Author Topic: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss  (Read 4069 times)

Offline Craig DeShong

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Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« on: September 03, 2018, 04:03:37 PM »
I bought this casting set some years ago at Cabin Fever.  I didnít start building it right away and that winter a friend of mine, Gordon Miner, was looking for a project.  He mentioned to me that he was thinking about building this engine, but was bemoaning pay the shipping.  Since I had the kit and wasnít planning on building it in the immediate future I offered it to him.  He built the engine and did a magnificent job; it runs like a sewing machine.  If mine runs as well, Iíll be elated.

Some years passed, and last winter, while at Cabin Fever, I bought the kit AGAIN.  It cost me an additional $10 since the price had gone up (reminder- I need to pump Gordon for the extra $10 :LittleDevil:).

With the Root and Vandervroot finished; I thought it might be fun to get started on this project and see how well along I can take it before the winter sets in.  I canít stand being idle.

This ďkitĒ is prints and castings, offered by Bob Herder of Califon, NJ.  USA.  It models a 1905 Myers ďhit and missĒ engine with side shaft and ignitor.  It builds a beautiful model; and if youíve been to a modeling expo here in the States, youíve undoubtedly seen one.  The full size engine weighed 850 LBS and was a 2 HP engine.  The drawings do not identify the scale of this model but for general size, the flywheels finish to 8 Ĺ in. diameter.

You may remember me stating that I keep my models in my Daughterís vacated room, now that sheís married and moved away on her own.  You may also remember me stating that she left her childhood stuffed animal collection behind.
Therefore, facing this before, it was no surprise that when I entered her room to retrieve the castings was presented with this:



Again, Sirus has been busy with his communications ďacross the pondĒ. :noidea:  Fortunately, I was informed that the current ďcasting fondlingĒ was merely being performed to keep them ďsafeĒ. :ThumbsUp:  (With a little ďspecial coatingĒ appearing on a few of the cast iron pieces Iím not sure how much ďfondlingĒ has been going on :lolb:), but I was happy to be allowed to retrieve them.

Before I start cutting metal, I thought Iíd give you a good view of what is delivered.  With the ďkitĒ you are supplied these castings plus eleven hand drawn prints and several pages of photos of the more intricate parts and assemblies.  I canít see me having problems envisioning how all this goes together because if I do, I just need to drive across town and visit Gordon to inspect his completed model. :ThumbsUp:



First however, a thorough study of the drawings is in order. :happyreader: 
Craig

Offline Jo

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2018, 04:25:45 PM »
Nice set of castings  :)

Do you have any pictures of the finished engine so we know what it will look like?

Again, Sirus has been busy with his communications ďacross the pondĒ. :noidea:  Fortunately, I was informed that the current ďcasting fondlingĒ was merely being performed to keep them ďsafeĒ. :ThumbsUp:  (With a little ďspecial coatingĒ appearing on a few of the cast iron pieces Iím not sure how much ďfondlingĒ has been going on :lolb:), but I was happy to be allowed to retrieve them.

...Ö

First however, a thorough study of the drawings is in order. :happyreader:

You need to do your own casting fondling Craig, complete with the drawings and measuring devices don't let anyone else claim they have done it for you :hellno:


I am aware Surus is busy trying to make friends across the pond as he has tracked down sets of castings for a Wall C-601 4 Cylinder Side Valve and a Wall C-605 30cc single Cylinder engines without drawings: Now he is pestering everyone trying to find the required set of drawings :facepalm:, once he has found them he will expect me to go and acquire the castings for him  ::)

Jo

P.S. Is this the one?

« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 04:30:27 PM by Jo »
Usus est optimum magister

Offline Craig DeShong

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2018, 05:00:22 PM »
Jo.  Yep, that's the model.  And...  I ALSO do my fair share of 'casting fondling"  :)
Craig

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2018, 06:46:53 PM »
Craig, I have seen one of these and it's a very interesting engine. I especially like the side cam mechanism for the igniter. Looking forward to this one.

Bill

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2018, 04:34:42 PM »
Hi Craig
Nice engine, and its good to see you off onto a new project, I'm looking forward to watching this one take shape.

Dave

Offline Craig DeShong

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #5 on: September 05, 2018, 12:11:22 AM »
I started on the base today.  Iíve looked over these castings and I must say that the quality in them is some of the best Iíve had to work with.  If youíve worked with castings for a while you know that sometimes you really have to work to get the intended part from what youíre given.  These castings are not only well cast, but there is ample material provided so that all machined surfaces can be readily attained.

Drawing 1 describes the operations to be performed on the base, might as well start there. 

As you well know, the first step is to get the bottom of the base smooth and even so that the casting will sit flat on the mill table without rocking around.  My method is to shim some good anchor points until it doesnít rock;  then a test indicator will, more or less, show that the bottom is sitting parallel to the mill table.  Then I just run around the surface with an end mill to mill the bottom of the base flat.



While I have the base square and upside-down, I might as well go ahead and drill the mounting lugholes.
 
I always mount these bases on a squared plate.  Iíll be mounting this engine base on angle plates to drill the various holes required and placing the base on a squared plate is a good way to assure that my set-ups will be square and repeatable in the various orientations Iíll require.



Measuring up from the mounting plate the required distance, the crankshaft journal supports are machined.



