Author Topic: Finger Treadle Engine  (Read 9364 times)

Offline cfellows

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Finger Treadle Engine
« on: October 02, 2017, 03:06:52 AM »
So I've settled on my design and began construction of two finger treadle engines for my two sons.  I started out by 3D printing a frame.



 But I didn't care for the quality of the print and decided the whole thing really needed to be made out of metal.  I started out with 2" x 3" x 1/4" angle iron for the engine frame sides.





I cut the long leg off the angle iron to form the base of the frame side.  Next I milled and polished the cut edge that would be the base.  I also laid out the cut lines and used a 1/2" end mill to drill the holes that would form the radiused edges.  (Please ignore the obvious error in cutting the holes...)



I made the main bearing journals out of brass, then used my metal cutting bandsaw to cut the remaining waist away from the frame sides...





And here's a bit of a mock-up to give you an idea of the design.



The finished models will have 3", 5 curved spoke flywheels, 2 on each model.  I'll be using my CNC mill / drill to cut the flywheels from 3" diameter brass round.  Then I'll need to do some finish milling and grinding on the steel frame sides to finish them up.

More to come...

Chuck




So many projects, so little time...

Offline Robert Hornby

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2017, 03:23:40 AM »
Looking very nice Chuck, I wonder why the 3D print came out a bit rough? :headscratch:
Robert
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Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2017, 01:37:43 AM »
Thanks, Robert.  I think the outer walls of the 3D print need to be thicker so the infill shape doesn't bleed through.

Today I got the frame sides cleaned up and mounted to a base of 3/8" thick x 2" x 5.25" cold rolled steel. 



The sides were attached to base with counter-bored socket head cap screws from underneath.  I also had finished turning the outer crankshaft halves.  These were turned from 20mm 12L14 steel.  The connecting rod journal will be installed with Loctite and perhaps pins.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline Noitoen

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2017, 08:04:11 AM »
Nice work. Would't a couple of HDD salvaged bearing do a better job than brass journals? It would give a much smoother ride.

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2017, 05:14:16 PM »
Nice work. Would't a couple of HDD salvaged bearing do a better job than brass journals? It would give a much smoother ride.

Thanks.  Yeah, i made the brass journals mostly for looks.  Theyree large enough that I can bore out the inside and insert a ball bearing race.  That's probably what I'll wind up doing.
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Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2017, 09:13:15 PM »
Chuck--It's great to see you up and running with a project. Hope you are feeling well. I haven't seen you on the forums for a while.---Brian

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2017, 02:46:42 AM »
Chuck--It's great to see you up and running with a project. Hope you are feeling well. I haven't seen you on the forums for a while.---Brian

Thanks, Brian, good to be here.  I've been active in my shop, but have been working on RC cars and didn't think there was anything worth posting here.

Today I cut the 3" diameter blanks for the flywheels...



They'll require some lathe work then on to the CNC mill to cut the spokes.  Might try a time lapse video of the CNC work just for the fun of it.  I also got the main bearing journals attached today.  Had to do some rework on the steel frame and the journals to get everything square and lined up. 



Gotta say I am pleased with the results.  A 3/16" round rod of tool steel slides nicely through both journals and rotates with no drag or interference.  Now if I can just get the crankshafts assembled nice and straight...
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Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2017, 02:08:26 AM »
I got all 4 of the flywheels cut to shape.  Still need to do a bit of clean up.



They are 3" OD.  the rim is 0.375" front to back and 0.25" outside to inside.  The spoke web is about 0.125" thick.  The hub is 0.4375" diameter and about 0.54" front to back.  I have a fusion 360 drawing of this flywheel, but haven't been able to export an IGES or STEP file for some reason, I keep getting an error.  I have attached a DXF file which I was able to load into CAMBAM for creating the gcode file.

Here is a video of me cutting all the spokes on one flywheel.  All the profiling was done on the lathe.  The CNC was only used to do the spoke cut-outs.  Ignore the 23 minute video length.  For some reason during editing, I managed to get two copies of the video back to back.  The flywheel only took 11 minutes, 48 seconds to cut all 5 spoke cut-outs.  If you watch to the end of the video, you'll see that the MACH3 software somehow got the Z reference screwed up and did the full 1/8" deep cut-out in one pass.  I'm surprised the 1/8", 2 flute, solid carbide end mill survived, but it didn't seem to struggle or deflect at all.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3gQBgQyru8" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3gQBgQyru8</a>

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline crueby

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2017, 10:36:50 PM »
That flywheel is just beautiful! You have the spoke proportions on the nose.


 :popcorn:

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2017, 12:42:46 AM »
Chuck, those turned out amazing!!  What you do with angle iron on this build and others is impressive as well.

Bill

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2017, 05:49:06 AM »
Thanks, guys, for the kind words.  I had to modify two of the flywheels.  I realized when I started putting things together that curved spoke flywheels with one side of the hub longer than other have a left and right hand model.  Well, I made all right hand models.  So I had to shave off the hub on one side of two of the flywheels, then bore out the center hole and solder in new hubs on the other side.  Turned out OK.

Here's a pic with the modified flywheels, partially assembled...



Gotta finish up the crankshafts and get started on the connecting rods and treadles.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2017, 11:11:36 PM »
I've decided to make the crankshafts from one solid piece.  Not the easiest thing in the world, but the method I have the most experience with...



After turning the connecting rod journal and cutting of the waste pieces, I turned a couple of pieces of 1/4" drill rod to the exact length of the gap between the webs, then super glued them into position so when I mount the crankshaft between centers to turn the two main's journals, the gap won't squeeze together.  Never tried this method before, so hopefully it will work as expected.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline crueby

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2017, 12:04:14 AM »
Neat idea, be watching to see how it works out.

