Wanted Part built Westbury 15cc Seal engine

[Vixen]

Hello everybody,

I'm planning ahead. My next project involves a tracked vehicle, engine and gearbox. That's a lot of things to make, so I was hoping to save some time by finding a  part completed Westbury 15cc Seal engine. for this new project.

Do any of our members have or know someone who would be willing to sell a  part completed Westbury 15cc Seal engine.

I've already asked Jo, but unfortunately she was not able to help. Hemingway do sell casting kits, but I was really after a part built engine so save some time.

Can anyone help?

Mike

[crueby]

Curiosity engaged...  Lombard gas truck? Hornsby tractor?

[Vixen]

Curiosity engaged...  Lombard gas truck? Hornsby tractor?

Na, your way off.

The next project was to be a Universal Carrier better know as a WW2 Bren Gun Carrier. There's so much stuff to make, so I was hoping to save some time by finding a  part completed Westbury 15cc Seal engine. for this new project.

Mike

[Jasonb]

Well I know Jo has a part completed one but I expect her companion won't let it go.

Mike if you do find you need to make the crankshaft have a look at the posts by Martin in this thread with a better version of a crankshaft cutting program to the one by JS discussed earlier.

https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=149047&p=2

Might just be quicker to get one of those Toyan V4 engines and plonk that into your model

[cnr6400]

Or one of these maybe -

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P2LP5gJHPE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P2LP5gJHPE</a>

Bags of power, realistic 4 stroke sound, not too expensive, much more reliable and much higher power per CC  than any Westbury-designed engine. Parts available too. Flywheel equivalent to prop would be needed, and a simple centrifugal or plate clutch. Just food for thought. Several RC flyer friends have these A38 OHC 38 cc engines and like them.

[Vixen]

Thanks for the alternative engine suggestions. I appreciate your help.

Unfortunately for various reasons, the only engine which will fit the requirements of my new project is the Westbury 15cc Seal engine. I just hope I can find either a complete engine or a part built one otherwise I may have to cancel the order for the tracked vehicle kit. Bummer

Mike

[sorveltaja]

Mike, that could be one crazy project. Fingers crossed, that you eventually manage find the engine for it. If not now, perhaps in the future.

[Vixen]

Thanks All

This is the ionic Bren Gun Carrier from WW2 . It comes as a kit from Armortek and is normally powered by an electric motor. But I wish to fit it with a water cooled four cylinder engine and a two speed plus reverse gearbox. The Carrier will of course be radio controlled. I have built several engine powered tanks in the past.






The engine and transmission have to fit in that narrow box in the centre of the rear compartment. I have done the preliminary design which show that a Westbury 15 cc Seal engine and the transmission will just (only Just) fit into that engine box.

So the search is on for a complete or part built Westbury 15cc Seal  engine.

Mike

[Jo]

You can always make one. I suspect you will be horrified at the prices they go for second hand 

Jo

[kvom]

Those tracks look time-consuming.   

[Vixen]

You can always make one. I suspect you will be horrified at the prices they go for second hand 

Jo

But so far I have yet to find someone to tell me the price of a second hand one

Mike

[Vixen]

Those tracks look time-consuming.   

There are over 350 track links in a complete set. They have been diecast in aluminium alloy somewhere in China and must contribute a significant percentage of the cost of the kit.

Mike

[Jo]

But so far I have yet to find someone to tell me the price of a second hand one

You might get a scruffy/rough one from about £500 but you will never be totally sure what you have brought 

Jo

[Vixen]

You might get a scruffy/rough one from about £500 but you will never be totally sure what you have brought 

Jo

But that's what I may get if I were to build one myself from scratch

We live in hope

Mike

[Jasonb]

. They have been diecast in aluminium alloy somewhere in China and must contribute a significant percentage of the cost of the kit.

Make sure you fumigate them and wear a mask when assembling, don't want to catch any nasties!

That Silver Ghost looks good too and you get an engine with that .

[vcutajar]

Mike

If you manage to find the engine you are looking for, will you be doing a build log on the Armortek forum?  Would love to see how you go about it.

Vince

[ChuckKey]

A handful of model petrol engines usually appear in a Dreweatts (say 'Drewits') Transport Sale. The next is 7 April, but no catalogue yet. They tend to fetch a lot less than they probably would on Ebay.

My two pence worth is that I would not buy a nearly-finished engine without a very careful inspection. I suspect that in many cases they have been ballsed-up in a way that the original maker could not summon the enthusiasm to try to fix.

[Vixen]

My two pence worth is that I would not buy a nearly-finished engine without a very careful inspection. I suspect that in many cases they have been ballsed-up in a way that the original maker could not summon the enthusiasm to try to fix.

Thanks ChuckKey, that's a very sensible piece of advice. Truth is, we all have a stalled build hidden away for just that reason.

Vince, we can decide which forum, if any, when we get there.

Well my enquiry has had a very good airing on the forum, over 200 views. At the moment, my only option appears to be a new set of castings from Hemingway. Nothing else has appeared out of the woodwork or dusty shelves.

Cheers

Mike

[zeeprogrammer]

Truth is, we all have a stalled build hidden away for just that reason.

