 4th hole the table was binding up badly. After making the test piece, I stripped the whole thing apart, and found it was assembled incorrectly. I spent about an hour cleaning and lubing and reassembling it, and it now operates much better.

I'd advise anyone considering one not to buy one - BUT it looks like with some work it will be OK. I think I will save for a better quality one, but for the time being I'll go with this.

After that adventure, I spent a little time truing up my collet chuck on my lathe. I had noticed last weekend that there seemed to be a lack of concentricity when clamping rods in the collet, and they seemed off center relative to the lathe spindle. Turns out the chuck had not been trued on the backing plate. I managed to get TIR to under 0.0005", which I think is as good as I can get. The lack of rigidity on this machine means that I can push on the chuck while stationary and deflect it that amount. At least to my eye it now runs true, where it didn't before.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3MCpW7K/0/a4839eda/XL/IMG_5284%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-3MCpW7K/A)

Having completed these tasks, I am ready to actually work on more engine parts tomorrow, so looking forward to that.

Not very exciting, but I quite enjoy keeping this log up, even with minor activities like these.

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 18, 2020, 06:28:00 PM
Been having a little trouble with my lathe lately. I surmised that something was up in the drive system in the apron, by the way the backlash had massively increased, and returning to zero on the feed dial for the carriage was no longer possible. I had thought a sheared pin or broken key or something.

Pulled the apron off

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-d28pM4b/0/a431fd3f/XL/IMG_5336%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-d28pM4b/A)

Started taking it apart, and got here

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-F92xHCc/0/34ba0591/XL/IMG_5337%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-F92xHCc/A)

And could not tap that roll pin out. Suspicious, I peered down the middle of the roll pin

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-fPPKqNQ/0/265ad288/XL/IMG_5338%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-fPPKqNQ/A)

Sure enough, that's the broken pin, could not see through it.

Pulled the shaft out

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-gJ9f8DK/0/f6df3739/XL/IMG_5341%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-gJ9f8DK/A)

At one time this was a whole roll pin.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-W6XkJpJ/0/bae6d1cd/XL/IMG_5342%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-W6XkJpJ/A)

Anyway, all back together now.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-FVrP8Cx/0/fa1bae0d/XL/IMG_5343%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-FVrP8Cx/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-JNqwvRQ/0/1c16db71/XL/IMG_5344%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-JNqwvRQ/A)

Glad to have this back up and running. I never crashed the lathe, so I'm not sure why that pin failed. I wonder if it will happen again - just have to wait and see. If it does, I'll consider making a modification to that drive.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on January 19, 2020, 05:19:05 AM
That was pretty good repair work, I'd say!  A job well done  :ThumbsUp: :)
Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 19, 2020, 01:33:09 PM
It was a good opportunity to drain the old oil from the apron, and regrease gears, and freshen things up generally. Glad to have this done!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on January 19, 2020, 05:45:05 PM
Stuart,

Double check you leadscrew lock out.  If both the leadscrew and the feed got engaged at the same time, that broken pin could happen.  Standard design is to put a lock out bar on that prevents the half nuts from closing if the feed is engaged.  If something is wrong with that lock out bar, that damage could happen, and you might not even know it did.

Dave
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 19, 2020, 10:11:10 PM
Thanks Dave, I appreciate the insight on that. I went out and checked and it seems to be properly working. I wonder if I could have strained that pin if I tried to feed the carriage by hand with the carriage locked, or something like that? Or even engaged the power feed with the carriage locked. I don't remember such an event, but could have done that in the past. Might have damaged the pin and it finally failed or something. I suppose having a weak link like that is no bad thing.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on January 20, 2020, 12:08:54 AM
Thanks Dave, I appreciate the insight on that. I went out and checked and it seems to be properly working. I wonder if I could have strained that pin if I tried to feed the carriage by hand with the carriage locked, or something like that? Or even engaged the power feed with the carriage locked. I don't remember such an event, but could have done that in the past. Might have damaged the pin and it finally failed or something. I suppose having a weak link like that is no bad thing.

The lock out prevents them both from being engaged, you should have one or the other, but never both..   if you can in anyway get them both engaged....Track down the problem and fix it....Because it really shouldn't.

Dave
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 20, 2020, 01:05:48 AM
Got it. I'll check that operation tomorrow.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 21, 2020, 02:54:47 AM
Hi Dave,

I specifically checked operation of the half nut lever and power feed levers tonight, and it is not possible to engage both at the same time, so the safety is working. I can engage either one, but not both, no matter which one is engaged first. So, no nearer shedding light on the sheared pin mystery.

No matter, I'll keep an eye on the situation.

Tonight I was doing a little investigation in to chuck speeds, and finish on aluminum, brass and steel. Trying to just dial in some settings. I had some success.

Brass:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mTjxpXt/0/d215fd66/XL/IMG_5382%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mTjxpXt/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cfkjGts/0/33a60365/XL/IMG_5383%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cfkjGts/A)

They actually look better in the flesh than in the picture.

I turned up the spindle speed significantly for the brass (also aluminum - apparently didn't take a picture though), and this seems to have helped consistency of finish a lot.

On steel, I also turned up the speed a bit, although not as much as the brass, and also got some decent results.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4TXm75Q/0/07b3b0dd/XL/IMG_5384%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4TXm75Q/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-DjKzLdv/0/31294fb4/XL/IMG_5385%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-DjKzLdv/A)

Pretty sure this is a piece of 12L14, so not that impressive, but nice enough anyway.

Also, my collet chuck went back on and stayed true, so I'm feeling better about it. Last time I installed it, it had gone way out. I'm happy about this because I think this chuck will be a key to helping to hold small parts on my lathe.

Now I have to figure out where all the vibration on my lathe is coming from. It shakes quite a lot. I think I need to beef up the stands it is mounted on, but also look at the drive train and see if something is not balanced. Or if the belts are too tight - or some kind of combination.

I feel like if I keep gradually dialing in this machine, it will help me make better and better parts. It seems to have come a long way in the last year, since I really started taking trouble to get it true and level.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on January 21, 2020, 11:21:37 PM
Hi Dave,

I specifically checked operation of the half nut lever and power feed levers tonight, and it is not possible to engage both at the same time, so the safety is working. I can engage either one, but not both, no matter which one is engaged first. So, no nearer shedding light on the sheared pin mystery.

No matter, I'll keep an eye on the situation.

Tonight I was doing a little investigation in to chuck speeds, and finish on aluminum, brass and steel. Trying to just dial in some settings. I had some success.

