Author Topic: Radiator Ramblings  (Read 5740 times)

Offline Mosey

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Radiator Ramblings
« on: March 19, 2013, 01:02:18 PM »
I made most of the radiator for my Silver Bullet build. Completed the top and bottom tank shells, the vertical water tubes, and the fins. Soldered everything together.

But, it is unsatisfactory from the esthetic aspects. It will hold water and function OK, but the fins are all wobbly and wavy, so it looks amateurish and crude. No good.

I worked from parts purchased as a kit, and here are the problems: the punched holes in the fins and the tanks do not fit either the spacing or the shapes of the tubes. So I machined all of the holes (102 of them), but they still don't fit. It is not possible to mill a hole that matches the shape of the tubes without CNC.

The tubes are squashed brass tubes into an oval, and they are just not uniform or regular enough to fit the holes.
So, please help.
How do you get a set of fins, tanks, and tubes that all fit together nicely?
I am going to start over from scratch.
How do you make a radiator that is crisp, neat, and precise, with that beautiful shiny polished finish I see on Steve's or Georges engines?

osey :hammerbash: :zap: :Mad: :cussing:

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2013, 01:21:27 PM »
Mosey, sorry to hear of the difficulties. This is not something I have ever tried (yet at least) but a couple of thoughts based on your post... 

Do the tubes have to be oval?  If they could be round that would make for more consistency and easier drilling of the fins too. I'm not sure how much the tubes would show after assembly through the fins so it may rob too much from the aesthetics.

I will look forward to replies from our experts in this area since I have seen examples of the beautiful ones that you refer to.

Bill

Online steamer

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2013, 02:02:03 PM »
Check Steve Hucks Little Demon build.....he has plans for a radiator to fit it that is well done.   

Dave
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Offline Mosey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2013, 02:04:10 PM »
Thanks, Bill for your suggestions. I am looking at K&S brass sections to see what can be had.
Here is a view of the disaster, please don't laugh.


Offline Mosey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2013, 02:05:04 PM »
Check Steve Hucks Little Demon build.....he has plans for a radiator to fit it that is well done.   

Dave
Thanks Dave. Everything Steve does is well done. Of course it still has the sticky flux all over it.
Mosey

Offline vcutajar

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2013, 02:36:19 PM »
Sorry Mosey to hear of your radiator problem.  I have never built one so cannot really help but have a look at this site and it might give you an idea how to do the core.

http://www.jerry-howell.com/V-4Radiator.html

Quote
I worked from parts purchased as a kit

Could you tell me from where you got the radiator kit?

Vince

Offline Jasonb

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2013, 03:14:27 PM »
Steve's method is described on HMEM

Offline gbritnell

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2013, 04:03:32 PM »
Hi Mosey,
Sorry to hear about your radiator problems. As was stated above Steve has a great way of building a rad which utilizes round tubing.
The first radiator that I ever built was for my 4 cylinder OHV engine. Being new to the game I kind of replicated a full sized rad construction. Similar to Steve's rad I made the top and bottom headers and drilled them for brass hobby tubing. For the fins I took brass shim stock, cut it in strips and tinned them with 50/50 solder. I then made up a fixture board with small nails evenly spaced onto which I could weave the brass strips forming an accordian shape. With everything assembled and fluxed I slowly brought it up to melting temperature until I could see the solder start to flow from the fins to the tubes. At the same time I soldered the top and bottom tanks in place.
Talent unshared is talent wasted.

Offline gbritnell

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2013, 04:08:30 PM »
My next engine was the 302 and knowing that I would need much more cooling capacity I didn't want to make another radiator like the one on the 4 cylinder so I tried using an automotive heater core. The biggest problem was trying to clean and solder to it. They come painted and it's hard to get them clean enough and when I would heat it to try and solder the tanks to it some other area would come unsoldered. I eventually went to a radiator shop and took the engine with me to explain what I was after. They told me I could get practically any sized core I wanted and that it would be cut to length. I went that way and made the top and bottom tanks and soldered them onto the core headers.
Talent unshared is talent wasted.

Offline Mosey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2013, 04:09:37 PM »
Steve's method is described on HMEM
Wonderful!!
And he makes it sound so easy.

And thank you Goerge!!

Well, now I know what to do, so off to the shed I go. Hi hoh, hi hoh, it's off to the shed I go!
Mosey

Offline gbritnell

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2013, 04:14:22 PM »
The last radiator I made was for the Holt. I was at a show and saw one of Jerry Howell's engines and admired how nice the radiator looked so I bought a set of his plans that included the rad drawing. To build his type requires some type of dial indicator or digital readout on your lathe carriage. To make the fins/tubes you use square brass stock and first drill through for the desired length. Next you chuck one end in the 4 jaw chuck and support the outer end with a live center in the previously drilled hole. Now you take a cut-off tool and make successive plunges evenly spaced along the length of the stock. Once finished you make the top and bottom headers and tanks and solder  the whole thing together, tubes to headers and then tanks to headers.
gbritnell
Talent unshared is talent wasted.

Offline gbritnell

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2013, 04:19:29 PM »
Another way you might want to look at is from Ebay. Under the electronics section do a search for radiators. Here's a link to one but there are many styles and prices.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/EK-Waterblocks-CoolStream-RAD-XT-120-1-x-120mm-Single-120mm-Copper-Radiator-/380575957615?pt=US_Water_Cooling&hash=item589c18426f
I recently purchased one and it's beautiful and very well made. The only thing one has to do is make the filler spout and possibly a bottom supply tube. These could be epoxied on as the rads are aluminum.
gbritnell
Talent unshared is talent wasted.

Online steamer

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2013, 04:29:23 PM »
Nice post George!   I'll keep that in mind for the Wallaby!....

Dave
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Damned ijjit!

Offline b.lindsey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2013, 05:36:54 PM »
George, those are real beauties as are Steve's. I particularly like the technique of the Holt one, using the finned square tubing, much less solderingi required which makes for a neat assembly. Did you add any channels to the sides or leave it as pictured?

Bill

Offline Mosey

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2013, 07:16:12 PM »
Well, now we have a definitive instruction booklet on making radiators from Steve and George, terrific, thanks guys.
I shall comb my fins into the best straightest arrangement I can, and then paint them black, leaving the tanks bright.
Then start a new radiator for the future using  the Huck method, almost.
Mosey

Getting closer. :stir: :Love:

Offline gbritnell

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Re: Radiator Ramblings
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2013, 09:52:57 PM »
Hi Bill,
I just left it as pictured although adding more volume would have helped. These little engines get hotter than what you'd believe. I'm going to check the capacity of the new radiator I bought against the one on the 4 cylinder engine. If it has substantially more I'm going to switch them out. I'd hate to loose the shiny brass radiator but if it helps the engine run cooler then that's the best way to go.
gbritnell
Talent unshared is talent wasted.