Now, you should have left out the part about gluing in the spacers, and seen how many questions you got about how the heck you turned that part!!

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2017, 01:59:45 AM »
Thanks!  Here's a picture of the progress on the first crankshaft...



And here's a video of some of the turning...

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Knedhq47950" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Knedhq47950</a>

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Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2017, 04:18:29 AM »
One last picture for the day.  I thinned up the webs, turned a clearance shoulder on each side, and ran the edges over the belt sander to polish them up.



Still need to turn the mains journals down to final size.
So many projects, so little time...

Offline scc

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2017, 06:52:01 PM »
Nice work Chuck :ThumbsUp:  I am enjoying your build :popcorn:             Regards         Terry

Offline rarach22

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2017, 08:25:22 PM »
 :ThumbsUp:

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2017, 11:34:42 PM »
Good looking cranks Chuck. Nice finish on them too!

Bill

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2017, 11:38:44 PM »
Thanks for the comments, guys.

Today I started on the connecting rods.   I've never used this technique before but wanted something a bit decorative and unconventional.  For the big end, I started with a 1" x 0.25" piece of brass about 7" long and chucked it in my 4-Jaw, carefully getting it centered.



Next I drilled and tapped an 8-32 hole 3/8" deep in the end.



Then I turned the rod down to 9/16" wide x 0.25" thick for a length of 7/8".  Then I reversed the rod in the chuck and did the same operations on the other end.  This resulted in two partially formed connecting rod big ends, one on each end of the rod.



Then it was off to the mill to cut a concave form on both sides of each rod end.  This was followed by cutting two, 4" lengths of 3/16" drill rod.  I chucked these in the lathe, turned down a 5/16" length of the end to .156" and threaded it 8-32.  Here you can begin to see what the finished rods will look like...



Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline 10KPete

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2017, 02:23:37 AM »
Nice!! I've never done that either. I like it!!

Pete
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Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2017, 05:44:17 PM »
Kind of vacillating on the connecting rod.  I made a couple of more traditional rods yesterday out of bronze.  I designed them in Microsoft Visio then used my CNC mill to cut them out.







But I'm still kind of liking the other design so I think I'll finish them up as well then decide which I like better.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline Art K

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2017, 10:06:05 PM »
Chuck,
You could stay on the fence and build one of each. :ROFL:
Art
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Offline Ian S C

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2017, 08:58:29 AM »
Not such a bad idea to have just a little difference.
Ian S C

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #23 on: October 25, 2017, 08:05:53 PM »
Chuck,
You could stay on the fence and build one of each. :ROFL:
Art

You laugh!  That's exactly what I did.  And I'll send both sets of rods to the boys so they can switch them out at will.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #24 on: October 25, 2017, 08:09:09 PM »
So, I spent the day yesterday prototyping a treadle out of aluminum.





Today I'll start whittling the real deal out of solid brass.  The order of operations is obviously going to require some planning.



The brass blanks are 1.5" x 1.25" x 0.75".

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2017, 08:56:30 PM »
The boys are going to love these Chuck. Who wouldn't?? Very nicely done and the brass treadles will only add to it.

Bill

Offline crueby

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2017, 09:35:51 PM »
I assume there is enough room for a finger on both top and bottom of the treadle, so it could be a 'double acting' engine!

 :Lol:

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #27 on: October 26, 2017, 01:28:14 AM »
Pardon me a a little sidetrack...

I've been watching your thread Chuck...which 'inspired' me...
I CAD'd up little finger treadle engine and printed it out using my 3D printer.
The idea was to show my grand-daughter something. (i.e. Grand-pa is a cool dude.)

It works like crud...but grand-daughter found it fascinating...even though I told her it doesn't work very well.
The next time she visited... she bee-lined to play with it. Then she told me she got it to work.
It didn't really work...but she wanted to prove me wrong. And that's a trait I admire.

Hence...a huge success. Grand-pa is a cool dude.  ;D
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
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Offline Noitoen

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #28 on: October 26, 2017, 10:25:47 AM »
If the flywheels were mounted on some freewheel bearings, they would keep on running after the treadle stopped ;)

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2017, 01:08:17 AM »
Thanks for the comments guys.  These are turning out to be some of the best work I've done, albeit, not the most complicated.

Today I continued work on the "production" treadles.  I started with 1.25" x 1.50" x 0.75" brass blocks which I cut out yesterday.  Today, I used CAD and CNC to design and cut out the center profiles.



The waste part, marked in black, will be retained for a while to aid in fixturing for layout and holding for milling.  I'll have to decide later at what point the waste can go.

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline ShopShoe

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #30 on: October 27, 2017, 01:33:03 PM »
Note to Self:

1. Build slightly larger version of Chuck's Treadle Engine with Belt Pulley for grandkid to play with.

2. Build Brian Rupnow's slinky machine to run off treadle engine.

3. Fight off adults who hog all the time playing with it.

Thanks Chuck,

ShopShoe

Offline cfellows

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2017, 11:29:15 PM »
One done, second one nearly done. 



Just need to add some set screws and shafts to the second one and they'll both be done.  Well, almost, I'll probably still want to make wooden bases for them...

Chuck
So many projects, so little time...

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2017, 12:19:53 AM »
Nicely done Chuck!


Dave

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2017, 12:26:32 AM »
Beautiful Chuck. I know they will be treasured too. Hope you have been playing with them some too  :D

Bill

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2017, 12:42:47 AM »
Looks great Chuck. You do nice work.---Brian

Offline Art K

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Re: Finger Treadle Engine
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2017, 03:20:45 AM »
Chuck,
That looks great. Looks fun as well. :ROFL:
Art
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