Brass:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mTjxpXt/0/d215fd66/XL/IMG_5382%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-mTjxpXt/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cfkjGts/0/33a60365/XL/IMG_5383%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cfkjGts/A)

They actually look better in the flesh than in the picture.

I turned up the spindle speed significantly for the brass (also aluminum - apparently didn't take a picture though), and this seems to have helped consistency of finish a lot.

On steel, I also turned up the speed a bit, although not as much as the brass, and also got some decent results.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4TXm75Q/0/07b3b0dd/XL/IMG_5384%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-4TXm75Q/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-DjKzLdv/0/31294fb4/XL/IMG_5385%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-DjKzLdv/A)

Pretty sure this is a piece of 12L14, so not that impressive, but nice enough anyway.

Also, my collet chuck went back on and stayed true, so I'm feeling better about it. Last time I installed it, it had gone way out. I'm happy about this because I think this chuck will be a key to helping to hold small parts on my lathe.

Now I have to figure out where all the vibration on my lathe is coming from. It shakes quite a lot. I think I need to beef up the stands it is mounted on, but also look at the drive train and see if something is not balanced. Or if the belts are too tight - or some kind of combination.

I feel like if I keep gradually dialing in this machine, it will help me make better and better parts. It seems to have come a long way in the last year, since I really started taking trouble to get it true and level.

Very glad to hear that Prop, but I remain perplexed.    That damage was not subtle....it took some serious torque to double sheer that roll pin....Do you have longitudinal feed?....can you engage both at the same time?  ( longitudinal and cross feed)   Some lathes will let you do that simultaneously    SOMETHING did that....and it's telling us to keep looking....

Confused in Mass....

 
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 22, 2020, 01:46:54 AM
I’m confused also. My bet is on trying to hand crank the hand wheel with the saddle locked. There’s also the possibility of poor assembly by the manufacturer. The lathe does have power crossfeed as well, but the same lever engages either longitudinal or cross feed - it cannot select both.

Vexing!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 30, 2020, 03:11:02 AM
Important modifications to the shoppe today. New signage.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-533dhRN/0/b8f0f646/XL/IMG_4810%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-533dhRN/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-B5j54p2/0/9749c6ac/XL/IMG_4811%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-B5j54p2/A)

It's good to have some fun decor. I can't show some of it................
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on September 19, 2020, 09:18:17 PM
Well, continuing my messing about and diary of workshop improvements...............

I already mentioned this in the lockdown thread, but implementing this rather nifty microwave transmitter set up meant I could beam wifi from the house to the shed. These just plug into routers in each location. You can set them up to just beam the signals back and forth, or to allow a network to be set up between the buildings. Cheaper and easier than digging a trench and running a cat 5 cable, and as far as I can tell, no drop in bandwidth. I can stream movies in the shed if I really want to. Don't do it very often, but did it one time when I had the covid and was isolating. Isolating in my shed made it a little easier to deal with.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-bKCcSDf/0/X2/i-bKCcSDf-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-bKCcSDf/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-X8VTgnc/0/X2/i-X8VTgnc-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-X8VTgnc/A)

Not that internet is essential in the shed, but it sure is helpful when wanting to look up things quickly. Also means that because of "call over wifi" I can actually get phone calls in the shed. That may sound like a distraction, but when the call is "dinner is ready" it's not so bad. Besides, I can turn the blasted thing off any time, and I do. It's similarly nice to be able to make a call without having to go outside and wait for the phone to find a signal.

Anyhoo, made a couple of alterations to the mill. very minor.

First off, I added a lamp. I bought this with a magnetic base. It's just a cheap LED lamp, but gets some light to the tool area. Works well. Only trouble was it was always moving with the table and never staying pointed at the work, and I couldn't easily mount it to the mill column. Magnet wasn't strong enough. Then I realised it was just screwed in to the magnetic base - so I drilled a hole in the control box and mounted it to that. Now I can point it wherever and it stays pointing at the cutting tool. Magic.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-53k4R79/0/X2/i-53k4R79-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-53k4R79/A)

The other alteration was to flip the power feed handle 180 degrees. now it points down out of the way - more importantly, when you move it left, the table goes left.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-TFCr5tQ/0/X2/i-TFCr5tQ-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-TFCr5tQ/A)

Had a few moments of frustration afterwards, when the motor drive apparently had lost all its power and wouldn't drive the table. But easily fixed by unlocking the table locking screws.  :facepalm:

Absolutely riveting stuff this.

But - today I ordered a 4 axis DRO set from DRO pros for the mill, so that might be more interesting. Fed up of counting handle revolutions, I am.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on September 29, 2020, 01:27:02 AM
DRO is here. I am excited. Probably shouldn't be quite so excited........

Anyway. It's pretty much the top of the range kit DRO PRO's sell. I've read a lot of good reviews, it's likely way over the top for what I need. I should probably have spent more on a better quality mill up front, rather than on this kind of thing, but this is where I am, and believe it or not the parts I make on the mill have been getting more accurate over time, so I still think it's a reasonably good mil - it's a matter of working within its capabilities.

So, eye candy.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-pzQ7cWz/0/e0d14c04/XL/IMG_5363%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-pzQ7cWz/A)

I splurged on the touch probe, since there is a better deal if you buy it with the kit.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-F5jndtF/0/4b573c69/XL/IMG_5364%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-F5jndtF/A)

One of the magnetic scales.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Bvjt57z/0/08f5c1cd/XL/IMG_5365%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Bvjt57z/A)

First tentative steps on figuring out the install..........

Just stick it here..........

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZVJ3jb8/0/77f695e6/XL/IMG_5366%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-ZVJ3jb8/A)

The quill will be the trickiest install, but I can position the scale more or less as shown in this picture, and the gear selectors do not hit it. I am thinking either make the front quill stop solid and mount the read head to that, or make a bracket to mount on the quill clamp. Haven't decided yet, but I think either way will work.

For the other 3 axes, I think the mounting is simple enough. There is plenty of room for the X axis mount on the back side of the table, and similarly for the Y axis - that one just needs a bit more work on the read head bracket. There is loads of room for a column mount, so I am hopeful that I can at least get the X, Y and column sorted quickly.

I did think that getting a 4 axis kit was a bit OTT - but there was one time where I wished I could have raised the head without losing my location, so based on that I saved the extra and went for it.

Hope to show install success over the coming couple of weeks.

I have seen a lot of good reviews of DRO PROs stuff, so hoping for a good result. I think the key will be getting everything true - flat to the machine and parallel to axes movement. And rigidly mounted.

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Johnmcc69 on September 29, 2020, 08:25:01 PM
 :ThumbsUp:
 That's a good looking set up!

