Author Topic: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine  (Read 295418 times)

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #480 on: December 22, 2016, 06:38:49 PM »
I was watching some of the videos on the Maine logging museum website, great stuff,  here are a couple that are particularly interesting:

Lombard hauling logs in the winter:

The museums hauler, first snow run after restoration:

Their run from this past November:

and their full page of videos:
http://www.maineforestandloggingmuseum.org/lombard-steam-log-hauler-38-runs

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #481 on: December 22, 2016, 06:49:56 PM »
After flattening the cut edges on the stirrups with the mill (no pics, all you could see was the outer edge above the vise anyway), on to the crossbars. A set of four were cut to length, and then two of them were rabbetted at the ends so that they would form a half-lap joint. This is needed so that the bars will clear the axle clamps.

and then holes were drilled for the mounting bolts at both ends of the crossbars

and matching holes in the tops of the stirrups. It was important that the holes in two of them were mirrored, so that the holes match with both ends of the crossbars.

Last hole was for a mounting bolt in the bottom of the stirrup, that will hold the spring retainer cone later, I need to find (or make) a set of springs first, to know the size of the cone.

Got the first set tapped and bolted together...

and a couple shots of how it fits onto the axle bracket. It rests on the top flat of the axle box, and the springs in the stirrups will press against the bottom of the frame rails.


I think getting the springs and the cones sorted out will be the final pieces of the suspension. A little paint, then on to the roller chains.
One thing I have coming in the mail is some gun blueing chemicals, I want to experiment with that, as a possible alternative to painting everything. I'll post some pics of how that works out next week...
« Last Edit: May 31, 2018, 09:00:58 PM by crueby »

Offline GailinNM

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #482 on: December 23, 2016, 09:10:05 AM »
It's all your fault Chris.

 This great thread inspired me to start building a long desired IC powered crawler tractor.  I borrowed a few of your elves, bribed them with milk and chocolate chip cookies, and turned them loose on the CAD system.  Must have fed them too many cookies.  They got fat and lazy and took a long winters nap.  So, I had to start the design myself with only the shop dog for assistance.

Thanks for the boot in the back side with this great tread.

Tractor Thread starts at:
http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?topic=6737.new#new

Gail in NM
I would like to be the kind of person my dog thinks I am.

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #483 on: December 23, 2016, 03:37:54 PM »
It's all your fault Chris.

 This great thread inspired me to start building a long desired IC powered crawler tractor.  I borrowed a few of your elves, bribed them with milk and chocolate chip cookies, and turned them loose on the CAD system.  Must have fed them too many cookies.  They got fat and lazy and took a long winters nap.  So, I had to start the design myself with only the shop dog for assistance.

Thanks for the boot in the back side with this great tread.

Tractor Thread starts at:
http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?topic=6737.new#new

Gail in NM
Blame gleefully accepted!! (Snicker)

After doing a number of static engines, it seemed time for one that could move itself around, and the crawler style is something not done that often.

And just like Gremlins, you have to be careful how much/when you feed the shop elves!

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #484 on: December 23, 2016, 04:58:49 PM »
I've been playing around with the shapes for the roller chain that supports the bottom of the tracks, and have gotten it modelled up in 3D

The way I am thinking at the moment, the rollers will be a seperate piece than the pins, since the pins will be rivetted over at the ends and won't spin well. The pins narrow down after they go through the roller and the first track rail, so that when I rivet the end the outer track rail will go up against the shoulder.

At least that is the current plan, we'll see how that holds up to the first test parts! All will be steel, with the side rails bent to shape from 1/16" x 1/8" stock, then drilled, then cut off the longer bar.

In order to do the bending, I've been playing with shapes for a bending jig:

This one will let me form both sides in one go, so that the distance in the center will always be the same - that is the critical length. The form blocks on top will be bolted on, so I can change/modify them as needed. I will probably also need some sort of locating/holding jig for the drilling operation, to repeatably position in the mill vise without much fiddling.

The shaping on the pins should be doable with a parting tool in the lathe, so I don't think I need any fixtures for that. Yet. I think...

« Last Edit: May 31, 2018, 09:01:14 PM by crueby »

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #485 on: December 23, 2016, 09:52:47 PM »
And got a start on the bending jig for the chain side rails. Started by milling the recesses in the end of a couple blocks of steel bar

and then positioned them for drilling for the bolts to hold them all together. Took a little fiddling to get things to line up, but not bad:

Here it is ready for its first test bend - the handles are back, and some thin flat stock slipped into place (marked where that one was, figure it will take a couple tries to find out how far through to have it project)

and both handles pulled in tight (well, pic shows one back a little, ran out of hands to hold it and take the picture)

and the shape on the test bar:

It is pretty close, may need to grind a little off one side of the form blocks to adjust the over travel since the amount of spring back I allowed for was a guess. It looks like the blocks are not being held quite solidly enough, there is a little slop in the bolt holes. I might get it lined up again and run in some drive fit pins, was tempted to silver solder them down, but I don't want to make it THAT permenant if I dont have to. Some dowel or taper pins should do the trick.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2018, 09:01:21 PM by crueby »

Online 10KPete

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #486 on: December 24, 2016, 02:24:25 AM »
Now, just add a shear and hydraulic actuator then come back in the morning and they'll all be bent, cut and ready!!