Then I can bring that measurement forward and mill down the cylinder mounts
 


While I have this measurement set-up, I might as well drill and tap the crankshaft cap journal mounts as well as the cylinder mounts.


With the 80 LB. (pant, pant :'() vice back on the mill Iíve started work on the crankshaft journal caps.  I need to finish these and attach them to the base before I can bore the hole through the journals for the crankshaft.


Iím drilling the cap mount holes.  Iím doing this with the same setup as the milling operation so the holes are square to the milled surfaces.


A good place to stop for today.

Craig

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2018, 12:18:08 AM »
 :popcorn:

I've always enjoyed 'hit and miss' engines. I'm looking forward to this one.
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
"To work. To work."
Zee-Another Thread Trasher.

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #7 on: September 05, 2018, 12:22:38 AM »
Off to a great start Craig. You got a lot done!! Nice to hear the castings are of good quality too. That helps a lot!!

Bill

Offline propforward

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2018, 03:37:57 AM »
Fantastic - what a great and detailed build log. Lots to learn and enjoy here - I will be following along.
Stuart

Offline Jo

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2018, 07:16:39 AM »
Off to a good start  :)

With the 80 LB. (pant, pant :'() vice back on the mill Iíve started work on the crankshaft journal caps.

Did you see my "roller skate"? I Picked up a Motorcycle hydraulic scissor lift table with wheels and have been using that to move my very heavy tooling on and off the mill table e.g. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302827723682. They don't seem to be as available as they were a couple of years ago  :noidea:

Jo
Usus est optimum magister

Offline Craig DeShong

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2018, 10:35:50 PM »
Bill, Dave, Zee, Stuart, Jo; thanks for your comments.  Thanks to others that are silently following along.

Jo- I HAVE a hydraulic table :); Iím just to dang stubborn to dig it out and use it :-[.  To date itís not that tough lugging the vice, turn tables, diving heads, etc. around yet butÖ the time is coming when Iíll succumb and dig the hydraulic table out.  Till the Iíll just whine like a three year old while I carry them :lolb:.   

I spent the afternoon in the shop, making black talcum powder :Jester: (while working on this engine).


Here Iím milling the crankshaft journal pockets for the correct crankshaft width and journal width.



Iíve mounted the base on an angle plate and have made the first pass at drilling the crankshaft journals.  Iím merely trying to remove material at this point.  Iíll use a boring bar to get the crankshaft journals ďtrueĒ.



I didnít want to drill these holes too large, lest the drill wander and my boring bar not be able to form true holes.  Here Iím using a thin boring bar; a bit of bending taking place but once again Iím just trying to remove stock.  In the next picture Iíll be sizing the holes to the correct diameter.



With the journal holes at a diameter my long, rigid boring bar can clear, Iím making a final pass.  This should assure me that these two holes are of the correct size and alignment so that the crankshaft should fit nicely with no binding.



Since I have a ĺ inch ream I bored the holes just a few thou. undersize and now Iím using my reamer to establish the correct diameter.  If I didnít have the ream I would have bored them to size but the ream makes it easier to hit the target size of .750 inch.



I usually make split bearings at this point.  The ďkitĒ however came with these oilite bearings; might as well use them.  With the crankshaft journals the correct diameter Iím pinning the oilite bearings to the journal pockets.



Now with the journal caps in place Iíve drilled the oil holes so the crankshaft journal bearings can receive lubrication.

A good place to stop for today.
Craig

Offline Steamer5

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2018, 10:51:30 PM »
Hi Craig,
 Great build log & good progress. Like the setups & the explanation of the whys & hows


Cheers Kerrin
Get excited and make something!

Online crueby

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2018, 12:37:49 AM »
Very impressive work, great build!
 :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2018, 01:07:39 AM »
Another productive day in the shop Craig. Very nice work too.

Bill

Offline Craig DeShong

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Re: Bob Herder's Meyers side shaft hit and miss
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2018, 10:36:31 PM »
Kerrin, Chris, Bill; thanks for your comments.  Thanks also for those silently following alongÖ

Iíll need to set the engine base aside for a while.  I need a long reach drill bit to drill the forward boss on the base for acceptance of the side shaft.  While Iím awaiting delivery, Iíll start on the cylinder.

After studying the drawing for a while I decided to start by milling the mounting flanges.  These need located and milled so that the cylinder bore will be aligned with the center of the crankshaft.


While I have this casting located and mounted in the vice Iím going to plane the sides of these mounts.  This will allow me to accurately re-locate the centerline of the cylinder.


Drilling the cylinder mounting holes.


Iím not really excited about this breakout on the cylinder casting :o.  Iím hoping I have enough material to mill away this break because itís at the rear of the cylinder at a very obvious place.


A little fitting is required for the cylinder casting to fit into the frame receiver.


Here Iím removing the superfluous material so the cylinder casting will set into the base casting.


Here Iím setting up for boring the cylinder.  My boring bar is JUST long enough to do this with one continuous bore. :)

Iím getting a bit of chatter and movement as the boring progresses.  By running the mill in back-gears at a speed of around 60 RPM the chatter has disappeared.  Lighter cuts (under .025 inch) pretty much eliminate the movement.  Fortunately my mill has power down feed, so itís a matter of setting up the cut and walking away for around Ĺ hour till the pass is complete.  It's going to take hours to achieve the 1.5 inch diameter bore, but with the setup I'm using, I'm assured of the bore being aligned with the crankshaft. 
 
Craig