 John
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on September 30, 2020, 02:14:09 AM
Thanks, yes I am liking the kit so far (not that it's installed). Also the customer service - There were a couple of brackets missing, but I sent them an email and no quibble the parts are on their way. In the meantime, I made a start on installation. I'm trying the column first, just because it's really accessible, so a good first run to see what's what. Simple enough, I used double sided scotch tape to hold things in place while I checked travel and location, then used a transfer punch to mark hole positions, and drilled and tapped mounting holes.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-sPXBnWQ/0/3695964e/X2/IMG_5368%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-sPXBnWQ/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cLLxSkC/0/77e40441/X2/IMG_5369%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cLLxSkC/A)

Quick fit up to check travel limits:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9cXfCbs/0/7f0949a0/X2/IMG_5374%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-9cXfCbs/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Ksq4DwJ/0/98b71417/X2/IMG_5375%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-Ksq4DwJ/A)

All is well, nicely centered and no cutting of the scale needed on this one. I do need to mill a bit off the black bracket to get the read head closer to the scale, then align the scale and read head with a dial indicator, and snug it all into position.

That's enough for tonight though. It's a case of getting an hour here and there to gradually work on it.

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 01, 2020, 01:57:07 AM
Excitement today - my new knee arrived.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Miscellaneous-Fixtures/i-bDpbmJG/0/5e508423/X2/IMG_5381%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Miscellaneous-Fixtures/i-bDpbmJG/A)

Been angling for one of these for a while. Heh. $69 shipped from a machinist supply in MI, sells on ebay. Fair prices and fast delivery.

Also, a little more on the DRO install. Tonight, I got the X-Axis scale mounted. This one needed trimming to fit on the mill table, but still has a couple of inches extra length over the travel. Cutting these down is a breeze. I used my bandsaw because it is now set up well, and cuts neatly and square. Took me a while to get it to that point, and a quality cutting blade was a big part of the equation. I ditched the cheapo Grizzly own ones and tried a Lennox, and that was the cherry on the cake after a lot of tedious adjustments. Worthwhile though.  :cheers:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-fbbcfBQ/0/ad7d4dd8/X2/IMG_5382%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-fbbcfBQ/A)

Mounted on the back of the table - shortened to clear the cutting fluid drain. I considered moving the drain and just having the scale full table length, but there is no advantage to that in reality.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-LMWbMSh/0/d780ec43/X2/IMG_5383%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-LMWbMSh/A)

And it clears the oiler, without being above the table. So this is a win. Just got to get it properly parallel to the table top now.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-gWq6Cns/0/4cca76fe/X2/IMG_5385%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-gWq6Cns/A)

So, little by little the install progresses.  :ThumbsUp:  ;D
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 09, 2020, 01:58:11 AM
More progress. After truing up the X and Y scales - managed to get them within .0005" parallel to their axis of travel, over the whole length according to my precision DTI - I did a test fit of the read heads. I discovered unsurprisingly that the supplied brackets needed a little alteration to get everything to fit. Not much though - .050" off one side on the Y axis bracket, and 0.080" off one side on the X axis. As a result, centered and gapped using the plastic shim that comes with the kit.

The Y axis read head I mounted by using a combination of two of the kit brackets. The first one is nominally from the knee kit.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-XwqtwWx/0/5a86208e/X3/IMG_5709%20%28Large%29-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-XwqtwWx/A)

Then supplemented that with their "simple" bracket, which just needed that bit of shaving on the rear where it mounts against the other bracket.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-VSLHCvT/0/064ef0be/X2/IMG_5713%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-VSLHCvT/A)

The Y axis is nice and solidly mounted.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Bc9JdWx/0/95642838/X2/IMG_5714%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Bc9JdWx/A)

The X axis was simpler, and just used the simple bracket.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-fhX3mW6/0/3e795c16/X3/IMG_5716%20%28Large%29-X3.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-fhX3mW6/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-wWTGHdH/0/c4925d7d/X2/IMG_5717%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-wWTGHdH/A)

The brackets have four grub screws in, which allow you to set the gap in front of the read head, and pivot the bracket about to get the read head parallel to the strip. It works very well. The brackets are just a die cast aluminum, so very easy to modify.

The read heads also have plastic wipers, which are missing from the above pics.

After all that, I couldn't resist trying it.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-hm29sbM/0/7d960ccf/X2/IMG_5715%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-hm29sbM/A)

I'm very happy - I'm loving this already. Can't wait to make actual parts, but must finish install of at least the X, Y and U (column) axes. Then I'll need to make parts to mount the quill scale.

So - next is double check gap, add cable mount locations, level and mount the column axis scale and we're off and running!

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on October 09, 2020, 06:18:26 AM
Very nice work on your DRO installation, Stuart!

It always seems like these 'little projects' take a long time and a lot of effort.  But I think you'll be super pleased with it when its done.

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 09, 2020, 09:24:48 AM
Yay!

Congratulations on the DRO Stuart!

You'll never want to be without one again...   :cartwheel:

Your shop is looking great, btw.

gary
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 09, 2020, 01:22:23 PM
Thanks Fellas. Kim, these upgrades certainly do take a lot of work - but very satisfying in their own way. I'll be very interested to tidy up all the cable routing and then do some test measurements on gauge blocks and verify accuracy and repeatability. I sense a spreadsheet coming on!

Thanks for your comment on my shoppe Gary - I've been working to complete motorcycle projects and get rid of them over the last couple of years. So that's why not very much progress on model engines. It's a case of sell off now unwanted projects, and then the money is used for tools and upgrades. I'm getting to a point where my shop is a lot more organized with decent space, and more spare time will be available for engines. It's somewhat a path to a retirement hobby, although retirement is a ways out.

If this DRO is as good as I hope, then after the next motorcycle sale I may well add one to the lathe. The lathe needs a bench upgrade as well.

A note about DRO PRO's - I've been very happy with their service. Although my kit was missing  couple of brackets, I wrote to them and they had those brackets to me in two days. At the same time, I asked if I could buy a couple of extra brackets, as after some dry fit I could see a neater mounting solution than just what was normally supplied would allow. Well, they just shipped those brackets with the missing ones, no questions asked. Little things like that matter.

Anyway, should have X,Y and U fully installed on saturday, then I need to plot and scheme a bit more on the Z axis, although I have a basic plan in mind.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 09, 2020, 11:24:32 PM
Stuart -  a DRO on a lathe would be wonderful. I saw one on an immaculate beige-painted Myford Super 7 on show at a ME exhibition in Bristol a few years back. Stunning!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 10, 2020, 05:26:04 PM
Yes I think that would be a fantastic addition. I aim to see how I get on with this set up, and maybe next year after I sell a couple more bikes on, I'll invest in a lathe set up. That will have to wait though.

