Author Topic: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft  (Read 3230 times)

Offline Steam Haulage

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Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« on: November 17, 2015, 08:06:08 PM »
I have been quiet through the summer trying to make progess on my MEM Corliss, but seeing the topic on Flywheel design reminds me that I have been meaning to ask for some commentary about methods of fitting a flywheel onto its crankshaft.
Most examples seem to use keyways or grubscrews which must prove satisfactory by the number in use. However as usual I want to be different on my next engine! That's assuming i get the Corliss finished next year. (I've now retired)

I seem to remember some discussion about taper lock clamping, but cannot find it. I have been looking at (full-size) engines which seem to employ a tapered clamp  using either several bolts to tighten  or is itself threaded into the FW hub to achieve it's grip. I don't recall the exact details.

Any advice would be welcome. Even of the 'do not do it type, as long as its accompanied with some reasoning.

Jerry

Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline fumopuc

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Kind Regards
Achim

Offline Steam Haulage

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2015, 08:34:39 PM »
Hi Achim,

That looks like the thing in mind. I have to puzzle out how it might work. but at that price it might be worth buying one and seeing.

Thanks
Jerry
Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline AOG

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2015, 08:35:35 PM »
The easiest taper lock I have seen uses a tapered pipe thread. Tap the wheel with the appropriate size taper tap. Turn a bushing out of hex stock and use the the matching die to thread it. Slit it with a slitting saw. Screw the bushing into the flywheel and it will grab the shaft and hold the flywheel on.

Tony

Offline mklotz

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2015, 09:21:05 PM »
I hate to provide references to this site but most of the relevant material was written by accomplished modelers so...

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/showthread.php?t=10713
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Offline sshire

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2015, 12:42:03 AM »
Best,
Stan

Offline Steam Haulage

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2015, 07:43:18 AM »
Thanks for the contributions. it seems there are more options than I expected. Tme to get the thinking cap out.

Stan's method looks very neat, and I've never been fan of the other source, but 'needs must when the Devil drives'.

Jerry :old:
Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline pgp001

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2015, 01:06:15 PM »
On a model Corliss engine I dont think I would choose to fit a taper collet or grub screw etc, it would not be in keeping with full size practice, and to my eye would look out of place.
On my Corliss engine "Agnes" I have chosen to make it look as near to prototype as possible. There are some grub screws to lock the flat keys in place, but they are burried inside the hub where they will never be seen again (hopefully !!)





And in full size.



This method of attachment is called "Staking" by the way, the flat strips are actually wedges driven in from either side to lock the hub onto the shaft.
The yellow coloured ones are also wedges, and these are to pull the spokes into the hub.

The ones on my model are dummies, the spokes are actually pulled in using a cap head allen screw down the centre of each spoke, the thing is unless I told you, you would never know they were there and it looks like the real deal. Including fasteners there are approx 250 separate parts just in this flywheel alone.

Phil
« Last Edit: November 18, 2015, 01:10:02 PM by pgp001 »

Offline sshire

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2015, 01:44:30 PM »
Beautiful flywheel. Now I'm curious. I can't figure how there are 250 parts in the flywheel. Love to see the drawing.
Best,
Stan

Offline Steam Haulage

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2015, 02:40:01 PM »
Hi Phil,

If you look again at the full-size FWI think you will see that there are 2 sets of wedges one to hold the spokes to the hub, the other holds the hub to the shaft. Looking at the various pictures of Lancashire engines you will see a myriad of methods. When you read Stanley Challenger's 2009 book on Brown and Pickles (available on Lulu) there are more examples and commentary by people who, like my father, actually maintained and sometimes ran these machines. ( I miss him a lot for his quiet expertise)

You can see that the mounting of the flywheel has, on occasion, been a source of catastrophic failure. I don't think anyone can claim a foolproof method.

In our sizes I would not expect sufficient energy to cause bursting but when I was just starting out I visited a builder of small(ish) diesels, and was shewn, in their black museum, a flywheel off a 3 cylinder machine which had disintegrated due to a casting fault in the hub which had not been detected before painting.

All reasons behind my interest in this topic.

Jerry
Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline Steam Haulage

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2015, 02:42:31 PM »
Sorry,
 the author is Stanley Challenger Graham.
Jerry
Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline Hugh Currin

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2015, 11:32:14 PM »
Jerry:

I'm trying to use one for my Webster. The page for the flywheel starts here. A couple of posts down lists three other builds using a taper lock. I understand there are (at least) two locking tapers possible, the QD type and the "taper lock" type. I built one of each with hopes of using the QD type.

I've had some trouble with it slipping and have built one with a shallower taper. Still working on getting it to work well as in a later post. I'll fiddle a little longer and if no joy I'll re-design for a small keyway, 5/16" shaft & 1/16" square key.

Hope this is of some help.

Hugh
Hugh

Offline Steam Haulage

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2015, 10:30:31 AM »
Thank you Hugh,

Those pictures and the commentaries from you and the others make the whole thing look easy! But I'm sure that the method needs care. As always the pictures are worth a thousand words.

Makes me want to go back to the MEM Corliss and implement the same thing there.

Jerry
Dogs look up to you, cats look down on you, pigs treat you as equal.

Offline pgp001

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Re: Fixing Flywheels to Crankshaft
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2015, 01:16:31 PM »
Jerry

Thanks for the heads up on the Stanley Graham books on Lulu, I didn't know about that and have just been and bought a couple of them this morning.

I can see a good few weeks reading ahead to digest all the information contained therein.

I live in West Yorkshire in an area that was once surrounded by mills and engines, so this will be right up my street.

Phil