Finishing off a 5" Gauge Simplex Loco

[zeeprogrammer]

I'm with Pete on that one. I'd really like to see more of this build.

[NickG]

Think sometimes you need a break during big projects like this. Probably why it takes many people years and years to complete locos, you can't see the end and there are so many other things that distract in the mean time! Stew I saw Lawrence the other day ip at Bishopton and had chance to have a good chat. It's great that your skill and enthusiasm is rubbing off on younger generations, sound like him and his son are getting interested in model engineering thanks to you - nice 1.

[sbwhart]

Pete/Zee

Thanks for looking in, I promis  I'll post some more on this now that I've got a new shop camera, the problem when you start getting fed up with a project you're concentration flags and thing can sloppy with the build, a short divertion is what is needed. Before I start on the home streach.

Nick:- Lawrence and his son Dan have just been visiting spent a short time in the shop showing them a few techniques, Dan as done some magic work with 3D cad animation.

Stew

[sbwhart]

Finished of the expansion link assembly this morning.



Its the bit that puts the loco in reverse

Stew

[doubletop]

Another cracking job there Stew

BTW how did you hold the pivot pins in? I had to remake mine and used Loctite first time round. I ended up having to strip down the gear again and silver soldering them in after two of the pins fell out whilst running. Suddenly everything got a bit lumpy, a sure sign of a valve gear fault.

Pete

[sbwhart]

Pete

I just made them a tight hammer fit and pened them into a chamferd back end and cleaned them up with a file, I hope thats enough I did think about soldering them. The ones that I replaced were lose and one had been silver soldered as well as being filed into an oval.


I must admit thase little pins and screws you find dotted arround a Loco, I think are a weak point with them, where i've made new I've replaced the BA screws with metric as you can get nylock nuts for them, also you can get cap screws i know they are not in keeping but i think they cut down the chance of thing comming adrift. I have a theory that if you went round a model loco track with a metal detector you'd find enough screws to det you're selv up in buisness 

Stew

[doubletop]

When the pins fell out I got the inevitable "I wouldn't have done that, there are some loads in the valve gear" I didn't question it I made sure they weren't coming out.

I get your point on keeping fixings in place. On first assembly everything is spotlessly clean and nicely thread locked. Then you get it running on air and something needs to be modified, so it comes apart again , but now its covered in oil. Then you get it running on steam and more disassembly and reassembly as things are tweeked. It never quite goes back together the way it did the first time. That creates the opportunity for bits to fall off later. So if, like me, you're doing this as a club runabout the nylock nut idea is a good one.

Pete

[sbwhart]

Picked up the cudgel on this again, I left off, where I just needed to make the motion plate and one more link arm thingy. Before I started on the motion plate tried a lose assembly just to see how things lined up in case I needed to make a small adjustment to it, and it was clear that with my new linkage there was no way things would line up, particularly with the left hand side of the loco so did a bit of measuring and

 

The position of the valve rod on the left hand steam chest is only out by 5mm there is no way that the linkage will miss the slide bars and the right hand one is out by 2mm.



The lines indicate where it should be.

 

This explains why the linkage on the loco when I bought it were all bent and cut about in short they had been well bodged.

Decided I'd better check a few more things out ports in the cylinder ok, they took a good look at the slide valve

 



The pocket in the face of the valve should be in the centre there is no way this would work, the narrow slot should be closer to the edge by about 3mm.

I have only two options buy new casting but I'm allergic to that word buy or rework the existing ones some way. With the steam chest I can cut the crap bits off drill and tap a hole in the correct position and screw and Loctite in some new bosses  so correcting the error, with the slide valve there is no way to correct them so I've ordered some cast iron bar to make new.

So to fix the steam chest.

As nothing is square on this darn thing first thing I had to do was give myself a square face so clamped the cylinder to an angle plate fastened the steam chest to it and skimmed off its back face square, I can use this to ensure that the valves rods work parallel with the pistons.



Then using this square face clamp the steam chest onto the angle plate, line up on the scribed lines and zero the DRO



Machine the boss off and skim another face square.