Meanwhile - I finished up the X, Y and column DRO installs.

I've been using a DTI to get the scales as parallel to the relevant axis as possible. For the most part this was not difficult. The Y took me a few goes. Here is the column getting checked:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2r89GNR/0/919be09a/XL/IMG_5719%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2r89GNR/A)

Then using the shim to set the read gap:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Fm4cqs4/0/dbc494e4/XL/IMG_5720%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Fm4cqs4/A)

After that, it was a matter of routing the cables so that they don't tangle with anything. The cables are very long, so that they will work in any installation. No big deal, I routed them where I wanted them, then looped them up and tied them in place on the rear of the column out of the way. Can't even see them when working the mill.

Loop for the column:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-NV5V3HZ/0/2338928b/X2/IMG_5721%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-NV5V3HZ/A)

At maximum lower travel the cable loop stays nicely clear of everything. The metal clips and screws come with the kit - just a matter of drilling and tapping a hole where you want it.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2JgzLzh/0/cac582ad/X2/IMG_5722%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2JgzLzh/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Bcf2t8N/0/fe7f4a6c/X2/IMG_5723%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-Bcf2t8N/A)

And the back of the machine:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2hrzj6J/0/8eb5f958/X2/IMG_5724%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-2hrzj6J/A)

Cable loops for X and Y:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-BzRPtzM/0/4c3bf66f/X2/IMG_5725%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-BzRPtzM/A)

You may think that I have lost some table travel in the Y direction, but not really. The table is past the center of the spindle before the screws holding the sensor bracket hit the column, and the lower concertina actually compresses and stops the table just ahead of the screws hitting, so although technically I could take the concertina guard off and get another inch of travel - in reality I'm never going to need it. Haven't yet in the 7 years I've owned the mill.

I may put a thin cover over the top of the X scale and read head, but it's not critical.

Just the quill axis to figure out now! I need to do some scheming. But I'm ready to use X and Y, which is a great start. I have already figured out some play in the handwheel drives that were likely the result of some position inaccuracy I was seeing. I could compensate now I know about it, but this is better.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 11, 2020, 11:02:45 AM
Looking great, Stuart. What a clean shop too! The mill is immaculate.

Here's how I did mine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYhjgh9H50c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biL2vJSFsms

Nothing much to teach you - I'm sure you know more about this than I do, just for interest (and an example of a shop that is neither clean nor tidy most of the time). However one thing I was quite pleased with was my idea for guards to protect the scales fro swarf, made from square section rainwater pipe (seen in the second video).

On DRO's on lathes: absolutely! In fact the Myford ML10 that I have in France has the scales on it already from the previous owner. All it needs is the display, which is on my 'to do' list. Unfortunately, though, that seems to be the machine that has suffered the most water damage. I'm daring to hope it will be ok though...
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 11, 2020, 08:27:26 PM
Thanks Gary.

Great videos! Some good info in there and food for thought. I know you'll be able to recover your Myford. It's heartbreaking for sure, but stay positive.

I've been enjoying my mill the last day or so. Mounting the quill DRO requires a bit more custom effort than the other axes. My original plan was to fix the scale, and make a bracket to hold the read head to the quill somehow.

I've decided to go the sliding scale approach instead though. I mocked up something to get my head around it. Bit of a crude model here:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-j77nQmq/0/54035ad1/XL/Quill%20DRO-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-j77nQmq/A)

The idea is to make a bracket set up from aluminium bar that holds the scale firmly as it passes under the read head. This will be important, as the scale will mount to a flat bar that is only attachd one end, but attaches to a clamp firmly secured to the quill.

Anyway, made a couple of bits from stock I had laying around

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bLM3RgW/0/8aa22496/XL/IMG_5726%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bLM3RgW/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-DDmxCj3/0/c8660373/XL/IMG_5730%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-DDmxCj3/A)

Nothing fancy at all, but these parts were very quick to knock out, and more accurate than I normally achieve.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-mnkH4wg/0/d2da5b7e/XL/IMG_5727%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-mnkH4wg/A)

0.0015 over length! Bah! (Well, 0.001 to 0.002 over length, instrument uncertainty being what it is.  :Lol: I'll take it).

It has been interesting to discover how much play the machine dials have before the table actually moves, and also how far the table moves when locking into position. For sure a 1/2 thou every time locked, but without compensating during tightening the clamps, can jump 1 or 2 thou - especially when unlocking. All told it's easy to see where 5 to 10 thou of variation can creep in when you can't see it.

Anyhoo, got some more material on the way to get this finished up.

In the meantime I did add a cover to the X axis, since that scale and read head were getting covered in swarf. The DRO kits come with a length of extrusion for each scale, a simple right angle lipped channel. Cut to length, and drill a clearance hole each end to mount to the scale, in tapped holes provided for the purpose. Neat and simple, and still sub flush to the table top - and even with this I still don't lose any table travel.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-wccbxhM/0/2f427d4f/X2/IMG_5728%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-wccbxhM/A)

Underside showing how the extrusion covers theread head and scale. I need to put a notch somewhere to get better access to the table oiler. Or just pop the cover off once in a while.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-8b4C6Ph/0/a621c5f7/X2/IMG_5729%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-8b4C6Ph/A)

I'm looking forward to getting the quill done, because I have figured out how to move forward on my steam engine base casting, having watched a machinist at work establish a position on a very complex part by using pin gauges. But I need to accurately machine to depth using the quill, so might as well finish up this install first.

Also, need to conduct a small capability study and understand how well the DRO system is measuring - but based on my little exercise today they are doing a better job than going off the hand dials.

 :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 11, 2020, 10:06:58 PM
Thank you Stuart. The Myford and othermachines are now under plastic.   :ThumbsUp:

I reckon there are as many ways to install a DRO as there are DRO installations!

Very nice job.

I see you have discovered the joys of table lock movement.   :)

I was fortunate in that my mill came with a small DRO on the z axis. Not as good as the real deal, but good enough to make it not worthwhile to mount a scale on the quill...

Enjoying this thread!

 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Sleddog on October 21, 2020, 01:34:23 PM
Prop, I’ve got a DRO Pro mounted on my 755 also. You’re going to enjoy not counting revolutions!
BTW, it’s ‘meringue on the PIE’ not cherry on the cake🤦‍♂️

Cheers
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 21, 2020, 08:54:42 PM
Well great to hear from you sir, and Meringue on the PIE! it is! So much more noble than a cherry, which belongs in my manhattan in any case. That's for later.

