Author Topic: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)  (Read 139733 times)

Online Kim

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1170 on: September 16, 2018, 05:32:26 AM »
A bit faster then vinegar is citric acid a lot safer then muriatic or sulfuric. I switched over to Citric when my family was younger.
Interesting.  I've hears of using citric acid before.  Does it work on Steel as well as brass?

For the pickle, I too like the sparex2 for brass and copper. Its not good on steel, for that a cheap alternative is the muriatic acid from the home center, or even white vinegar.
I've got a bunch of steel soldering in my future and I hadn't realized that Sparex wasn't good for that.  What's the issue with using Sparex on steel?

Thanks,
Kim

Online Kim

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1171 on: September 16, 2018, 05:33:37 AM »
Thanks Dave, Bill, Chris, and Gerald, for the comments! :)
Kim

Offline MJM460

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1172 on: September 16, 2018, 06:21:47 AM »
Really loving this build.  You are doing a great job of both the build and the documentation.

Muriatic acid is a is is another name for hydrochloride acid.  Hardware shops have it for cleaning bricks for example.  Usually comes pretty strong, and needs full acid handling precautions.  I use it diluted by about one part in ten parts water (careful doing the acid to water) then keep using it until it becomes too slow.

Sparex is sodium bisulphate based crystals which dissolve in water, the chemistry of that one is too far away from hydrocarbons for me, but it seems that it gives a quite strong acid, a bit stronger than citric acid, so I would still handle with care.  Probably a better choice if you can obtain it, but I have no experience using it.

I tried some citric acid, but was disappointed.  Perhaps I mixed it to weak, but it took forever to make any impression.  Perhaps it's my soldering technique, as others seem to recommend it.

I have only soldered brass, copper and bronze so far, so I don't know what's best on steel.  That adventure is still ahead of me.

It is worth searching for the material safety data sheets for good information on handling any chemicals you are not familiar with.  They tend to be a bit legalistic, but buried in amongst the lawyer speak, they really do contain good useful information.  Eye protection, chemical standard rubber gloves etc.  And if you do spill some, immediately wash it away with plenty of water from a running tap or hose.  Keep washing for about ten minutes or longer if it gets on your skin.  Surprisingly effective for all sorts of acid or alkali burns.  But better not to spill it.

MJM460
The more I learn, the more I find that I still have to learn!

Offline crueby

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1173 on: September 16, 2018, 12:57:17 PM »
A bit faster then vinegar is citric acid a lot safer then muriatic or sulfuric. I switched over to Citric when my family was younger.
Interesting.  I've hears of using citric acid before.  Does it work on Steel as well as brass?

For the pickle, I too like the sparex2 for brass and copper. Its not good on steel, for that a cheap alternative is the muriatic acid from the home center, or even white vinegar.
I've got a bunch of steel soldering in my future and I hadn't realized that Sparex wasn't good for that.  What's the issue with using Sparex on steel?

Thanks,
Kim
Sparex has two versions, one for brass/etc, one I think will work on steel. The brass one they don't recommend for steel, tends to plate coppery color onto it, and the steel dilutes it quickly somehow.

Offline Dave Otto

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1174 on: September 16, 2018, 05:04:35 PM »
Be careful using Muriatic or HCL acid indoors, the vapors will rust every piece of bare steel or cast iron in the vicinity. I keep a small bottle of brick cleaner on hand for small jobs; it is stored and used outside.

Dave

Online Kim

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1175 on: September 16, 2018, 06:10:59 PM »
Thanks for all the excellent information MJM, Chris, and Dave.  I really appreciate it.  I do try and be as safe as possible with the machines, flames, fluxes, metals and all he hazards of our chosen hobby, including paints and chemicals.  I went with the Sparex because i read it was much safer than other options.  HCL is scary stuff, not sure I want to mess around with that too much.  I'll do some more research.

If I can use something less caustic in exchange for a little time, that might be a good trade off for me.

Kim

Offline crueby

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1176 on: September 16, 2018, 06:11:52 PM »
Thanks for all the excellent information MJM, Chris, and Dave.  I really appreciate it.  I do try and be as safe as possible with the machines, flames, fluxes, metals and all he hazards of our chosen hobby, including paints and chemicals.  I went with the Sparex because i read it was much safer than other options.  HCL is scary stuff, not sure I want to mess around with that too much.  I'll do some more research.

If I can use something less caustic in exchange for a little time, that might be a good trade off for me.

Kim
:ThumbsUp:

Offline steamboatmodel

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1177 on: September 16, 2018, 07:50:29 PM »
Sparex is good I went with Citric Acid because 30 years back I was starting a family and it seamed the safest, plus I could get it very cheep. I do have and use Sparex now too.
Gerald.
Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors--and miss. Lazarus Long

Offline 10KPete

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1178 on: September 16, 2018, 09:11:39 PM »
Well, Sparex sounds like something I should try.

OK.... I can find the #2, for copper, etc. all over the place but I cannot find any #1 for iron/steel...

Any hints where to find it?'

Thanks,
Pete
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SB 10K lathe, Benchmaster mill. And stuff.

Offline crueby

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Re: Steam Tractor 3/4" (Rudy K)
« Reply #1179 on: September 16, 2018, 09:42:03 PM »
Well, Sparex sounds like something I should try.

OK.... I can find the #2, for copper, etc. all over the place but I cannot find any #1 for iron/steel...

Any hints where to find it?'

Thanks,
Pete
Hardly anyone seems to carry the nbr 1, even the places the maker (krohn) lists. This is the only place I know of


http://www.metalliferous.com/mobile/Sparex_Pickel/products/847/

I have used nbr 2 a lot, never tried the sparex 1.