Author Topic: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!  (Read 9335 times)

Offline sshire

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Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« on: September 09, 2014, 04:01:16 PM »
Rider Ericsson Will Not Run

Iím counting on the collective wisdom here to figure out why the Rider wonít run.

Bill Lindsey and I have been PMing and Iíve implemented all of Billís suggestions.

Here is the status

1. No binding when hand turning the flywheel.
2. Iíve tried it with and without the pump
3. Gaskets (standard auto supply gasket sheeting) between the Hot cap and base and the cylinder and base are providing a good seal.
4. Temperature at the hot cap bottom is 450-500 F.
5. Temperature at the cylinder liner ID is around 80 F.
6. The teflon piston packing has been run in and is not leaking air. This is based on using the laser spot on the non-contact thermometer to measure temps at the pistonís top edge where it contacts the liner ID. The readings at many places are unchanged at about 80 F.
7. I have a good, close sliding fit where the displacer rod goes through the piston center. I remade this center and made it a tiny bit tight then ran Timesaver compound until the tightness disappeared.
8. The displacer piston bottom, at its low point, it within 1/32Ē from the hot cap bottom.
9. I start the burner and try starting the engine each minute. Iíve done this for up to 10 minutes and notice no difference in feel as I turn the flywheel. Yes. Iíve tried turning the flywheel in both directions.
Best,
Stan

fcheslop

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2014, 04:53:34 PM »
Hi Stan, when turning the engine over does it have any compression
Air leaks are one of the main culprits
Is the displacer OK I have had them split?
Cheers and good luck .She will be a fine runner once you find the problem

Offline sshire

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2014, 05:23:21 PM »
You must be reading my mind. I'm waiting for the hot cap to cool down to check it for leaks.
I'm also going to bubble test all gasket to base connections.
Thank you
Best,
Stan

Online Dave Otto

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2014, 08:28:57 PM »
Stan, you may be leaking air through the gaskets. When you spin your engine over is should be bouncy against compression. If it doesnít bounce back and forth, it either is too tight or has leaks or a little of both. Having seen the quality of your work I doubt that it is too tight. I would ditch the gaskets and try a high temp gasket sealer.

Dave

fcheslop

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2014, 08:35:52 PM »
Hi Stan .nope not a mind reader just simply bitter experience twiddling flywheels and swearing at it :lolb:
Good luck as Dave said she should be bouncy  :embarassed:
cheers

Online Jo

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2014, 09:08:09 PM »
 :headscratch: This sounds like another of those Stirling engines that someone was trying to convince me to try making one of. My sympathies Stan I have made a batch of these decorative engines over the last two years  :paranoia: We can all keep our fingers crossed it will work out in the end  ;)

In the meantime it sounds like I will have to make do with a Feeney joining my happy family  ;)

Jo

Usus est optimum magister

Offline sshire

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2014, 09:18:30 PM »
Everything points to an air leak.
No bouncy piston.
The likely cause, as Bill pointed out in a PM, is a resolder that I did weeks ago to the beautifully, paper thin hot cap bottom.
I'm going to pull the hot cap and do a leak test.
Stay tuned.
Best,
Stan

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2014, 10:35:21 PM »
I respectfully differ on the idea of a bouncy piston. Stirling engines don't have that much compression especially in the cool state, unlike an IC engine. Mine has very little "bounce" to it and yet still runs well.

Bill

Offline philjoe5

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2014, 10:57:03 PM »
Bill has a point too.  I tried making a Stirling engine as a first project some years ago but never did get a good runner.  I talked to just about anyone who was running them at engine shows.  Some had remarkable bounce, yet others had very little and they all seemed to run OK. 

One thing's for sure, if you have a leak it won't run.  Also, since power output is on the low side so any tight spots will prevent it from cycling. 

When my teacher in high school physics talked about a "frictionless machine" surely he was thinking about a Stirling :Lol:

Good luck Stan.  I know you'll get it.

Cheers,
Phil
If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man.  - Mark Twain

fcheslop

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2014, 11:06:28 PM »
Its difficult to describe how the engine should feel :embarassed:but she should not feel dead
Not been argumentative in anyway
cheers

Online Dave Otto

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2014, 11:29:01 PM »
Interesting Bill,

Iím just going off my personal engines; I have 5 running hot air fans, 3 originals and 2 that I have built. They all bounce; my Essex fan has so much compression that it is difficult to turn over when cold.
I suppose the linkage and weight of the flywheel could mask some of the compression

Dave

Offline sshire

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2014, 11:34:13 PM »
I pulled the hot cap and sure enough it had a small leak at the bottom. I unsoldered the bottom and made a new one. Soldered. No leaks. Reinstalled. No difference in "compression" feel. Still not a runner.
I've brushed my leak tester (half and half dishwashing liquid and water) on every joint, including the piston center. No bubbles. ?????
I'm considering removing the piston and displacer and filling it with water to see if I get a leak anywhere.
About out of ideas.
Best,
Stan

Offline Don1966

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2014, 12:25:30 AM »
Stan didn't know you were having problem buddy. Just keep flipping those rocks and you will find the problem I am confident of that. I am eager to see it running and finished................. :ThumbsUp:


 :popcorn:
Don

Online Dave Otto

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2014, 12:54:57 AM »
Hi Stan

I'm sure you have checked, but is the timing correct? Displacer leads the power piston by ~90degs. It has been a while since I have looked closely at the Rider, so I don't know if the timing is built into the linkage or if it is adjustable.

My buddy has one of these that he also built from a Myers kit and it runs great, I will ask him if he has any ideas.

Dave

Offline sshire

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Re: Rider Ericsson will not run - HELP!!!
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2014, 01:49:35 AM »
The timing is built in to the engine design. Not adjustable. Don't think you could assemble it in such a way that it would turn and have the timing off.
Keep coming up with suggestions. I'll try anything.
Best,
Stan