Author Topic: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?  (Read 2662 times)

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2020, 05:42:07 PM »
Thanks Dave.

I wanted to break it down to that level, mostly so I could clean it. Also...it was just me unloading everything except the ways and the stand...so I couldn't really have any bigger assemblies.

Thanks for the tip on the de-greaser, I'll def check it out. I also have some Purple Power that I'll probably use as well.

I'm sure its in the Logan manual that I'm ordering today, but what do y'all recommend for lubrication when I reassemble it? I need some way oil, but what about the gearbox and headstock?

I'm pretty happy with it, and am looking forward to cleaning it up and getting her reassembled.

Cheers,
Justin

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2020, 01:16:10 AM »
Hi Justin

I tried some purple stuff one time that I purchased a Home Depot, it made pretty good paint stripper. One of the reasons I like the Oil Eater as it is much easier on paint; but that also depends on how strong you mix it.

See the attached pictures of the South Bend Shaper, my friend who owns a tool and supply store and collects small machines that he likes to display in his store. He purchased this shaper at an auction and asked me if I would clean it up for him. He wanted to retain as much of the original patina as possible (his words), I completely disassembled it and very carefully cleaned each piece. Even the Oil Eater was pretty hard on this old paint, so what I ended up using was Snap-On water-less hand cleaner. I would rub it on and use a soft tooth brush, and plastic scraper on the heavy areas, then rinse and dry it.

I couldn't leave the rusty parts, so all the bright work got polished. He was pretty happy with how it all turned out.

Dave

Offline awake

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2020, 03:35:36 PM »
I'm glad you got the Logan; I think you'll be very pleased!

FWIW, when I have cleaned up any machine tools (including an SB shaper just like the one Dave shows above!), I have mostly used WD40 as a solvent to loosen the grease and grime, lots of paper towels or rags, and some occasional fine steel wool. If there are any raised dings in the ways (or table of a mill), they get stoned out gently with a fine stone. If I am going to repaint, I may take a wire brush to *non-working* surfaces - definitely not to the ways or such, but as an example, I wire-brushed the top of the shaper (the part that is rusty in the pictures above) before repainting.

I should say that my goal is generally only to clean up to good working condition, rather than to achieve cosmetic results. I did paint the shaper because it had been stored outside for a time, and was in need of protection, but I confess I did not paint it to its original colors - it came out more of a silver grey than a typical SB grey. Okay by me, as my goal is to use it (and I do, quite a lot, in spite of having both a Bridgeport and a small mill-drill). For the same reason, most machine tools I simply clean up down to the last coat of paint and put them into service.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2020, 04:42:00 PM by awake »
Andy

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2020, 04:07:22 PM »
Hi Andy

What appears to be rust it is actually the red oxide primer that South Bend used under the paint. :)

Dave

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2020, 04:14:32 PM »
Thanks guys! Last night I got about 15mins to work on something, so I chose the chip tray. I used some of the Purple Power spray (its actually orange, and is a citrus-based solvent), and a plastic bristled brush (not stainless or brass), and worked on the head-stock end of the tray. Results shown below...not too bad, I think! I'm ordering a spray bottle of Oil Eater today, and will try that out this weekend.

@awake, I think I'm going for what you describe...a good cleaning, but not a complete refinishing. I like the patina of a well-used and well-cared-for machine. I'm going to work on cleaning everything, and see what comes of it. TBH, there are a couple things I'll have to do *some* amount of refinishing, like the underside of the carriage (pic also below), but what will probably be treated with evaporust or the like, and clear-coated.

Cheers!

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #20 on: January 07, 2020, 06:59:35 PM »
What do you y'all recommend for lubricating the various parts/assemblies as I reassemble the machine? Is there a particular way oil that I should source for an older machine?

Online cnr6400

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #21 on: January 07, 2020, 07:13:19 PM »
I have always used ISO 32 hydraulic jack oil on my old South Bend lathe. Everything still operates perfectly, no corrosion anywhere, more than 30 years on. Probably work well for your Logan, and it's widely available. At least locally to me it is not expensive, I paid about $7 a litre for it here in Ontario Canada recently. I got the idea to use it from Shell Oil's lubrication hotline. Shortly after I got the lathe (pre internet) I was confused about what oil to use, as the SB data plates mentioned 100 Saybolt seconds viscosity oil. I had no cross ref for this old style viscosity reference so I called the hotline, they checked, and told me the hyd jack oil was closest modern equivalent. (modern 30 yr ago that is)  :) Good luck with the Logan, they are a nice machine.

