Author Topic: Stuart Major Beam Engine  (Read 34156 times)

Offline Bertie_Bassett

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #60 on: February 14, 2016, 12:10:55 PM »
looks like a good save there with making that ring  :ThumbsUp:

shame there wasn't enough clearance for the bolt heads/nuts though, id have thought they would have allowed enough room when designing the casting to solve that issue.

although if you had gone with through holes and nuts on the underside you could have got away without filling the clearance, its something iv needed to do a lot when bolting machinery and pipework together.  bit of a pain and not really the best way of doing things but it does save having to make alterations with a file/grinder

You can always make bolts with a dimple on the top to look like studs

ill have to remember that! might come in handy one day!
one day ill finish a project before starting another!
suffolk - uk

Offline Steamhead

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #61 on: February 14, 2016, 12:55:42 PM »
Hello Andy, I was away all last week so sorry to be slow responding to your previous question about the bosses on the beam itself.  Yes, they are a problem due to poor positioning of the two halves of the casting box. (Stuarts are aware of this problem).  On the first engine I built I machined around each boss to make them concentric.  I built 1st. one in 2014 , finishing it a few days before the October show.     Interesting problem solve for the bottom flange of the cylinder! I did the PCD as per the drawing and also found the problem with the nuts fouling the bottom 'band'. So I also used 1 size smaller nuts.  I then spotted the side of the 'band' by making an upturned cutter with its shank passing through the flange clearance holes and a cordless drill underneath. This makes a nice neat spotting and takes seconds once you have cutter. I've made a start on governor columns and now need to crack on with the fiddle bits.  On the 1st. engine I made all the bits out of solid and at the moment racking my brains as to how I did it.  Its surprising how quickly one forgets.  I do have a few pics of governor.  I also think the cylinder is best as 'naked'.  I kicked around the idea of more studs in steam chest cylinder but decided I would have to get carried away and do the same elsewhere!  I'll see if I can suss out how to add pics.  Alan

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #62 on: February 14, 2016, 02:05:15 PM »
"make bolts with a dimple on the top"

 :facepalm:

Jo when you come to make a traction engine you will find its very common practice on models to either do like I have or silver solder the nuts to the studs for the reason I have already given. Example a little way down this page. I suppose you will be using carrot bolts :Lol:

Andy I only made those specials and any studs the rest of the fixings came in little plastic bags :ThumbsUp:

Offline Steamhead

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #63 on: February 14, 2016, 03:14:33 PM »


Hello Andy,  I dont know if this will work but here is an attempt to add pics. of governor.  Alan


Online Jo

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #64 on: February 14, 2016, 03:37:17 PM »
Jo when you come to make a traction engine you will find its very common practice on models to either do like I have or silver solder the nuts to the studs for the reason I have already given. Example a little way down this page. I suppose you will be using carrot bolts :Lol:


Dimples the standard practise is to use Loctite on your nuts if you want to do fake studs and nuts, that way people can admire your perfect every time 1 1/2 threads. And you will also find that the judges at the show don't turn their noses up at your model and advise you that it is best you keep it in a dark corner with the lights off  ::).

I have no idea what you mean by carrot bolts, it is not something I have come across: Can you give me the BS number for them.

Jo
Enjoyment is more important than achievement.

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #65 on: February 14, 2016, 04:18:50 PM »
Hello Bertie, yes indeed for a model that has been in production for so long it is ridiculous that there are any problems at all. We read complaints about errors with many models and their drawings but I have yet to see a response from the manufacturers or whoever sells the kits. In common with several other beam engine builders I made a box to support the engine. Nuts or bolts that were holding down the cylinder would fall off inside when undone. It would be a pain having to take the cast iron base off the box to reach the underside to be able to fit and tighten bolts passing through clearance holes.
Like you I like Jason's bolts with a dimple on the top.
Andy
Here's a picture of my wooden box base and the circular cylinder mounting pad is at the right hand end of the base .
S Major 0268 by Andy, on Flickr

Offline Stuart

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #66 on: February 14, 2016, 04:45:28 PM »
Jo


Sorry to the OP but the question was asked

About half way down is your salvation.
 http://beamishtransportonline.co.uk/2015/01/ti-news-week-1-2015/


Stuart
My aim is for a accurate part with a good finish

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #67 on: February 14, 2016, 04:52:12 PM »

I have no idea what you mean by carrot bolts, it is not something I have come across: Can you give me the BS number for them.

Jo

And I thought you were going to build your BB1 to Fowler drawings. I thought everyone interested in traction engines knew that carrot bolts are what were used to fix the cylinders to the boiler :-\

Loctite is fine on small stationary engines etc but on a working TE particularly one with a steel boiler buy the time you have a bit of corrosion, sealer like Foliac or Stag, heat, etc its more likely that the loctite will give way when you try to undo things. This will leave the studs stuck in the barrel and you only have a very short length of thread to try and get hold of them by.