 :noidea:

Pete
Craftsman, Tinkerer, Curious Person.
Retired, finally!
SB 10K lathe, Benchmaster mill. And stuff.

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #487 on: December 24, 2016, 02:57:21 AM »
Now, just add a shear and hydraulic actuator then come back in the morning and they'll all be bent, cut and ready!!

 :noidea:

Pete
Sounds like a Mythbusters build! Shears, hydraulic pump, C4, blast shields...


Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #488 on: December 24, 2016, 05:33:38 PM »
Nice jig Chris! That's a lot of parts to make for sure, but that should make them consistent. Gonna need some more popcorn or recipes while following along  :)

Bill

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #489 on: December 24, 2016, 11:57:24 PM »
Thanks Bill! No new work on it today other than throwing some loctite in under the form blocks, still want to run a set of pins.

That will be after Christmas, lots of family and friends stuff for a few days, also got a couple of bottles of a fantastic Belgian Triple abbey style ale from a friend with a microbrewery to test out, awesome taste, sneaky strong kick to it too (around a 12% alcohol content!). Goes great with dark chocolate, but puts shop off limits!

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #490 on: December 25, 2016, 12:40:43 AM »
Enjoy Chris, probably best to keep it away from the shop elves though, a few sips and they would be snookered  :lolb:

Bill

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #491 on: December 25, 2016, 02:45:48 AM »
After a suitably safe desnookering time I sent one of the shop elves back to drill/ream/install a taper pin near the business end of each form block, and the sideways movement went away, the rail bending jig is ready for action next week! The bending action generates a lot more twisting force than I had expected. Leverage works!

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #492 on: December 25, 2016, 09:34:33 PM »
The gun cold blueing chemicals I had on order arrived yesterday, and got a quick test. On Brownell's website they have some great tutorial videos on how to use a lot of the gunsmithing products they sell, and the one on blueing mentioned that since there are SO many different alloys of steel and stainless steel, that it is hard to predict which one will work best on any given alloy without testing. They showed several different products that have cold application solutions, which do not require heating the metal, hot tanks, etc, which is much more attractive for doing numerous small parts in a home shop. I picked three of them as well as a can of thier TCE degreaser spray, which does not leave any of its own residue behind.

So, on to the test. I grabbed an offcut piece of 303 stainless off the bench, and gave it a spray of the degreaser, then wiped that off with a clean paper towel. No other sanding, buffing, steel wooling, etc, since I wanted to know how it would behave on parts that have areas that I cannot get sanded clean, which is more typical of the parts on this model. So a quick degrease, then applied a couple drops of each solution on a section of the metal, let sit for a minute, then rinsed off. They recommend using another spray of the degreaser to nutralize the chemicals and stop the reaction. Here is a photo of the results, with the product used behind each test patch:

and a close up:

On this metal, it is a clear winner with the Birchwood Super Blue - a nice solid dark black finish. All three appear to be a durable color, at least to handling and fingernail scraping. On a different alloy, one of the others could well do better. I have used simaler brass and aluminum blackening formulations, there again the results varied with the alloy.

Given these results, I may well use this for a finish on the rest of the frame parts rather than painting, which looks very good but is not as durable to handling and use - the track and axle frames already have scrapes through the paint in places. Since this is going to be an operating model, the blueing process looks like a better way to go at the moment.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2018, 09:01:40 PM by crueby »

Offline crueby

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #493 on: December 26, 2016, 03:37:28 AM »
Well, big correction on the bluing post!

I was curious if the bluing chemicals would work for touching up the scratches in the paint on the stainless parts without messing up the surrounding paint, and was surprised to see absolutely nothing happening. Anywhere. Then dabbed some on the the test piece from earlier, nice reaction. Then pulled some fresh bar, still has the 303 stainless label on it, and found the chemicals might have well been water for all the nothing they did. Turns out the test piece I tried must have been a chunk of CRS or maybe some W1 steel. Near as I can find out, cold bluing on stainless is limited to certain alloys, 303 not being one of them.

So, the test I showed is fine for other alloys, not for stainless. Whoops!!   :facepalm:    :noidea:

Offline Johnmcc69

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Re: Chris' Build of a Lombard Hauler Engine
« Reply #494 on: December 26, 2016, 02:37:46 AM »
 :ThumbsUp:
 Thanks for posting the findings Chris. A friend of my who is a gun collector has mentioned trying some of these....I've mentioned your build  (& my excitement), about building model engines, He's getting closer.  :slap: As always, fantastic build,  :embarassed: I was going to mention to you about some of the track parts losing a little paint earlier from playing with them too much..but, how could you not? I love it all.

 I hope the shop elves treated you well for Christmas, didn't eat too many cookies, & had visions of Lombard haulers dancing in your head.

 Looking forward to the book.  :stir:

 John