I've had a heck of a project on at work, which had me in the factory literally around the clock, so have not been able to finish up the DRO install. Also, had a nice weekend away after the work project for some R and R, which was great. I am now, however, back at it, and have a few days off work. Why sit at work designing things on solidworks, and figuring out how they should be machined and fabricated, when I can do that for myself?

So - got the quill DRO installed today. Made up some brackets per my design

Guide bracket

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-DDmxCj3/0/c8660373/XL/IMG_5730%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-DDmxCj3/A)

This is a mounting plate which will go behind the mill head front panel.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vfwtpkG/0/87b6f8a2/XL/IMG_5731%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vfwtpkG/A)

And a slider bar for the scale to mount to:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-VMNQWzj/0/f763f643/XL/IMG_5732%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-VMNQWzj/A)

This is what is behind the front panel

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bVfd8wd/0/dfead9a1/X2/IMG_5733%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bVfd8wd/A)

I drilled some clearance holes in the front panel to match the positions on the mounting bracket, then added a couple of tapped holes to the quill clamp:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vdHqqWK/0/4ea73061/X2/IMG_5735%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vdHqqWK/A)

Here you can see the mount bracket through the slot, and the two front guide brackets in place:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-p3tG5tN/0/02289a94/X2/IMG_5736%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-p3tG5tN/A)

With everything installed and trued up:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-rZM5ntQ/0/132f163f/X2/IMG_5737%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-rZM5ntQ/A)

At maximum travel:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bxTFrMN/0/c79b94b0/X2/IMG_5738%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-bxTFrMN/A)

So as you can see, the scale slides, while the read head stays in position. Principal benefit is making the cable routing a bit easier, as it all stays fixed in place on top of the head. Obviously a loop is needed behind the machine to allow for the column travel.

I added some thin teflon self adhesive strip on the back of the slider bar for smooth operation.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-7Z9gnSm/0/ed1991fc/X2/IMG_5739%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-7Z9gnSm/A)

The read head cable goes over the top of the gear box. Here temporarily held in place with self adhesive cable ties. Once I have run this a bit and I'm happy with it, I'll likely replace those with proper screwed on metal clips.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-h68sz4h/0/70818247/X2/IMG_5740%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-h68sz4h/A)

And there we are - a 4 axis DRO set up.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-nwrgrsd/1/eed98138/XL/IMG_5741%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-nwrgrsd/A)

I have already been enjoying using the X and Y axes in making brackets for the Z axis, and I am very much looking forward to getting back to work on an engine. I also have to do some measurement tests and verify accuracy, but so far have seen nothing to be concerned about. Parts I have made have mated together better than I've ever achieved so far.

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 21, 2020, 10:52:45 PM
Fabulous!

Congratulations. Quite a transformation of your setup.

 :cheers:

gary
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 21, 2020, 11:56:04 PM
Thanks Gary,

I’m very pleased. I’ve been getting the mill set up to take up the engine again.

One other thing I might do on this DRO install is nake an extension for the monitor arm. Going to run it for a while and see how I feel, but I can see a 6” extension beinging the monitor past the quill speed handle as beneficial.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Noitoen on October 22, 2020, 08:42:37 PM
Just a comment on the mill's pictures. Should't the oil be visible on the level glass?
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 22, 2020, 09:11:05 PM
Yes - half way up the glass. It is there - I keep the oil clean, so it is not immediately obvious in the above pictures.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 23, 2020, 10:59:14 PM
I conducted a little gauge study today. Should have done it BEFORE machining things really, but not a big issue as it turns out. I had enough evidence that I knew the DRO's were reading accurately, I just didn't have a figure to put on it. Anyway, for my satisfaction I did it today before going any further.

I started by setting up a 2-4-6 block, and getting it properly square to the table.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-5pDRmqg/0/35cbb400/XL/IMG_5796%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-5pDRmqg/A)

Then it was a pretty simple method - use the quill mounted DTI to touch off on the various faces, move the table and touch off on the opposite end of the block, and record the measurements from the DRO.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-6Z75P5N/0/0db0844f/XL/IMG_5797%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-6Z75P5N/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-gdMNWPk/0/7ae22273/XL/IMG_5798%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-gdMNWPk/A)

Here I am setting zero on one end of the 6.0" faces.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-44TqS3t/0/78aca3f8/XL/IMG_5802%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-44TqS3t/A)

And, after moving to the other end.....(X axis check this one)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-6W8KKFh/0/d332b8b0/XL/IMG_5803%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-6W8KKFh/A)

Not bad. The DRO's resolution is 0.0002" at best - and from doing some repeated zero tests it's easy to get a variation of 0.0004" just from slight errors in getting the DTI to read zero.

Anyway, I repeated this test multiple times on the 2-4-6 block in all directions, and here are my measurements:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vH3TCB3/0/d3bd7d4c/M/Screenshot%202020-10-23%20164047-M.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-vH3TCB3/A)

Overall I'm happy with that, although I thought X ought to do a bit better. So I followed up with some measurements on some different length gauge blocks:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-FMxrNQF/0/c0d4c648/S/Screenshot%202020-10-23%20164007-S.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-FMxrNQF/A)

Basically, the error is less than 1 thou on any axis, with Y and Z being the most accurate. But I will repeat this study over multiple days just for  verification.

In any case - this is probably a factor of 20 improvement over accuracy and repeatability with just the hand dials. I am happy with this.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 24, 2020, 02:59:42 PM
I suppose I should test my DRO like this too. However, I always seem to manage to find something else to do first...

Kudos to you for your patience.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on October 24, 2020, 03:36:54 PM
 Thanks Gary,

After being fooled by my hand wheels, I wanted to know that my heard earned $$'s were well spent.

Not only......but also..............knowing this, the mill now becomes a very powerful measurement tool as well as an accurate mill.

I still have to test the different positions on the table X axis and make sure the accuracy is consistent across the whole travel, but this nevertheless gives me some good confidence.

Got another new machine for the workshop yesterday.........

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-8XdKkFL/0/be297dac/XL/IMG_5805%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Mill-DRO-Install/i-8XdKkFL/A)


 :ROFL:

Love me a chicken kiev. No doubt this will end up getting pressed into service to heat up bearing housings at some point. For now, lunch!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on October 24, 2020, 03:39:19 PM
Nice one!   :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on October 24, 2020, 05:40:03 PM
Looks like you've got yourself a new powder coating oven, Stuart!  Of course, I'd refrain from cooking lunch in it after you've used it for that :)
Nice acquisition!
Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on November 05, 2020, 01:44:57 PM
 :ROFL: Thanks Kim - good idea! I can see the oven being pressed into service for that. Although I'll hate to give up the ability to warm up a nice Parkers Meat Pie! Yum.