J

EDIT Stuart beat me to it while I was trying to get my scanner to work

Online Jo

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #68 on: February 14, 2016, 04:57:34 PM »
My copper BB1 boiler was designed and built by Southern Boiler Works: The cylinder will be mounted as per Paul's detailed instructions.

Jo
Enjoyment is more important than achievement.

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #69 on: February 14, 2016, 05:03:49 PM »
Hello Alan,
Your work on the governor casting and the governor bell crank is most impressive, I will have to pick your brains on that bell crank.
It is reassuring to hear that the beam casting was at fault, have you taken this up with Stuarts yourself?
When I marked out the beam for my engine I had to check the measurements several times to satisfy myself that I had got it right. A list of known errors included in the kit wouldn't go amiss. My kit included an errata sheet but most of the details about the crank were illegible......
Stuart Major Errata Sheet 008 by Andy, on Flickr

How about this, now that I have the cylinder bolted down to the base I drilled the 2BA clearance hole down through the entablature into which the 'entablature stay' is fitted. I wanted to see how the lug on the top of the cylinder lined up so I passed a 3/16" rod though the entablature and was a bit disappointed to find that it wasn't resting right in the middle of the lug, it's about 1/16" out. I have checked everything and the cylinder is perfectly in line with the centreline of the engine and the face of the steam port face is at right angles to the centreline. I realise cylinder could be out by a few degrees on it's axis but it's too late now and my priority was to get the steam port face at a right angle to the centreline. Perhaps I carried out some of my tasks in the wrong order. Anyway when I make the entablature stay I can subtly adapt it to the misalignment.

How did yours line up Alan?

Andy

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #70 on: February 14, 2016, 05:49:16 PM »
I carried on working on the valve chest and its cover today.
A purely cosmetic rebate was milled around the edge of the valve chest.

S Major 366 by Andy, on Flickr

Then holding the cover casting in a four jaw chuck I machined both faces and drilled the steam inlet through the centre of the boss.

S Major 367 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 369 by Andy, on Flickr

I stuck to the plans and settled for six studs to mount the valve chest and cover on to the cylinder thinking what if I broke a tap in one of the extra unnecessary holes?
The pictures seem to have come out with a soft focus, almost romantic !  I must check the settings on my Microsoft Lumia phone camera that I used.

S Major 370 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 373 by Andy, on Flickr

S Major 374 by Andy, on Flickr

To be continued.........

Andy
 

Offline Steamhead

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #71 on: February 14, 2016, 08:49:20 PM »
Andy,  Thank you for your kind comment. I dont think the rebate around the steam chest is just cosmetic...I think it is to allow the 2 valve rods to be closer to the chest and therefore to each other, hence keep the crosshead as short as possible.  I guess this would have been important on full size practice,  When you fit said rods you will see function of rebate. The errata sheets are unreadable but I will look for my digital copy for you.  The important dimension on the crank is the one between centres and which is correct.  Re. entablature stay.  Its a bit late now but its necessary to establish the lug centre when setting up the valve face for machining. I did'nt think about it either but was lucky enough to be pretty much there.  You could enlarge entablature hole a little to gain some leeway and maybe slim down the fat side of the lug and also place the hole slightly off centre.....if the stay is a degree out of vertical it will not be obvious....every little helps as they say. I don't wish to be 'whatever' but maybe I should come clean and say I am actually building a pair of engines.  I have also mounted my engines on a 'box' I've seen one on stilts and did not like it at all.  Tomorrow I am going to make the flyballs.  Also,..... we have only just met and I prefer not to see romantic pics just yet!.

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #72 on: February 14, 2016, 09:49:30 PM »
Hi Alan, we've just returned from our Valentines day meal out which has bought me extra time in my garage for the week ahead.
I machined the crank back in August 2014 such is my rate of progress with this engine so thanks for the offer of your digital version but it's not necessary. I'll leave my crank as it is - plain  without the embellishments which I assume were detailled on the errata sheet. I contacted Stuart about the illegible errata sheet and was told they couldn't improve on it because the original had been lost.
Now I understand that the rebate around the valve chest is clearly functional following your comments and studying pictures of completed Majors, thanks.

Making a pair of Majors, will they be linked and share a common base?

Reckon I'll alter the soft focus setting of my mobile phone camera not wishing to appear too forward.
Andy

Offline zeeprogrammer

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #73 on: February 14, 2016, 10:26:23 PM »
"make bolts with a dimple on the top"

 :Lol: I thought I was bad with 'thingies'.

I haven't posted much here but have been reading and enjoying.

Looking forward to seeing it run.
Carl (aka Zee) Will sometimes respond to 'hey' but never 'hey you'.
"To work. To work."
Zee-Another Thread Trasher.

Offline Chipmaster

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Re: Stuart Major Beam Engine
« Reply #74 on: February 14, 2016, 10:39:52 PM »
Hello Carl,
Pleased to hear you'e following this build log.
Don't know what to say about thingies other than just hang on in there.  :ThumbsUp:
Andy