Author Topic: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel  (Read 287355 times)

Offline Steamer5

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #165 on: November 17, 2017, 08:32:41 PM »
Hi Chris,
 Looks like you had a fun day at the ďShovelĒ. Sounds like the guys are real keen on preserving her for the future which is nice!

Luckily down this way  :popcorn: planting is in full swing, Iíve found some extra field so should just about have enuff to get thru this coming year.... :lolb:

On the CAD front, most impressed! Makes my feeble attempts at 2D look pretty average!

Like Pete said, those are inspection or hand ports to check the internals of the boiler, when they get big enuff to be able to get a man, err person, thru they are man holes, errr person holes. There  is a ring, for strengthening on the outside of the boiler shell, to compensate for the hole. The holes are as per the picture elliptical, the stud in the middle. The brace is call a strong back, well weíre i come from,  1 on the small ports & 2 on man holes. In industry the ring will usually have a hole drilled thru it at a low point, before itís attached to the boiler! This becomes a tell tale for any issues under the ring while in service.

Cheers Kerrin

Get excited and make something!

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #166 on: November 17, 2017, 09:21:21 PM »
Thanks for the info on the inspection ports! I figured it might be something like that, but have not seen them before (probably were there on some of the locos, but all the other piping and valves obscured them, on this boiler all the other brass/bronze gauges and valves were stolen years ago so the ports stand out more). On this boiler there are 6 of them on the backhead, did not see any elsewhere. These are fairly small, the plug is only about 2-1/2" across, though one near the top is another inch wider.

Do they taper out wider on the inside, so the pressure of steam presses them in place, or do they come out  completely? Seems like if they go into the boiler farther when unscrewed, it would be just asking for one to drop off inside?

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #167 on: November 17, 2017, 09:33:55 PM »
I have gone through most of the measurements relating to the parts of the shovel that I had already 3D modeled up, and made the corrections where needed (mostly minor, big ones on the travel gear holders). Still a few changes to make to the bucket teeth, then on to new parts again.

Here are some current screen grabs of the 3D model, with and without the cab walls showing. One thing I have not shown till now is the two cylinders for the main hoist, they are the ones laying down on either side of the gear train, they act on a common shaft as a two-cylinder engine. Its the largest one on the shovel, 12" bore by 16" stroke, where the slew/crowd engines are 8 by 8. The steering engine looks to be a smaller version of the slew engine, have not worked out its size yet - it is the only one that Marion's catalog does not mention since it was added later on.

Overall view:


with cab removed:


closer view:


from underneath, quite a lot packed in:


left side, can see the cluth mechanism on the hoist drum gear:


and the boom (at this size the chain around the turntable at the base of the boom pixelates and looks odd - it is a 5"x7" chain)

« Last Edit: June 06, 2018, 07:06:48 PM by crueby »

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #168 on: November 17, 2017, 09:49:53 PM »
Also - just got copies of the photos they took of the shovel from a camera drone, here is an angle you don't see very often (unless you are a seagull looking for somewhere to mess)   :Lol:
I never noticed that hatch to the roof near the back end before, from the inside it just looked like a patch panel.

Offline Steamer5

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #169 on: November 17, 2017, 09:56:12 PM »
Hi Chris,
 They are the same shape as the hole but bigger!, same curve as the boiler shell ( but not by tooo much!, probably about maybe an inch if that for this size) Hope that makes sense. They have a gasket on the side that pulls up against the inside face of the boiler, indays gone by it was asbestos,  the stud is used as a handle to get it in & out & always looks way to long....I guess trial & error has shown that if you make it too short you end up having to figure out how to retrevive it!
They usually are placed for inspection of problem areas of the boiler, as you pointed out, low down around the fire box to allow cleaning / inspection of the foundation ring, and it sounds like over the top of the fire box. Somewhere on the barrel should be a manhole, vertical boilers giving limited access to check out the tubes, locos to above the tubes. Our  x club traction, full size ,engine had this in the smoke box, I have managed to squeeze thru it, donít think I could now! The boilers were I used to work had them in the end domes
The elliptical shape allows it to go thru the smaller diameter(?),  where as a round one wouldnít fit!

When I did my steam tickets, part of the course was drafting, on paper, & we had to do the set out & drawings for manholes, canít quite remember how now but CAD should make it easy!

Cheers Kerrin
Get excited and make something!

Offline Steamer5

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #170 on: November 17, 2017, 09:59:28 PM »
Hi Chris,
The drone shoot is cool! Just need to get the tips of some shoes in it & it would look like the model to come!

Cheers Kerrin
Get excited and make something!

