Author Topic: Single cylinder steam engine  (Read 3733 times)

Offline Coopertje

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Single cylinder steam engine
« on: May 02, 2014, 05:55:41 PM »
Not sure if this is the correct place, if not please let me know.

Bought the engine as shown below one week ago. I am planning to get it back in its original condition, there is one problem though, I have no clue at all what engine this is. It is made from castings, that I am sure of. Does not look like a Stewart set, at least not like what they are selling today. I hope that one of you recognize the engine I have here…. I need some examples since there are some missing parts on this engine….









Thanks in advance for your help!

Jeroen

Offline Roger B

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2014, 07:43:24 PM »
To me that resembles a `German' style toy engine from the 20s or 30s. Any other thoughts?
Best regards

Roger

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2014, 07:59:00 PM »
There are a lot of similarities to this Bing engine though the bearing blocks are different

http://www.historytoy.com/Bing-13676-2-Lying-steam-engine-Vanna

Offline ths

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2014, 09:19:09 PM »
I agree with Roger  and Jason, prewar German toy steam. Yo might try asking on this site http://modelsteam.myfreeforum.org, it's full o toy steam experts.

Hugh.

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2014, 10:11:26 PM »
Thank you so much Roger, Jason and Hugh! It must be a Bing from early 1900. I think with the pictures from the mentioned sites I should be able to construct the missing parts.

First I was planning to remachine and paint it, but an engine this old should be left as it is as much as possible.

Thanks again gents!

Jeroen

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2014, 11:06:22 AM »
Took the engine apart this morning and cleaned the parts a little.



It is really difficult to decide what to do with this engine, sandblast the whole thing and repaint it or try to leave as much as original (if it is original) paint. One of the main-bearings stands has some damage, below a little blurry photo



If I would try to repair by silver soldering new pieces of metal to the damaged parts I will screw up the paint by the silver soldering process. I could try to use loctide instead, but also then the repair will be very clearly visible when keeping the original paint work. Another option is to keep it together with a bold and nut….   :thinking:  don't know what to do, suggestions are more then welcome.

The steam inlet has the same issue, could solder a copper tube inside (think somebody already tried this, was a lot of solder around it). Here I might be able to tread the inlet and tube and screw it together, then I don't have to apply heat to the cladding of the cylinder and damage the paint (what has left of it).



The valve mechanism is quite simple, it will be pressed against the cylinder by means of a spring, that should not be too complicated to replicate.



Restoring such an old engine is something different then building a new one. I am used to force myself to work in close tolerances (+/- 0.01mm), many times do not succeed, but more and more I do. Most of the times I do not need this kind of accuracy but when I do need it at least I have some practice in getting there. In this engine everything has loads and loads of play and the flywheel wobbles all over the place. I have seen some youtube video of this engine and it seems to be original, but sure it feels strange to leave it this way…

Any suggestions, tips and thoughts on how to proceed are welcome.

Jeroen

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2014, 11:12:39 AM »
Heres the video of a more or less similar engine running

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXWuzN-7GEQ" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXWuzN-7GEQ</a>

Jeroen

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2014, 08:45:35 PM »
After some reading on the net and looking at pictures of other Bing engines time to make some parts. Just estimated the dimensions from the pictures I have seen, any kind of dimension plan I could not find, so this is the best option I have.

The cylinder is 12.305mm in diameter. I made a piston of 12.30mm diameter which is a tide but good fit. At least for IC I make my pistons 0.005mm smaller then the cylinders so I can run them without rings. This small undersize makes the piston hang in position when you close the top of the cylinder by hand but drops true when its open. Since I plan the engine to run on air only I figured this would work here too. The width of the piston is 3mm, the stroke is 22mm and the distance between the cylinder ports is 25mm. The shaft is 5mm silver steel, I guess in a real steam engine running on steam this should be stainless steel.



Made the back cover of the cylinder out of brass. Looking at the pictures of the original I cannot see any sign of a gland nut…. So I left it out and just reamed the boring to 5mm.



The cylinder cover is a press fit into the cylinder



I tested it by connecting a tube in which I can blow pressure in with my mouth and operate the valve by hand, the piston is moving nicely in and out without noticeable leakage. Time will tell if it will run with this construction.

For the broken parts repair I went for option 4, use JBWeld. Made some kind of mold with painters tape and filled it up with JBWeld, I am pleased with the result. Now just hope that their claim that it can be machined is true, need to put a M3 tread in it….. Let it cure for some more days before file it in shape and start to drill and tap in it.





Thats all.

Jeroen

Offline Alan Haisley

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2014, 01:13:08 PM »
Jeroen,

The video that you posted certainly appears to have a gland nut. It is either just round or knurled though, no hex flats. What is not apparent is how the cylinder cap is held in place. Do you have other pictures that show that end better?

As beat up as that engine is, I doubt that you will gain anything by trying to preserve the original paint and looks. Why not try to restore it to a like new fit and finish. If more pieces were there and they weren't so worn it might be a different matter.

Alan
Near Raleigh, NC, USA

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2014, 09:11:06 PM »
Hi Alan,

The engine on the video is a bit different then the one I have. If you scroll down on the following page you will see the one I have in its original environment http://modelsteam.myfreeforum.org/Bing_9641_To_redo_or_not_to_redo_that_s_the_question__about70858.html.

I am quite sure that there is no gland nut and its a press fit into the cylinder. I will first see if I can get it running (its my first steam engine  :-\ ) and then decide what to do with it, leave it as it is or make it shiny and new. Thanks for your feedback, its appreciated!

Jeroen

Offline Coopertje

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Re: Single cylinder steam engine
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2014, 06:05:49 PM »
Very little progress made on the engine. Have the spring ready to press the valve against the cylinder. It is made from a sheet band material used for wrapping wooden boxes in transport. The band is first annealed by heating it to orange and let it cool down slowly. Then drilled the holes and filed the outer shape. After bending it I heated it again and quenched it in water.





After installation put air on the inlet and moved the flywheel by hand. The piston moved in and out nicely, I guess that is something positive…. One thing I did noted was that the connection rod to drive the valve is colliding with the bearing stand.



Looking at pictures of similar engines it seems that this is not the original linkage, I have to make a new. Started with the linkage to connect the crank to the piston… and the Boxford came into the picture….

Jeroen