Offline awake

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #22 on: January 07, 2020, 08:12:08 PM »
Hi Andy

What appears to be rust it is actually the red oxide primer that South Bend used under the paint. :)

Dave

Ah, then it is ready for some paint! :) In the case of my SB shaper, it was most definitely rust - as I said, the machine sat outside for a time, in an area covered by a roof but no walls. Fortunately the rust was not too severe, and for the most part residual oil protected most of the working surfaces.
Andy

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2020, 12:42:08 AM »
Hi Justin

For lube I would use Mobil Vactra #2 for anything that slides, also any plain bearings (bushings) like on the cross feed screw etc. I also use Vactra on the cross feed and compound screws of my lathe.
I modified the screws that hold the nuts into the casting so I can lube them from the top using a pressure oil can.
For open gears, probably a good quality #2 lithium grease.
Depending on what the manual says, probably a light hydraulic oil as CNR6400 has indicated above for the spindle bearings. Mobil DTE 24 is a high quality ISO 32 oil, if that is what is required.

Just my thoughts,
Dave

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2020, 09:41:21 PM »
Just a quick update....

I ordered a manual, new belts, rubber bushings for the drive cover, a new countershaft (the old one had heavy scoring and needed replacement), and new felt wipers for the carriage. When I took apart the tailstock to inspect and clean, I discovered that a previous owner (not the gentleman who sold to me) had not replaced or lost the Woodruff Key that mates the tailstock handwheel, bearing, and tailstock screw...so I'm off to the local O'Reilly's to pick up a new one.

The manual calls for graphite grease for all the gears, do y'all have a recommended brand? Of course the manual's recommendation is generic "graphite grease". I am coming to understand (largely still a guess) that Logan's don't require the multitude of specific lubricants that South Bend's do...just a good way oil, graphite grease for the gears, and a generic machine oil for the little oil cups.

Thanks all for the help, I really appreciate it!!

-Justin

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2020, 01:16:49 AM »
Additional update: I took apart the tailstock, only to find that the handwheel was held on with a set-screw, and not using a Woodruff key, as is shown in the manual. I sent pics to Logan Actuator, and they confirmed that the handwheel is definitely not stock. They have both the handwheel and handle in stock, so I've ordered those, and will be cleaning up the tailstock screw to accept a key.

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2020, 01:25:16 AM »
Pics of the tailstock with the handwheel removed. The original handwheel did not have an additional sleeve, and has a keyway machined in the bore.

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2020, 01:45:03 AM »
Kind of makes you wonder what happened to the original one?


Dave

Offline awake

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2020, 09:47:32 PM »
Ouch - I hate to see it when someone has used a set screw, and in the process has messed up the keyway. Fortunately, looks like you will be able to clean it up without too much work.
Andy

Offline jmcyclist

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Re: Atlas, Logan, Bolton, or....?
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2020, 05:42:48 PM »
Andy, Dave,

Exactly. I didn't take a good pic of it, but the set screw hole also looks to have been rather amateurishly drilled...its WAY off center, and whomever did it definitely did NOT use a mill to establish a flat surface to drill through. Logan Actuator has been great answering my questions, and adjusting invoices for me to avoid shipping multiple shipments as I discover things. I'm just glad I have the proper handwheel on the way, and it looks like I'll be able to get it back to stock.

One interesting thing, that I'm not sure how much it matters, but I can't seem to figure out how to separate the tailstock screw from the quill. The manual shows a rubber washer on the end of the screw where it attaches to the back of the quill...but I don't want to damage either the screw or quill trying to unscrew them from each other. They both appear to be in decent/good shape (other than that scarring where the setscrew contacted the tailstock screw)...and I can remove the whole assembly from the tailstock easy enough. Just can't quite figure out in my head how to get them apart. Any thoughts here would be most appreciated, but I don't think its critical.

Cheers!