Anyway - felt like chiming in now that I have a couple of weeks of use of my mill since fitting the DRO's. One of the many benefits, beyond making accurate parts, is repeatability. I am extremely happy with how these are performing. I can now very accurately find locations of edges and features, which means I can return a cutting tool to a specific location, within approximately a half thousandth of an inch, which is about 3um I think. That not only means improved dimensional accuracy, but also vastly improved geometry (parallelism, profile, perpendicularity etc), and vastly improved surface finishes - and more quickly. All from what is, in all honesty, a fairly cheap, not very rigid, imported hobby mill. But the ways on the mill at least move properly perpendicular to each other and the spindle, and the spindle runout is about a half thou, so cheap and non rigid as it is, once it's capabilities are understood, and the dynamics of the cutter are more or less understood (cutter flex and such) a quantam leap in part quality is achieved. In short, expensive though those DRO's are, they were worth the investment.

As yet I've only used the system for basic location and indicating - there are many more possibilities to explore in terms of measuring using a probe, and programming for bolt patterns and more complex patterns.

I am so happy that I'll likely write to DRO pros and tell them so. I'm a great believer in positive feedback, especially in these days of social media where "flaming" those who have wronged you (usually because of some minor misunderstanding or error) is the norm.



Which is nice.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on November 05, 2020, 08:54:05 PM
Yes, it has transformed your mill into a proper measurin' iron!

The repeatability is one of the great things - just effortlessly winding till you hit that same zero (or whatever). As you say, the quality takes a serious boost.

Very good point you make about the social media culture, and I salute your wish to counterbalance the negativity. One of the nice things about this forum is that people are generally very friendly, and any criticism is usually offered constructively in the form of suggestions on how else things may be done. If there is any trolling on here, I have never seen it.

 :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on November 05, 2020, 10:19:01 PM
Being a "smaller" board helps with that a bit, but I agree - top notch folks on here, nothing negative at all. very nice forum with great feedback from the membership. I don't even look at any other ME forums.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on November 07, 2020, 10:17:00 PM
New tools! A shiny tappy hammer.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-XpDrhmm/0/XL/i-XpDrhmm-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/Misc-Small-Stuff/i-XpDrhmm/A)

And some inserts to try. Thought these would fit on my existing tooling, but made an error there, so new holders arriving tomorrow. I'm interested to see how these do on carbon steel. There are some different designs here, with different PVD coatings. Allegedly good for steel medium and fine finishes. Also got a couple of non ferrous inserts. Anyway - some fun and learning to be had.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-spH8bR4/0/XL/i-spH8bR4-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/Misc-Small-Stuff/i-spH8bR4/A)
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on November 08, 2020, 09:47:04 PM
Made a few test cuts today on some plain carbon steel. I'm on the continual look out for the best way to achieve good "as turned" finishes on carbon steel.

Long story short - my best recipe is still to run the spindle as slow as possible, and use coolant.

This is a test cut with those parameters using a carbide insert.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-sFQsQKh/0/XL/i-sFQsQKh-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Tests/i-sFQsQKh/A)

This is a test cut, same conditions using a high speed steel insert.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-kZ4Zm9G/0/XL/i-kZ4Zm9G-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Tests/i-kZ4Zm9G/A)

So far, the high speed steel wins out. Both reasonable finishes I think.

I can rough out material much faster, but to get a nice finish I have to slow right down and take very light finish cuts. I can live with that.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on November 22, 2020, 09:28:23 PM
New acquisitions:

Dividing head. From Precision Matthews - possibly bigger than I really need, but this is a very, very nice piece of kit. I had a little 4" rotary table from Grizzly - which was a horrible piece of junk and I could not get it to run true, free or anything else. It shall be pitched, or find a new home.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-5hqKKBD/0/8c864344/X2/IMG_5933%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-5hqKKBD/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-KbH9hNX/0/55dfd0d1/X2/IMG_5935%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-KbH9hNX/A)

And a new tool post. I machined up the T nut yesterday, and I have been using it today. In this pic, just sat next to the old tool post. I'm very happy with this.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-hD5Sm6L/0/72a94ed7/X2/IMG_5932%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/New-Equipment/i-hD5Sm6L/A)
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on November 23, 2020, 08:10:09 AM
Oh yes.... very nice indeed.

The dividing head is fabulous. Lots of fun ahead with that...
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 30, 2021, 12:40:49 AM
Thought I'd post an update. I haven't machined much lately, because I was finishing the rebuild of one of my motorcycles, so that I could sell it. That mission was accomplished, the bike duly sold, and some of the proceeds put towards some tooling.

One of the acquisitions was a 3 jaw mini chuck (and also a 4 jaw). I have been struggling to hold some of the really small components I need to make, so I thought get one of these, make a stub for it, and hold it in my collet chuck for small parts. That was the subject of todays shednanigans.

The chuck - it has an M14 X 1 thread in the back.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-HkCtPTM/0/b9c138f7/L/IMG_6215%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-HkCtPTM/A)

I found a chunk of something in the scrap bin, and it looked like it would make a decent stub, so there it is:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-NBFSCRb/0/fd6af35c/L/IMG_6216%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-NBFSCRb/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-MJKRFjm/0/06ed7c58/L/IMG_6217%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-MJKRFjm/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-pjXD73H/0/fa859ca2/L/IMG_6218%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-pjXD73H/A)

I learned about how easily threading inserts chip today, so while I did complete the thread, I am not going to show it to you.

Anyway, all done and installed:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-47NzrDL/0/5aaca335/L/IMG_6219%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-47NzrDL/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-PFghMpm/0/6ff0fac2/L/IMG_6225%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-PFghMpm/A)

I still  have to drill and pin the chuck to the stub so that I can use it in reverse. This worked really well - I used it to make some brass 5-40 nuts for my engine. Now I will make a similar stub for the 4 jaw.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 30, 2021, 12:51:03 AM
By the way, the chuck came from an import tooling company called "Complete Machinery Equipment" (CME) - seller niuniucme on fleabay. I have been pleased with their quality / price / customer service combination. I also acquired a 6" rotary table from them which is far higher quality than I expected for the $200 price tag. More on that in due course.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on May 30, 2021, 06:31:00 AM
Nice work on the small 3J chuck!  I've done something quite similar with my little Taig 3 & 4 jaw chucks - I used a short piece of 1" diameter steel to make a 3/4" threads to hold the Taig chucks on.  I hold the 1" adapter in a 5C collet.  It works quite well for holding the Taig chucks!