Come back to the zero position and as the hole is out of position trying to drill through would cause the drill to wonder, so use a slot drill to take away the hole.



Then drill and tap 1/2"*32 ME



The surgery on the other end was not as drastic as this just had a 3/16" hole that guides the tail of the valve rod, so with this one centre on the cross lines and drill through and tap 3/8"*32 ME



Turn up and thread a couple of plugs



And screw them in good and tight with stud lock.

Remark the correct position, and set back up on the angle plate, pick up on the cross lines, drill and ream through 3/16 and drill and tap the top boss 3/8"*32 ME for the valve gland.

The front boss needs to be drilled 3/16" dead in line with the rear boss so I used a long series centre drill for this.



Need to make or buy a long series 3/16" drill to finish off, but before I got that far I got one of those Dad can you help calls from my daughter.

Stew

[doubletop]

Stew

I applaud your restraint, I'd be seriously pissed off by now. At least you know its going to be right in the end.

On the plus side there's a possibility of another article for ME for you "Buying a second hand loco". Apart from the boiler you've come across most of the things to look for.

Pete

[NickG]

Yeah I second that Stew - the good news is, I am sure it is going to run really well when finished. I think the article should be titled "never buy a 2nd hand unfinished loco" It'd have been impossible to predict / inspect for all this. Note to self: only ever buy something if it can be seen running and tried out!

Mind you, this is how I started off in the hobby, buying things that needed work or finishing off, I got fairly lucky I think. I've got Mabel to do but that seems reasonably well made - the steam roller on the other hand is another story - might end up putting that one down to experience!

Nick

[steamer]

Stew,

I've seen you deal with far worse...though that is bad...but you found it, and corrected it.   Success is in the future friend!  Take heart...it's going to be right!

Dave

[sbwhart]

Stew

I applaud your restraint, I'd be seriously pissed off by now. At least you know its going to be right in the end.

On the plus side there's a possibility of another article for ME for you "Buying a second hand loco". Apart from the boiler you've come across most of the things to look for.

Pete

The thought did pass my mind Pete, but I'm mind full that it may be read by the original builder or someone may recognise it, having said that I suppose I've slagged  it off enough on the Forums

I'm keeping my fingers crossed with the boiler but I have got a test certificate for it tested at 180PSI

Nick its defiantly a case of BUYER BEWARE I've been lucky (if you can call it that) I have been able to fix most of the problems so far

There is a very nice running loco at the club for sale for £2000 if it had been on the market last year I would have bought, and was very temped to buy it just to get me on the rails whilst I fixed the Simplex but a club member pointed out if I did that I'd never complete the Simplex as I would have lost the motivation.

Which I guess is true.

Stew

 

[arnoldb]

Good going on the fixes Stew 

I guess there's a reason well-running fully built locos are so expensive 

Kind regards, Arnold

[NickG]

Yeah, there is a massive amount of work in them, £2000 I would say is fairly cheap for a decent 5" gauge. I agree with the guy in the club, you're so close now that buying one would be a bit pointless, I think it'll be much more satisfying for you running this one.

Then you can get back to Mabel!!

[doubletop]

The thought did pass my mind Pete, but I'm mind full that it may be read by the original builder or someone may recognise it, having said that I suppose I've slagged  it off enough on the Forums


Stew

It depends how you go about it. If you were to acknowledge that there is a huge range of skills, experience and levels of equipment out there in our hobby, but regardless of the outcome anybody who has attempted anything has to be applauded. Equally those of us who have done re-refurbishments have set our own standards to work too and we're happy with the results.  The purpose would be an informative piece for anybody contemplating a purchase like this to understand what to look out for and what could be in store for them. We both went into our refurbishments with our eyes open but in your case you've learned a bit more.

Depending what you paid for the loco if your boiler is good you could look at it that you purchased a boiler and got some loco parts with it. One of the guys in our club has had a similar experience to you with a 7.25" Phantom. Amongst a number of other things he had to have the frames re-made fortunately his loco came with a professionally made boiler so that helped him reconcile the situation.

Pete