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #171 on: November 17, 2017, 10:14:14 PM »
Hi Chris,
 They are the same shape as the hole but bigger!, same curve as the boiler shell ( but not by tooo much!, probably about maybe an inch if that for this size) Hope that makes sense. They have a gasket on the side that pulls up against the inside face of the boiler, indays gone by it was asbestos,  the stud is used as a handle to get it in & out & always looks way to long....I guess trial & error has shown that if you make it too short you end up having to figure out how to retrevive it!
They usually are placed for inspection of problem areas of the boiler, as you pointed out, low down around the fire box to allow cleaning / inspection of the foundation ring, and it sounds like over the top of the fire box. Somewhere on the barrel should be a manhole, vertical boilers giving limited access to check out the tubes, locos to above the tubes. Our  x club traction, full size ,engine had this in the smoke box, I have managed to squeeze thru it, donít think I could now! The boilers were I used to work had them in the end domes
The elliptical shape allows it to go thru the smaller diameter(?),  where as a round one wouldnít fit!

When I did my steam tickets, part of the course was drafting, on paper, & we had to do the set out & drawings for manholes, canít quite remember how now but CAD should make it easy!

Cheers Kerrin
So when the bolt is released, the plug would be able to move INTO the boiler, but not be pulled out? These are on the flat face of the backhead, so there is no curvature to them. I'm confused about where the gassket would be, and is the plug a parallel-sided thing or tapered? 
 :headscratch:

I could not find any kind of manhole - this boiler is pretty small, and the fire tubes take up almost all the space inside. The firebox would be accessible from underneath with the grates removed. The SteamTown guys were a little surprised at how small the boiler is, its 5' diameter, and the whole thing, including the firebox and smokebox, is only 15' long. It has about 150 2" firetubes. With the small amount of water in relation to that, it probably could heat up quickly, and was probably a coal-hungry beast.

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #172 on: November 17, 2017, 10:17:31 PM »
Hi Chris,
The drone shoot is cool! Just need to get the tips of some shoes in it & it would look like the model to come!

Cheers Kerrin
How about this?!   :ROFL:

Offline 10KPete

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #173 on: November 17, 2017, 11:25:05 PM »
Chris, the clean-outs/manholes are oval so that they can be turned and tilted to remove them...

Pete
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Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #174 on: November 18, 2017, 12:09:16 AM »
Chris, the clean-outs/manholes are oval so that they can be turned and tilted to remove them...

Pete
Ah, gotcha!!

Offline Steamer5

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #175 on: November 18, 2017, 07:54:38 AM »
Hi Chris,
 Arr crap! Teach me to be in a hurry & typing! Still Pete put you right. Sorry about the curve too.....should have read your info better, no curve required on a flat side.
Pity this hadnít come up a couple of weeks back as I could have got some pictures of the club boiler when it had its annual check.
Thanks for the extra info on the boiler, itís about the same size as a traction engine so would of thought that there would of been some access to the inside.

Love the feet in the picture...thanks for that!

Cheers Kerrin
Get excited and make something!

Offline Kim

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #176 on: November 18, 2017, 08:17:07 AM »
That's a great picture Chris! :Lol:
The only thing th at gives it away is that the feet have no shadow!  :stickpoke:
Kim

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #177 on: November 18, 2017, 04:14:36 PM »
Hi Chris,
 Arr crap! Teach me to be in a hurry & typing! Still Pete put you right. Sorry about the curve too.....should have read your info better, no curve required on a flat side.
Pity this hadnít come up a couple of weeks back as I could have got some pictures of the club boiler when it had its annual check.
Thanks for the extra info on the boiler, itís about the same size as a traction engine so would of thought that there would of been some access to the inside.

Love the feet in the picture...thanks for that!

Cheers Kerrin
I did some more studying of the photos, and you are right about the shape, the plates are oval, 3-1/2" wide by approx 2-1/2" tall. Some searching online I found this video showing how to install a modern one - the one they are using is much larger, but the pricipal is the same:

For the size of the boiler - interesting that it would be that small for such large main engines (twin 12x16 cylinders on hoist, twin 8x8 on both the swing and crowd engines), but they are not all running continuously which helps the steam consumption.

 :cheers:

Online b.lindsey

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #178 on: November 18, 2017, 04:18:33 PM »
Still reading along Chris. Looks like there is a lot of gear cutting in your future on this one !!

Bill

Offline steamboatmodel

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Re: Chris's Marion 91 Steam Shovel
« Reply #179 on: November 18, 2017, 04:40:03 PM »
They didn't show what you have to do when a plate does drop down, as he said it ruins you day and maybe the one for the guy on the next shift too.
Gerald.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors--and miss. Lazarus Long