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on May 30, 2021, 12:20:24 PM
That is extremely nifty.
Small is beautiful!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 30, 2021, 02:09:39 PM
As the actress said to the bishop. Badum tsh!

I am pleased with it. Lovely to machine - I think it’s 303 stainless steel. The joy of sharp inserts, flood coolant and free machining material. Good use of a chunk that was partially machined from some other job.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: gary.a.ayres on May 30, 2021, 03:27:42 PM
 :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on June 26, 2021, 01:35:38 AM
I like that chuck!     How's the run out?

Dave

Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on June 26, 2021, 05:31:26 PM
That's a great question Dave.

I just did a test to find out. I wasn't overly concerned because the ER40 collet chuck I use is a "set true" - and I can adjust the run out on it, so I always figured I could just adjust that when using the little chuck and get it where it needs to be. However - inquiring minds want to know!

So I put a 1/2" gauge pin in my collet chuck and clocked the run out, which came in at about 2/10 of a thou TIR. Can't tell you how happy I was about that.

Then I installed the mini chuck in the collet, with the gauge pin in the chuck. Run out measures 0.007" TIR. Not so good.
Then I rotated the mini chuck 90 degrees in the collet and tried again, and it came in at 0.002" TIR. Still not great, but seems reasonable for an inexpensive 3 jaw. I might even be able to get it better by tweaking its rotation position some more in the collet chuck - I haven't tried very hard on that, but figure this is a pretty good demonstration. At this point I would be able to adjust the set true if necessary to get it closer.

Thanks for checking in! I haven't been working on my engine, but I'm making motorcycle accessories, so still very much enjoying my hobby machining, and still making improvements. My mild steel finishes today are really nice, I'm having a good time in the shed.  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on June 26, 2021, 05:42:28 PM
Well I messed with a little more in the collet chuck, and got it to 0.0015 TIR - I actually think that's pretty decent.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on June 26, 2021, 05:55:33 PM
Not bad at all for a 3 jaw!   

Dave
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on September 29, 2021, 01:35:50 AM
I have not had much shed time over the last six weeks. It has been a hectic time, mostly good though. Anyway, managed to sell a sidecar that I shouldn’t have bought in the first place, and used that money to buy a new welding table. I was originally going to design and build my own, but when I priced that all out, this purchased kit was cheaper, and while it is very light duty in real welding terms, it’s going to be more than adequate for my hobbyist use. I have another, smaller but heavier duty table for beating the living daylights out of things. This one I like because it’s covered in fixturing holes. I got a start on it at the weekend. It’s slow going because I’m very new to welding, but I’m making progress. One of our ASME pressure vessel welders at work has offered to come and give me some tips, so I’m excited about that. Anyway, here it is:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-r3mdKH2/0/4e51851f/X2/IMG_8116-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-r3mdKH2/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-xLPn8Q2/0/1747fa66/XL/IMG_8117-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-xLPn8Q2/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cCHLSv4/0/5414b9d5/XL/IMG_8126-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Stuff/Shed/i-cCHLSv4/A)

Got a ways to go yet, but I am very excited for the possibilities a new skill brings - albeit at a very novice level.
 
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: cnr6400 on September 29, 2021, 02:13:37 AM
That's a great looking welding table! I like it.  :cheers:   :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

And if your co-worker with the PV ticket comes by, it will probably hold 3000 psi!   :Lol:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on September 29, 2021, 02:23:54 AM
Holy welding table Batman!

Sorry, couldn’t help it.

It will be even better once it’s up on its own legs.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on September 29, 2021, 05:54:55 AM
That looks like it's going to be a really nice welding table!  Makes me want one...

Unfortunately, I have no room :(

Maybe someday.  I'm glad you've got one though!

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 08, 2022, 12:11:34 PM
Brrrrrrr. It's that time of the year.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-xwm54hd/0/5ca94359/XL/IMG_8869%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-xwm54hd/A)

Once inside though, it's always toasty warm, and fun awaits!

This is the welding / cutting / grinding bay. The welding curtain is more about preventing migration of dust to the motorcycle area. It actually works well.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-bGktS9d/0/996199a9/XL/IMG_8337%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-bGktS9d/A)

And then through the double doors into the machine tool area. Used to be a motorcycle maintenance area as well, but I'm done with motorbikes now, except for my one sidecar outfit. I had 14 bikes at one time, but I've lost interest since I was in a bad accident.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-kdHb9g4/0/fd80b7be/XL/IMG_8338%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-kdHb9g4/A)

I got my welding table finished a while ago, and it's very nice, although it is not flat. I must have put too much heat into it. I'm going to attempt to flatten it by heating the stiffening ribs on the underside - a trick the welders at work told me about.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Welding/i-qhmKn92/0/e70b1751/XL/IMG_8280%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Welding/i-qhmKn92/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Welding/i-hK5DnZr/0/9030259d/XL/IMG_8281%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Welding/i-hK5DnZr/A)
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Dave Otto on January 08, 2022, 07:22:50 PM
Nice shop Stuart!

Dave
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on January 08, 2022, 07:30:19 PM
Beautiful shop!  Nice that you can keep it cozy warm too!  Makes it more inviting, as you say :)

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Roger B on January 08, 2022, 09:12:46 PM
Wonderful  :)  :) So much space  :ThumbsUp:  :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steam guy willy on January 08, 2022, 10:08:13 PM
New tools! A shiny tappy hammer.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-XpDrhmm/0/XL/i-XpDrhmm-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/Misc-Small-Stuff/i-XpDrhmm/A)

And some inserts to try. Thought these would fit on my existing tooling, but made an error there, so new holders arriving tomorrow. I'm interested to see how these do on carbon steel. There are some different designs here, with different PVD coatings. Allegedly good for steel medium and fine finishes. Also got a couple of non ferrous inserts. Anyway - some fun and learning to be had.









(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-spH8bR4/0/XL/i-spH8bR4-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/New-Tools/Misc-Small-Stuff/i-spH8bR4/A)




I like the new hammer and has it just been cast ?? a few hours time and it will be cool enough to hold .?!!! :lolb: :lolb: :lolb:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on January 09, 2022, 12:20:05 PM
Ha! Yes that orange look makes it look red hot - that’s funny.

It’s a lovely space - I’m really lucky (though I had a large part to play in creating that luck). I need to get more productive now. I have a welding project to finish up - a custom plant rack for my wife. It’s aluminium so it’s a challenge. But once that is done I can get back to my stuff.