Or more than one. 

...we can decide which forum, if any, when we get there.

Here please.

[Zephyrin]

a part build engine...
it means often a unfinishable engine owing to hidden flaw or hardly recoverable mistake...it is generally faster to start from scratch...

why not a Toyan engine, 4 stroke glow, many version do exist, from single to v4 engine, with electric starter, dedicated to drive RC models...

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/4000317927878.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000023.12.30df7bf9MPaUo8

[gadabout]

It's a simple and reasonably quick engine to build, hey if I can anyone can! There are quite a few errors on the plans and original build log , mine runs very nicely and am very pleased with it!
Mark

[Jasonb]

Mike

You could also put a Wanted add in the classifieds on ME website and also Home Workshop, both probably get more UK visitors than here

[Vixen]

Hello Everyone,

Thanks for your help, suggestions and good advice.

The search for a part build engine is now officially OVER. I have just ordered a set of castings from Hemingway. They should be here early next week.

On reflection and from listening to your advice, it will probably be quicker and easier, in the long run, to start from scratch; rather than to try and fix someone else's cock-ups

Thanks again, You are a great bunch of guys and gals    ,

Mike

[Jo]

We are looking forward to reading all about it in your build log Mike 

I might have to get back to my ones or you could finish yours first 

Jo

[Vixen]

Hello Jo,

This will be my first ever engine built from a casting set. So that will be a new experience and a whole new learning curve. I am sure I will be seeking your advice from time to time.

I guess the first thing is to square off both ends, top and bottom of the crankcase casting to provide a reference datum; then it's coordinate drilling and boring; like I am used to.

The very first job is to redraw Westbury's plans into a metric (or decimal inch) drawing. How could anyone work with a dimension like 37/64"?

Mike

[cnr6400]

How could anyone work with a dimension like 37/64"?

Mike

What, and miss the opportunity to deal with fractions like 37/192" if laying out 3 even spacings along a 37/64" distance? Oh, the joy!   

Just kidding. A very wise thing to go through it and convert it, and verify dimensions at the same time. 

[Jasonb]

Well if you are going as far as redrawing it you may as well have bought a couple of blocks of 6082 and cut from solid Or print off a pattern for the crankcase and get Jo to cast it with her Kiln the rest are probably as quick to make from solid as they are from castings as you are likely to have to "adjust" hole positions to suit the castings rather than drill to drawing which is easier to do on a machine with handwheels.

[ChuckKey]

I guess the first thing is to square off both ends, top and bottom of the crankcase casting to provide a reference datum ...

May I suggest the first thing is to make a detailed survey of the castings so that you can work out exactly where, within each casting, the finished part lies.
You are likely to find places where you have very little metal to play with, or worse. However, often you cannot be sure until you have machined some datums, taking the minimum workable amout of metal off. Then, after re-examination you may find your ideas need adjusting in terms of both position and angle.   

[Jo]

Or print off a pattern for the crankcase and get Jo to cast it with her Kiln

Not sure why you are poking Jason, he was offered a second hand set of castings but we agreed that it was probably better to buy a set from Hemingway as they are rather good value for money Some of the castings are rather interesting..

Jo

[Jasonb]

Just interested to see if the kiln can melt some metal and if it could be used with printed patterns.

So long as the basic mechanicals are the same the casting's don't have to be an exact match to the cast originals, that casting on the left could easily have the fins milled and a small pocketing op for each of the areas around the fixings and the other cavities are not that difficult certainly no harder than anything Mike has already done on his other engines. It may even be better to do it this way as the design could be tweaked to suit Mikes installatiion restrictions for example it may be better to have the top water outlet in a different position to help with plumbing.

But I do agree a virgin casting set is better than taking a risk on a part made one and costs for the two options will be about the same.

[Mcgyver]

Mike.

I look forward to the build....I think I have a set of those castings somewhere so will pay attention!

Just interested to see if the kiln can melt some metal and if it could be used with printed patterns.

I'm really keen on SLA print to investment casting which I think creates new possibilities.  The right print resin becomes the "wax" master;  Its taken over in jewelry making.  The resolution of the SLA print is so high, and with investment casting complications are so easily dealt with (no cores etc). 

The same can be done with printable wax ina filament print, but the detail of SLA is compelling.  The material shrinking probably makes it impractical, but from a resolution standpoint, its holds fine details so well you could cast in the threads.   


I have everything but the SLA printer....the fancy ones are still kind of expensive but I'm almost there, I need to let the updated version of "Reason" run a few trillion more computations.....

[gadabout]

Most of the "features" will be milled away from the end of the castings as they are well over length, I worked from the centre of the casting out so that the dipstick hole was centred in the boss and the stick ended up in the right place down where in the crankcase where it needs to clear the crank.

[Art K]

Mike,
I have to say this sounds like an interesting project, including the Bren carrier bit.
Art

[Vixen]

Hello Art,

This will be a slow burning thread. The Hemingway Seal castings will be available in about six weeks and the Bren Carrier kit by the end of Summer. That sort of suits my timescales as there are a few projects I want to finish and park before I commit to the Bren Carrier.

Mike