That said, I consider myself very lucky indeed to have a spouse who places great value on home made things.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on March 05, 2022, 09:10:07 PM
Made a couple of adjustments in the milling area this week. I bought a set of used levelling pads some time ago - got a set of 8 for the price of 4 new ones, then sold on the 4 I didn't need so myself and someone else got a set of levelling pads each for about a quarter of the new price. That's a win. Anyway, I finally installed them. Glad I did - the mill table is actually level front to back and side to side, but not only that the mill is completely stable. No rocking. I love that. Should have done this a long time ago.

There they are, under the mill in all the shavings.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-PsBQ3dh/0/cd3be993/L/IMG_9138%20%28Large%29-L.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-PsBQ3dh/A)

Also, added a compressed air drop near the mill. Now I can reach up and have compressed air on hand while I'm working. This is great - I can keep the vise leadscrew clear of chips at last, and clean off work as I go. A simple but excellent addition.

Wonky pic.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-HLrHK8d/0/74b8cdc6/X2/IMG_9137%20%28Large%29-X2.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-HLrHK8d/A)

It was a lot of faffing around putting in that air circuit, which I think I did about 3 years ago now. But I'm glad I did, having air drops strategically situated around the shop is excellent. I picked up another identical air circuit kit from the local "mens used stuff" shop for $15, so I'm going to do the other area of shoppe as well.

 :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on March 06, 2022, 05:31:59 AM
The leveling feet are nice!  And I'm jealous of your air drops around your shop! I've got one hose that I move about with me.   It's not bad, but but it sure would be nice to not have the air hose kicking around on the floor all the time!

You've got an A1 setup there Stuart!

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on March 07, 2022, 01:54:17 PM
Thanks Kim,

Modifying the shop and the tools a bit here and there is as fun a part of the hobby as the engines themselves. That speed aire (I think that's the brand) is pretty nice, and as reasonably priced a way of doing the circuit as any. A long time ago I was considering doing it all in copper tube which would have been a lot of work, and one reason it took years to get to. When I discovered these kits it happened very quickly. The circuit I have is 3/4" diameter, but that's overkill. If I were to do it again I'd go with the smaller kit at 1/2", which is a lot cheaper. The 3/4" is not silly expensive, but there is no need to spend the extra for it in most home shops.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on March 07, 2022, 04:05:55 PM
Interesting?  Could it have been RapidAir? I googled SpeedAire and came up with RapidAir.  Looks pretty interesting!  I could see doing that someday! :)  Nice shop improvement project!

Thanks Stuart!
Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on March 07, 2022, 04:35:51 PM
RapidAir! That's the one.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Twizseven on March 07, 2022, 06:11:05 PM
Love the space in that workshop.  My space is 33ft x 24ft and its crammed solid.  Just space for one car which insurance will not allow to be parked outside overnight.

Colin
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on March 07, 2022, 11:30:27 PM
Hi Colin,

I did get lucky on finding this space, and I love it to bits. Some intense work at one stage of my life funded building out the interior, and having given up motorcycling my amateur fabricating and machining is now my major hobby, so I have had a major purge over the last 4 years resulting in selling all my bikes, and gaining a lot of space. I'm still gradually clearing out things here and there and those funds buy consumables and materials. It's funny how these things grow over time though.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 16, 2022, 05:50:50 PM
The latest and greatest shoppe modification.............

Mosquito netting! I added a clip on (marine style snaps with velcro along the top for a seal) mossy net, so that I can weld and fabricate in the main part of the shoppe in summer with the door open, and not be bombarded by flying fings when I'm working.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-xf9w8Q7/0/adb05c4b/XL/IMG_9466%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-xf9w8Q7/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-2Tvr3Kc/0/6e4dbe2e/XL/IMG_9468%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Misc-Shoppe-Pics/i-2Tvr3Kc/A)

I'm rather pleased with this, I have to say. Simple and effective.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Kim on May 16, 2022, 08:39:09 PM
That's great, Stuart!  It is really nice to work with the door up in nice weather, isn't it! Sometimes the low tech improvements are the best of all! :ThumbsUp:

Kim
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: Vixen on May 16, 2022, 08:47:50 PM
That's an impressively large and clean workshop Stuart.  :ThumbsUp: :ThumbsUp:

The clip on mosquito netting is a very clever idea, I am so glad I don't have that problem to contend with.

Mike
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 16, 2022, 09:14:14 PM
Kim - yes absolutely. A lot of days are quite humid, but come evening time usually cools off a bit and it and it's just nice to have the fresh air come in. But the mosquitos will exsanguinate you in a matter of minutes around here so until now it's just not been practical except on a very few spring and fall days.

Mike - thanks! This shop is very much a labor of love, and I've been careful to move stuff on rather than fall into the trap of acquire and keep for no reason. Finding this property with this shed already built was a stroke of luck, since then I've gradually added to it and improved it.

Anyway the netting comes from a company called Mosquito Curtains. they have some very fancy options to allow you to have the curtains on rails, magnetic joining strips and all sorts, but simple is the way to go on this one.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: steamer on May 16, 2022, 11:42:48 PM
looking for the shop envy emoticon!
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on May 17, 2022, 01:16:38 AM
Ha - now I need to leverage it and start making good parts. Although I genuinely think I'm improving and getting more accurate.
Title: Re: Workshop Log
Post by: propforward on June 05, 2022, 06:21:15 PM
I observed my mini 4 jaw chuck on my rolly cart, and realized I have not yet made a stub for it. I fancied a go at single point threading today, plus I have been looking at a piece of 316L that I filched from the scrap bin at work, and just wanted to try turning it into something. Sooooo...........

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-hG29rfj/0/e359340d/XL/IMG_6624%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-hG29rfj/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-ntxdKDk/0/528071b6/XL/IMG_6625%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-ntxdKDk/A)

M14 X 1.0 thread:

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-ZqtF5PT/0/999ce9de/XL/IMG_6626%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-ZqtF5PT/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-PgqsDxD/0/755d6f31/XL/IMG_6627%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-PgqsDxD/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-XS5jB7n/0/98c56f0b/XL/IMG_6629%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-XS5jB7n/A)

(https://photos.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-k7WjHjD/0/823fb16c/XL/IMG_6628%20%28Large%29-XL.jpg) (https://propforward.smugmug.com/Steam-Engines/Shoppe/Fixtures/Mini-Lathe-Chucks/i-k7WjHjD/A)

That went alright. Now, when I need this, it is ready, rather than making me all peevish because I didn't do it in advance.

Now I have to mow the mosquito pit that is the lawn.  :Mad:
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